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Sura 4:82 A Challenge
for Islam. Posts 742. Views 6597.
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Kayyam
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Yes the Torah is the only source for some things - which is exactly the problem. Historians never rely on just one source. I do not discount it as suggestive of historical possibilities. But it is far from definitive. Why? Because it is a source based on centuries of oral transmission - i.e. legends, folktales. You mentioned archeological evidence. I recently saw a documentary on the National Geographic channel which explained there is not a shred of archeological evidence for the exodus. Kayyam
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Kayyam
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Of the four excerpts that you listed, this one is the closest to what you have said: 067.005 Have you ever heard of poetic license? Stars are pretty hot - according to most physicists. So it probably means that the "doom of flame" will be rather unpleasant. Kayyam
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hafsa
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Answer
to Starjade,: So when you say �So then this is a proven error that exists in the Koran�, there is nothing for your this. And your reference is still Old Testament in which you know there are various changes made. Let me be slightly naughty here and catch you in your own words.. Starjade says; I would agree with you. But this is what it says in the Old Testament as recorded by those Jews who lived in those Times. I would have said Aaron would have known better. The only Word of Allah Ta�ala which He took to Himself to guard against evil is of course �Quraan� in which you have not given me a single real discrepancy. Tell you what, put your obsession aside and relax your mind for a while about religions. Why not? Afterall we are all going to die and the very moment we�ll know the truth. So do not mind. What will you loose if nobody takes you as a prophet. A lofty rank is lofty no matter what others think. But now suppose if you are throwing wrong allegations on Allah (or call Him God) and many sacred people including prophets whom He loves, you will loose. The way you can prove it to yourself which side you are is that if you really wrong, you will not want to die.
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Starjade
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Hafsa you said: 3. Regarding Yusuf Ali , and Pickthall and Kasimirski and others:These people are normal people who have their own explanation. But of course they understand Quran better than you. In any case where does the fault go to the noble Quran?
Starjade says: The Koran claimed it was the Samaritans who forged the Golden Calf then realizing that could not be they tried to imply that it was someone called Samari who forged the golden calf.
The fault in the Koran is that it is inventing who forged the golden calf and making the mistake of presenting it as if facts when the Koran itself is unsure of its data. The Old Testament is sure for it says it was Aaron the brother of Moses who forged the golden calf. The blasphemous Hebrews were then forced to eat its dust and then as the living Gods anger blazed he ordered Moses to march them around in the desert until all of that generations died. Only their children could travel on to the promised land.
Hafsa you said: Who can eat gold and survive.does Exodus give further evidence that they immediately died or will you or your partners need to ammend that?
Starjade says: I have no partners. As a younger man I was being trained as a working Jeweler making and repairing Jewelry with Hyman Bros and Leonard Dews here in Blackpool whiles I was raised up in the midst of thy brethren. You can easily eat Gold and survive. Especially Gold dust. Do not forget what was said:
Exodus 32:2 And Aaron said unto them, Break off the golden earrings, which are in the ears of your wives, of your sons, and of your daughters, and bring them unto me. Exodus 32:3 And all the people brake off the golden earrings which were in their ears, and brought them unto Aaron. Exodus 32:4 And he received them at their hand, and fashioned it with a graving tool, after he had made it a molten calf: and they said, These be thy gods, O Israel, which brought thee up out of the land of Egypt.
Starjade says: So then the Golden calf was not a massive statue was it. Why I have seen Indian Fakirs eat all sorts of things. Why do you not go and read that Exodus. I did give you chapter and verse for easy reference. All Libraries will have a copy someplace of the Old Testament and it is also on the Internet. But then why wait whiles the Lord King Starjade doth educate you.
Exodus 32:19 And it came to pass, as soon as he came nigh unto the camp, that he saw the calf, and the dancing: and Moses' anger waxed hot, and he cast the tables out of his hands, and brake them beneath the mount. Exodus 32:20 And he took the calf which they had made, and burnt it in the fire, and ground it to powder, and strawed it upon the water, and made the children of Israel drink of it. Exodus 32:21 And Moses said unto Aaron, What did this people unto thee, that thou hast brought so great a sin upon them? Exodus 32:22 And Aaron said, Let not the anger of my lord wax hot: thou knowest the people, that they are set on mischief. Exodus 32:23 For they said unto me, Make us gods, which shall go before us: for as for this Moses, the man that brought us up out of the land of Egypt, we wot not what is become of him. Exodus 32:24 And I said unto them, Whosoever hath any gold, let them break it off. So they gave it me: then I cast it into the fire, and there came out this calf. Exodus 32:25 And when Moses saw that the people were naked; (for Aaron had made them naked unto their shame among their enemies:) Exodus 32:26 Then Moses stood in the gate of the camp, and said, Who is on the LORD's side? let him come unto me. And all the sons of Levi gathered themselves together unto him. Exodus 32:27 And he said unto them, Thus saith the LORD God of Israel, Put every man his sword by his side, and go in and out from gate to gate throughout the camp, and slay every man his brother, and every man his companion, and every man his neighbour. Exodus 32:28 And the children of Levi did according to the word of Moses: and there fell of the people that day about three thousand men.
Starjade says; Does that answer your question. That is how many died. Put to death by the sword.
Hafsa you said: 5.Regarding the sun set in murky water, you have been explained it before by several people but you insist to assume the way you want. As of the explanations of few people you mentioned, one has to check their credibility of as well as the truth in the reference. It is impossible the way you�re putting it at least. Islam is the only religion, which is accurate in science to date. Regarding ayat 38 of Sura Yaseen (36), we all know that it is referring to the separate orbits of sun and moon, that they cannot run into each other�s paths.
Starjade says: The Sun does not set in a pool of muddy water no matter who speaks on that subject. When you speak of the Koran being accurate in science and data it is clear you are just begging for a list of unscientific data that exists in the Koran. I do have lists of such things you can be sure. I have even mentioned a few already including the claim by Muhammad that the sun sets in a pool of muddy water.
What about the claim by Muhammad that a Devil lives up the noses of all Muslims. Muhammad said they must snort up water several times a day and then snort out that Devil from the nostril. Do you say that is scientifically sound. Do you believe that a Devil lives up your nose?
In suras 2:65-66 and 7:163-167, Allah turns certain fishing people who break the Jewish sabbath into apes for their disobedience. Do you believe that is scientifically possible. ?
It is common knowledge, as scientists teach, that thunder is a sound caused by the impact between electrical charges found in the clouds. Yet Muhammad, the self appointed prophet of Muslims, has a different opinion in this matter. He claims that the thunder and the lightning are two of God�s angels�exactly like Gabriel!
In the Qur�an there is a chapter under the title of "Thunder" in which it is recorded that the thunder praises God. We might think that it does not mean that literally because thunder is not a living being�although, spiritually speaking, all of nature glorifies God. The expounders of the Qur�an and its chief scholars, however, insist that Muhammad said that the thunder is an angel exactly like the angel Gabriel. In his commentary (p. 329), the Baydawi comments on verse 13 of chapter of the Thunder, "Ibn �Abbas asked the apostle of God about the thunder. He told him, �It is an angel who is in charge of the cloud, who (carries) with him swindles of fire by which he drives the clouds."�
In the commentary of the Jalalan (p. 206), we read about this verse: "The thunder is an angel in charge of the clouds to drive them." Not only ibn �Abbas asked Muhammad about the essence of the thunder, but the Jews did too. In the book, "al-Itqan" by Suyuti (part 4, p. 230), we read the following dialogue:
"On the authority of Ibn �Abbas, he said the Jews came to the prophet (peace be upon him) and said, �Tell us about the thunder. What is it?� He told them: �It is one of God�s angels in charge of the clouds. He carries in his hand a swindle of fire by which he pricks the clouds to drive them to where God has ordered them.� They said to him, �What is this sound that we hear?� He said: �(It is) his voice (The angel�s voice)."�
The same incident�the question of the Jews and Muhammad�s answer are mentioned by most scholars. Refer, for instance, to al-Sahih al-Musnad Min Asbab Nuzul al-Ayat (stories related to the verses of Qur�an, p. 11) and al-Kash-shaf by the Imam al-Kamakhshari (part 2, pp. 518, 519). He reiterates the same story and the same words of Muhammad. Thus, the incident is in vogue among all Muslim scholars, and the story and the dialogue between Muhammad and the Jews is well-known.
We have mentioned what the Baydawi, Jalalan, Zamakhshari, Suyuti, and ibn �Abbas have said. We do not know (among the ancient scholars) any who are more famous than these. Concerning lighting, Muhammad affirms that it is an angel like the thunder and like Gabriel and Michael. On page 230 of the above references, Suyuti alludes to it. Also on page 68 of part 4 of the "Itqan", the Suyuti records for us the names of the angels, which are: "Gabriel, Michael, Harut, Marut, the Thunder and the Lightning (He said) that the lightning has four faces."
The Suyuti listed all these under the sub-title, "The names of God�s Angels". He also indicated that Muhammad said that the lightning is the tail end of an angel whose name is Rafael (refer to part 4, p. 230 of the Itqan).(Tee hee hee)
Starjade says; These things that exist in the Koran and are not scientific facts. No Muslim yet has dared a reply to the statements Muhammad has made about Thunder and lightening.
Hafsa you said: At one end you think our Prophet Mohammad (Sal Allaho Alahe Wassalam) got trained by a Christian for Quran. On the other hand, he didn�t even know Jesus� name?
Starjade says: Muhammad did not write the Koran did he. Others wrote the Koran in the name of Muhammad and so clearly it would be their error in the Koran. Let us not blame Muhammad for everything for others were also at fault. And you have not shown any evidence that Muhammad is a genuine Prophet. On the contrary I have shown you evidence to the other wise.
Hafsa you said: People(friends and foes alike) around Prophet Mohammad (s.a.w) were experts of Arabic, and admired Quran for its obviously incontestable style.
Starjade says: I think you may have noticed I have contested that. There are many foreign words or phrases which are employed in the Qur'an, some of which have no Arabic equivalent, and others which do.
Arthur Jeffrey, in his book Foreign Vocabulary of the [Koran], has gathered some 300 pages dealing with foreign words in the Qur'an, many of which must have been used in pre-Qur'anic Arabic, but quite a number also which must have been used little or not at all before they were included in the Qur'an. One must wonder why these words were borrowed, as it puts doubt on whether "Allah's language" is sufficient enough to explain and reveal all that Allah had intended. Some of the foreign words include:
a. Pharaoh: an Egyptian word which means king or potentate, which is repeated in the Qur'an 84 times.
b. Adam and Eden: Accadian words which are repeated 24 times. A more correct term for "Adam" in Arabic would be basharan or insan, meaning "mankind." "Eden" would be the word janna in Arabic, which means "garden."
c. Abraham (sometimes recorded as Ibrahim): comes from the Assyrian language. The correct Arabic equivalent would be Abu Raheem.
d. Persian words i. Haroot and Maroot are Persian names for angels. ii. Sirat meaning "the path" has the Arabic equivalent, Altareeq. iii. Hoor meaning "disciple" has the Arabic equivalent, Tilmeeth. iv. Jinn meaning "good or evil demons" has the Arabic equivalent, Ruh. v.Firdaus meaning "the highest or seventh heaven" has the Arabic equivalent, Jannah.
e. Syriac words: Taboot, Taghouth, Zakat, Malakout are all Syriac words which have been borrowed and included in the 'Arabic' Qur'an. f. Hebrew words: Heber, Sakinah, Maoon, Taurat, Jehannim, Tufan (deluge) are all Hebrew words which have been borrowed and included in the 'Arabic' Qur'an.
g. Greek words: Injil, which means "gospel" was borrowed, yet it has the Arabic equivalent, Bisharah. Iblis is not Arabic, but a corruption of the Greek word Diabolos.
h. Christian Aramaic: Qiyama is the Aramaic word for resurrection. i. Christian Ethiopic: Malak (2:33) is the Ethiopic word for angel.
Starjade concludes: So that matter is done and dusted. It seems your Islamic propaganda has some flaws in it that you are not mentioning or just did not know. You know now though don�t you. Speaking with Starjade the much loved Doomsday Prophet is most certainly an education.
Hafsa you said: Really? Hinduism is even older and even in their old scripture this punishment is mentioned (refer their Vishnusutra Ch.5,verse 49).
Starjade says: (sigh) people always seem to go on about Hinduism a religion I have never bothered to give much study. After all they worship many false Gods so what could they know. Besides in their religion they do not have anyone claiming they are that Deuteronomy Ch 18 v 15/18 Prophet that God promised Moses he would raise up do they. If you hear them ever make such a claim let me know and I will go pay them a visitation. And is that form of Islamic punishment you show no proof to in the Old Testament or just in the Koran and obscure false god worshipping religions like Hinduism. Right then so your comment on them is irrelevant.
I bet those Hindu�s would have liked the story of the worship of the Golden Calf (chuckle)
Hafsa you said: If Pharoah had turned so kind as to let them go, why did they have to leave at all?
Starjade says: I meant the Pharaoh let the Hebrews go because he knew the living God of Moses was God. The Egyptians were into very powerful Magik in those days. They tried everything to defeat the power of the living God and failed. In the End even the Pharaoh became a believer and knew his power was not good enough to stand against the living God of Moses. So he let the Hebrews go having no real choice in the matter. It is then illogical for that same Pharaoh to attack or threaten those magicians when he knew the whole power of Egypt could not stand against the living God of Abraham.
Hafsa you said: However the writer was so benevolent to write revolutionary poetic essays containing subjects that must have required immense scientific, historic, psychic research, without any error consistently for some 23 years and provide it to another man secretly for him to act as a prophet. What a man his idol must be! Why was he never caught in open desserts surrounded by people?
Starjade says: Islamic propaganda and idolization is a shallow form of defense. All idolizers proclaim all sorts for their idols. Some to this day say Elvis is still alive and well. Glorifying someone and inventing stories about their idols is a common thing for idols to do. And do not pretend that there are no errors in the Koran for I have already established many. You are just going for that paddle in denial. Clearly they did not research much. And what do you change the Islamic brag now that the words of the Koran came from the mouth of Muhammad and the (cough) angel Gabriel. You offer a weak argument.
Hafsa you said: Proves how true your interpretation of this verse is!
Starjade says: I do not make interpretations. The law of Deuteronomy Ch 19 v 15 is a law that determines matters of the truth. I have had Islamic and Christian experts trying to dispute those matters of the law of Deuteronomy Ch 19 v 15 and they all failed to dispute the matter. It is a law brought down by Moses from the living God himself. You do recall who Moses is don�t you.? And who the living God of Moses is don�t you. The law of Deuteronomy is self explanatory.
Of course as you give worship to a pagan moon god Hubal al�ilah then you will have only heard of the living God of Moses. The living God of Moses is the living God. I am a Prophet who does have a provable connection to the living God. That is why I can challenge the whole of Islam bites the Dust. I also challenged the Christians and they also bit the Dust. I am not a novice.
Hafsa you have said: You have not given a single discrepancy, and just don�t realize. sure u know the meaning of this word?
Starjade says: Don�t you feel shame to feed such a lie when others can read these words for themselves. There is no hiding place for you. And other people do take notes on the things that I say.
Hafsa you said; 13. regarding Abraha's army:
Hafsa you said: Why would I need to wish, am I claiming prophecy. I�m telling you from history that the enemies of our Prophet had also observed for a fact. What reference of history are you taking on this? Hafsa you said: 14.Sura 2:249: When Talut set forth with the armies, he said: "(Allah) will test you at the stream: if any drinks of its water, He goes not with my army: Only those who taste not of it go with me: A mere sip out of the hand is excused." but they all drank of it, except a few. When they crossed the river,- He and the faithful ones with him,- they said: "This day We cannot cope with Jaloot (Goliath) and his forces." but those who were convinced that they must meet Allah, said: "How oft, by Allah.s will, Hath a small force vanquished a big one? Allah is with those who steadfastly persevere."
Starjade says: This is what I actually said:
Starjade says: This is what you actually said:
Starjade says: Wishful thinking on your part. That the pagan moon god Hubal al�ilah had any power to send birds carrying bricks to drop on their enemies.
History has another view. They withdrew because they had small pox. Now me as a wonderful warring tactician I would have sent the infected on to infect the enemy. But they retreated because of smallpox. No birds were sent by Allah for the Allah of those Times was and is the pagan moon god Hubal al�ilah. Not the living God of Abraham. And what you think a pagan moon god has power to sent birds to collect bricks and drop them on people. Don�t you think that is a tad daft. Why did they not just rub the magic lamp and have the Genie woosh them away. You offer no argument but even verify that outbreak of smallpox. Don�t you have history books. Or do you just gladly accept anything someone puts into the Koran.
Hafsa you claim: I remind you that everything in your Exodus is not binding on us. You have not given a single discrepancy, and just don�t realize. Sure u know the meaning of this word?
Starjade says: Of course you are the worshippers of the pagan moon god Hubal al�ilah so why should I be surprised that you dare to say that. I have given lists of errors and discrepancies that exist in the Koran and I note you avoid them. The Old Testament Exodus is binding two major religions. Judaism. And Christianity and of course Islam is a pagan moon worshipping thing so you cannot truly be considered to be a religion.
Yet for as long as Muhammad claims he is that Deuteronomy Ch 18 v 15/18 prophet that god promised Moses he would raise up and as long as he uses the Deuteronomy Prophecies of the living God and of Moses and of Isaiah and as long as Muslims use Old Testament quotes then that Exodus of the Old Testament is binding to you.
How laughable for Muslims to brag Old and New Testament text in the much erred Koran and then shirk away when the original manuscripts expose deceptions in the Koran. You are becoming a shirker hahaha I did warn you all in the beginnings. I am formidable. Your own Imams are afraid of my Revelations. Clearly these matters are beyond you so go tap any Imam on his shoulder and let him know how powerless islam is against the Doomsday prophet Starjade. What are you going to do on a more public level when the Christians and Muslims are all listening in. Especially in today�s political climate. Denial is futile.
Islam claims that Allah is the same God who was revealed in the Bible. . . . then if the Bible and the Qur'an have differing views of God, then Islam's claim is false. Don't forget that Muhammad claimed in Suras 2:87, 29:46, 32:23, 5:44, 6:154, 6:155 that Allah confirmed the Torah (Taurat) and Christian Gospel (Injeel) (Sura 2:87, 5:46, 5:68, 29:46 and 43:63). So, if the Torah and Gospel are correct, all the errors in the Qur'an shown make the Qur'an false. Of course the Sura 4:82 does settle that dispute. And I have established that the New Testament is fraudulent using Deuteronomy law. A law brought down by Moses from the living God himself.
Starjade says: To see the confliction yes. After all I have staggered you with errors in the Koran that you clearly are now avoiding. So lets see those other errors I mention exist in the Koran as well. You know you prefer your own wordings.
Hafsa you said: if it does conflict with Exodus, Quran will be the accurate and valid reference unlike your desire. now let me illustrate Aayat 12 of Sura 46 alongwith its previous Aayaat as I quoted last time are referring to the Prophet Mohammad (s.a.w) and the Book revealed on to him.
Starjade says: So these many errors in the Koran which are proven by the Sura 4:82 to establish that the Koran is not correct just flew past your shirky head did they. There was no book revealed to Muhammad and even the angel Gabriel is a fraud. I did give accounts of those things. So you his the Sura because there was a confliction. Shall I go print the missing Suras here myself. You Muslims have been used to speaking with softies. But now you face the Doomsday Prophet Starjade.
Hafsa you said: When Kafirs denied the Prophet Mohammad and the Book and called it magic (ayt 7), or someone has written it (Quran) for him (8), Allah tells him (Mohammad s.a.w) to say that if I (Mohammad) write it (Quran) (instead of it being from God) you people will not be able to save me from Him i.e. if I commit such a big crime as to say something on His behalf falsefully, there will be noone to save me. Allah is the witness between you and me(Mohammad) (as to who is lying about Quran)(8).
Starjade says: Whiles you make other Koranic quotes I say Sura 4:82. Then show many errors and discrepancies that exist in the Koran. Take the matter of the claims of Jesus as an example of which you are shirking. Now as many errors and discrepancies exist in the Koran then the Koran itself admits that it does not come from God. That fact being established blows out all the claims of Muhammad who insisted he had a visitation from (cough) an angel Gabriel who had previously appeared 1000 years before to give authenticity to Jesus who in later life claimed he was that Deuteronomy Ch 18 v 15/18 Prophet that God promised Moses he would raise up. Rather odd don�t you realize.
These serious errors found in the Koran show that the word of the Koran and Muhammad cannot be trusted at all. Islamic history states that the Koran was writ long after Muhammad had died and so clearly it was writ by another person. Can I ask how old are you.
Hafsa you said: Ayat 9 �Say: I am no new thing among the messengers (of Allah), nor know I what will be done with me or with you. I do but follow that which is inspired in me, and I am but a plain warner.� Is in the same context, as it is by Allah who is telling Mohammad to say this to those not realizing him being a messenger of Allah
Starjade says: Allah is the pagan moon god Hubal al�ilah which is not the living God of Abraham. Were you actually present when this Allah was said to say these things or are you just quoting the claim as well all already know from what some other writer is claiming. So then there are no witnesses there are only the claims of some writer telling you those things which is hearsay. And false Prophets are nothing new. There are many who come along pretending they can speak in Gods name. Even the writers of the Koran.
Hafsa you said: In Ayat 10 Allah contines to tell Mohammad to show to the disbelievers that from among the jews believed in Mohammad and Quran (not all, the �min� in Arabic is for �from�, it is mostly taken for a scholar of Jews named Abdullah bin Salam who accepted Mohammad on seeing him right away. He testified that this is a Prophet we expected in this region and will be given a Book.) so why do you not believe out of your (false) pride as you were not even informed by any means
Starjade says: The unsubstantiated claims and opinions of some blasphemous grunt Jews are worthless. Those blasphemous people also forged a Golden Calf and believed in Jesus. The Sura 4:82 of the Koran itself is what establishes right here that the claims of Muhammad are not true. The testimonies of one man are not acceptable as being true by Deuteronomy law Ch 19 v 15 and those laws bind all Jews and so what fear of death was that blasphemous jew living under. To have some other writer make such a claim. Sounds like just more Islamic propaganda.
The Sura 4:82 already admits the Koran does not come from God which proves already right here and now that Muhammad was not who he claimed himself to being no matter what comments any writer makes.
Hafsa you said: In Ayat 11, Allah demonstrates why those who were powerful resisted Iman. It hurt their pride to see that these poor and less eminent people accepted Islam. They said, had there been some good in this (message, Quran), it would have first been accepted by us.(since we get the best of this world, we should be those to get it for religion.). since their claim was based on pride, they did not get guidance from this (Divine message Quran). Instead they blamed it to be a lie that was coming from previous scriptures.
Starjade says; The Islamic law that I have invoked in the beginnings would have forced even Muhammad to convert. And who are the they that you speak about. Where are they and their witness testimonies. All you show is a claim by some writer is that the writer claims such people exist so believe in what he writes. Yet the Sura 4:82 states if errors exist in the Koran then the Koran does not come from God so all those claims are false and nothing more than deceptions. Of course the words of the Koran are not words of the Old Testament or even the New. The Koran stole the stories of the Old and New Testament and was re wrote the tales only this Time using Ishmael and his descendants as the main topic of the Story. Or do you now forget that there is no Angel Gabriel and Gabriel originated in a Dream that Daniel had whiles in a deep sleep. That is another mistake in the Koran that no Muslim can escape from.
Hafsa you said; Ayat 12:�When before it there was the Scripture of Moses, an example and a mercy; and this is a confirming Scripture in the Arabic language, that it may warn those who do wrong and bring good tidings for the righteous.� You know the word �was� always refers to something which had an effect in past. While for combined present and future the Arabic uses verb �Mudhara� and in English the translation is �is� while referring to the validity of Quran. That is accordingly the Quran is and will be the valid reference. Just like the �Scripture of Moses� WAS a reference in PAST.
Starjade says�; Oh we can all see the writers of the Koran were using the Old and New Testaments as references at least for the main stories. But the writers changed the text when they wrote down the words of the Koran. Including of course most foolishly the New Testament and that was a very big 11 Chapters of the Koran mistake for every Christian knows the Prophet that Jesus has claimed himself to being is that Prophet that God promised Moses he would raise up in Ch 18 v 15/18.
. Oh Dear Oh Dear Oh Dear. That is the very Prophet of Deuteronomy that the Koran proclaims Muhammad as being because Muhammad believed that he alone was that prophet. You see he was religiously ignorant and did not know Jesus had proclaimed himself to being that Prophet 1000 years or so before Muhammad was even born. That is why they call Jesus the King of the Jews.
Jesus said in John Chapter 5 Verse 46: for had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me, for he wrote of me. Verse 47: But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words.
So the 11 chapters of the Koran are in serious errors in there proclamations considering on all accounts which Prophet it is that Muhammad has proclaimed himself as being Tsk Tsk Tsk�� Sura 4:82 states Do they not consider the Koran with care for if it had come from any other than Allah then surely they would have found much discrepancy therein. The 11 Chapters of the Koran glorifying Jesus are planty enough errors existing in the Koran considering the claims of which Prophet it is that Muhammad has proclaimed himself as being. The whole of Islam is powerless to go paddling into denial. And worse is look who it is who is giving you these Revelations.
Hafsa you said: Re-read the answer. As for what translates between Arabic and Hebrew or what did, has to be seen in light of how it is explained by scholars of that religion, not prejudiced enemies like you who say ahead �establishes Jesus and Muhammad as being frauds pretenders to my Throne�.
Starjade says: I am not the enemy of Islam. In fact I am saving your very Souls by offering you this chance of Redemption. After all worshipping false gods and following false Prophets is most frowned upon by the living God of Abraham and of Moses and of Starjade. I am a scholar of many religions and I am the absolute authority as can be clearly seen in my writings. Jesus and Muhammad both claim that they are the Deuteronomy Ch 18 v 15/18 Prophet. Muhammad and 11 Chapters of the Koran of course also believe in Jesus. Rather a contradiction that can fry the minds of all Muslims and Christians and Jews world wide.
Deuteronomy Ch 19 v 15 is a law brought down by Moses from the living God and is therefore the actual word of the living God who judges such matters through that very specific Deuteronomy law.
Now if Jesus and Muhammad are accused of blasphemy by anyone then they would be easily found guilty of that crime for they have no witnesses to back up their claims. I have named more than four witnesses who can back up my claims and those claims also establish by religious law that I am a genuine Prophet with a provable connection to the living God. I have never made any secret as to which specific Deuteronomy Ch 18 v 15/18 Prophet that religious law has established myself to being. The law proves those others to be frauds then they are clearly false pretenders to my Throne and you can be sure I am putting those matters in their place.
Hafsa you said: Beautiful verses!
Starjade says; (cough) considering the claims and brags of Islam it is not so wonderful for Islam. Why not explain what you think Jesus meant when he was saying Moses wrote about him in his writings. In fact Moses was not writing about Jesus but of the coming of the Prophet that the living God promised Moses he would raise up.
Both Jesus and Muhammad have claimed they are that specific Prophet. They used the writings of Moses and Isaiah to try and back up those claims.
Starjade is a matter of fact sort of person who is not bound by any form of liturgical form of worship. So I just established that I was that specific long awaited Deuteronomy Ch 18 v 15/18 Prophet that the living God promised Moses he would raise up to the Jews way back in 1995 using just Deuteronomy law Ch 19 v 15 and my own acts and deeds and the many prophesied signs in the Heavens. You see that is how things should be done. Nobody can then dispute that matter for the law of Deuteronomy Ch 19 v 15 was brought down from the living God by Moses himself and that law is then the actual word of the living God.
Hafsa you said: You should repent to God for saying this.Angel Jibraeel (Gabriel) spoke to all Prophets.
Starjade says: I have not ever made such a statement. There is no such thing as an Angel called Gabriel. Only Luke claimed there was an Angel Gabriel to proclaim the character Jesus who in later life claimed he was that Deuteronomy Ch 18 v 15/18 Prophet. Muhammad simply believed in those Christian tales and did not research the origin of the angel Gabriel who originated as a man that Daniel dreamed up whiles in a deep sleep. So do get your facts right.
Oh just wait :) I see what you are claiming now upon a double read of your garbled message. You should space your words better. As a matter of fact whiles Angels are said to have appeared to genuine Old Testament Prophets they were not named. The Angel Gabriel certainly does not exist in the writings of the Old Testament anyplace. In fact the name Gabriel only appears twice.
This (cough) Angel Gabriel originated in the new Testament writers proclamations of Luke. Luke was the first to speak of this Angel called Gabriel. And that was done to imply religious integrity to Jesus who in later life was depicted as claiming himself to being the long awaited Deuteronomy Ch 18 v 15/18 Prophet that the living God promised Moses he would raise up.
It is a serious errors in the claims of Muhammad to make proclamations about this angel Gabriel. Especially when he makes that claim the words of the Koran came from this fabricated angel Gabriel invented by Luke. As well as Muhammad believing in Jesus and believing Jesus was the Prophet that Jesus has proclaimed himself as being as well as the 11 Chapters of the Koran glorifying Jesus as being the Prophet that Jesus has proclaimed himself as being.
And that is not just in the claims of this fabricated angel Gabriel first claimed by Luke to proclaim Jesus as being the Deuteronomy Ch 18 v 15/18 Prophet. But also because Muhammad himself has proclaimed that he alone was that specific Deuteronomy Ch 18 v 15/18 Prophet as every Muslim on this planet well knows.
Now then. The Revelations of Starjade are informative correct and specific and to the point. Investigate these matters with diligence and be sure as many are that the Deuteronomy Ch 18 v 15/18 Doomsday Prophet Starjade has not made any mistakes on these errors that exist in the Koran and the claims of Muhammad and of Jesus. I am the expert in these fields of Religious knowledge and your own religious experts are the ones who are the novices.
Starjade says: remind yourselves that I have invoked Islamic law in the beginnings before I gave any of you these Revelations. I only speak about the religion of Islam under that specific law that I have invoked and I am the one who challenge Islam with the Sura 4:82 and before your eyes Islam still bites the dust. That is how powerful it is that I am.
Remind yourselves also that it is clear by the law of Deuteronomy Ch 19 v 15 a law brought down by Moses from the living God himself. Making that specific law the actual word of the living God. That I am not in any way guilty of any Crime of Iniquity or Sin. I am not guilty of any Blasphemy. To me the living God said you should hearken. That is what my Revelations are for.
I am not guilty of any crime of iniquity or sin and so I have no reason to make any form of repentance. It is all of you who should hearken and repent for only within my words and the actual words of the living God can you ever gain Salvation and Redemption.
Hafsa you said: If this is really so, why are you so involved in their religions, albeit you speak insults for almost each Prophet and their wives/ mothers.
Starjade says: I am the Crown of the living White Sphere of Kether. That very long awaited Deuteronomy Ch 18 v 15/18 prophet that the living God promised Moses he would raise up. It is clear and obvious that somewhere along my paths I would voice my Revelations to the congregations. It is also clear I would obviously expose the false Prophets who are the pretenders to my Throne.
You may idolize the false Prophets and glorify them as others in past would do to a stone. Yet they are the ones who are presumptuous to think they could speak in the name of the living God and they are misleading the congregations into profound blasphemy.
Starjade adds: And just where did I insult anyones wives or mothers. No place at all.
Hafsa you said: You should repent on saying this.
Starjade says: I have no reason to make repentance. You repent you sinner for believing and following false Prophets and you must obey Islamic law and reject the words of the Koran and the words of those false Prophets. Produce witness Testimony to back up their claims and see how shallow their claims really are.
Be wary now for Islamic experts already tried that and failed. Muhammad and Jesus have no actual witnesses for their claims. Whats the matter why do you not show the evidence that you believe exists and yet are mistaken.
I have already traveled those paths and so what you would say is all Deja view to me. I at least have the backbone to back my mouth up and produce the evidence for my claims in the beginnings. And all done under Islamic law and Deuteronomy law. What better authority to speak to the congregations than that. Or has your faith been waning. So you are not at all so confident then to produce any evidence or witness Testimony for Muhammad or Jesus eh. Now why am I not surprised. Because none exists.
Hafsa you say: <<state of hate and desperation>>
Starjade says: Is that all you can comment. Where is your logic.? Deuteronomy law is a witness law that determines matters of the truth especially with regards to crimes of iniquity and sin.
You do not see your imams daring to make accusations of Blasphemy against me. They are wiser than you. They know better than to even dare try for they all know I will eat them for breakfast.
11 Chapters of the Koran do glorify Jesus as being the Prophet that Jesus has proclaimed himself as being. Yet Jesus has no witnesses to his claims. They are all proclamations made by the Roman New Testament writers using Mathew Luke Mark and John as their characters to read the story they want you to believe.
I have already outright proven Jesus is a fraud and by Deuteronomy Ch 19 v 15 which is a law that determines matters of crimes of iniquity and sin. You need to have two or three witnesses to establish the matter as being true or not.
What is more the Roman Christians stole their statements regarding their tales about Jesus from the Old Testament writ thousands of years before they claimed Jesus was born.
Zechariah 9:9 Rejoice greatly, O daughter of Zion; shout, O daughter of Jerusalem: behold, thy King cometh unto thee: he is just, and having salvation; lowly, and riding upon an ass, and upon a colt the foal of an ass. The 30 pieces of Silver. Zechariah 11:12 And I said unto them, If ye think good, give me my price; and if not, forbear. So they weighed for my price thirty pieces of silver. Zechariah 11:13 And the LORD said unto me, Cast it unto the potter: a goodly price that I was prised at of them. And I took the thirty pieces of silver, and cast them to the potter in the house of the LORD. Psalms 22:16 For dogs have compassed me: the assembly of the wicked have inclosed me: they pierced my hands and my feet. Psalms 22:1 My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me? why art thou so far from helping me, and from the words of my roaring?
Starjade concludes. Do you see now from what parts of the Old Testament the Roman Christians used to invent their tales of Jesus. There is no hatred and the facts speak for themselves and under religious laws. So the matter is established and proven and so there is no desperation other than for the congregations trying to dispute my words.
I am a religious expert on these matters do not forget. More so than any of your religious leaders living or dead. Christianity and Islam have bitten the Dust.
Hafsa you said: Where did he quote this verse?
Starjade says: So are you denying now and claiming that Muhammad is not the Deuteronomy Ch 18 v 15/18 Prophet that the living God promised Moses he would raise up are you. So all these claims made by Muslims and Muhammad about Muhammad are all just accidental proclamations that islam will now just withdraw.
Go fetch me two or three statements from imams claiming that Muhammad is not the Deuteronomy Ch 18 v 15/18 Prophet and I will only then withdraw the accusation. Those statements by the way which you can never produce would have been displayed on the End of Times web site and every book I intend to publish. My own words and Revelations establish the matter either way.
Hafsa you said: I do know the answer but since your state of mind is quite out of tune, out of rage and desperatrion to be accepted as a Prophet, I�ll leave it for some other time.
Starjade says: Trust my words Hafsa, you do not want to be speaking to me about Aaisha who Muhammad married when she was only 6 years old and was having sex with when she was 9 years old. Be the wise and avoid those conversations.
Hafsa you said: You said it yourself! check your question.i didn't even find it clearly in Quran. 26.you are using Esther refernce to tell me Hamaan was above princes, so where does Quran make a mistake!
Starjade says: The quotes I mention should speak of the matter. By the way when are you going to comment on the Thunder and Lightening thingy. And what about this Devil that Muhammad says lives up the noses of all Muslims. I have seen a Muslim snorting up water a Time ago. I did wonder why he performed that ritual but did not at that Time ask. I know now though. Do you snort up water to flush out that Devil? Have you ever seen this Devil.? How many Times a day do you Muslims do this snorting out the Devil thingy.?
Be certain of this Hafsa. I am very religiously knowledgeable and I am serious about all of my religious conversations and proclamations. I take all these Revelations very seriously. Religion is not a game I play. I have said in the beginning when I invoked Islamic law. If you know something that is not true then you must be unafraid and stand up and state it. The matter will then be discussed. What is true is accepted as being true and what is not true must be rejected as being false. So this speaks of that final conclusion of things.
Realize these religious matters go way out of your depth and go tap your chicken legged Imams on the shoulder and ask them for their help. They cannot help you of course for my superior religious knowledge goes way beyond them, but it will make you feel so much better if you entice them online and watch them also bite the Dust.
The Deuteronomy Doomsday prophet Starjade is the only Lord King of the
apocalyptic castle. The false pretenders to my Throne were just
bound to bite the Dust. And so sayeth the Lord.
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Starjade
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mai moslemah you said: salam alikom, Starjade u dont know abc islam,and u dont want to know ,you are repeating some words without understanding please open ur mind ,,,they are all these 40 pages explained for u very simple concept of islam and u still repeating some word without understanding i suggest for u start from the biging ,,from real sources of islam not just lies here is some: Starjade says: I was taught the religion of Islam by Islamic experts. They did not just teach me the Islamic religion but also the way a muslim mind thinks. They also taught me some Islamic law of which I only have conversations about Islam under those Islamic laws. So I clearly know the Islamic religion very well in fact I am something of an expert on many religions. Therefore you are being presumptuous.
mai moslemah you said: Where Does the word "Allah" Come From? "Allah" comes from the Arabic word "elah" - (Arabic) means 'a god' or something that is worshipped. This word (elah) can be made plural, as in "aleha" and it can be male or female. "Allah" comes from "elaha" but it brings more clarification and understanding.
Starjade
says: Allah comes from the name hubal al�ilah a pagan moon god.
Muhammad gave worship to this moon god when he was a child with his
family like many others before him. The word Allah means Supreme
God. Anyone can type in hubal al�ilah into their search engines
and find out all the data they want on the muslims pagan moon god and
how it ended up being just Allah by the shortening of the name.
Starjade says: Curiously there is a debate on the pagan moon god hubal al�ilah. It is said to me male yet some say female. Some say the pagan moon god was married to the pagan sun god ra who is claimed to be female bysome and male by others. In my view the moon does not have any gendr. It is just a stone in space.
mai
moslemah you
said: Allah
= Always
singular - Never plural
Starjade says: The moon sits alone in space so it is singular and the Royal family in Britain are a blasphemous religiously ignorant people.
mai moslemah you said: Allah =Means "The Only One to be Worshipped"
Starjade says: try telling that to other religious followers of other religions. The living God of Abraham and of Moses and of Starjade is the only one true living God and if you worship any other god then you are guilty of blasphemy. It is that simple.
mai moslemah you said: On page one [1] of Genesis in the Old Testament, we find the word "Allah" seventeen [17] times.
Starjade says: You may well find that name in the Koran but not in the Old Testament. Next Time quote Chapter and verses.
mai moslemah you said: "Allah" is the same word used by Christian and Jewish Arabs in the Bible, before Islam came.
Starjade says: The name Allah came from the pagan moon god hubal al�ilah worshipped throughout Mesopotamia and the Middle East That is the pagan god worshipped at the Kabba.
mai moslemah you said: i hope u get that,if u get that tell me and i will give u more
Starjade
says: I have already done my own research as well as being taught
by Islamic experts. You are simply avoiding the reality that Muslims
give their worship to hubal al�ilah a pagan moon god and not the living
God of Abraham and of Moses and of the much loved Doomsday Prophet Starjade.
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Starjade
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Starjade smiles a reply: Look here Kayyam a Muslim I was having a debate with on these issues pointed out it was a possibility that perhaps Nefure was a daughter of a Pharaoh whiles also being married to one. So I did my own research on this issue and trust me it took me days of researching to be certain of all the facts. Either way to see if that suggestion by that learned scholar was perhaps correct as an explanation.
Nefure Hatshepsut was not married to anyone at the Time she adopted Moses and her own father was only a co regent Pharaoh and not the main ruling Pharaoh. Her mother died when she was young. In the history of Egypt there has only ever been one female who was a Pharaoh and that was Nefure Hatshepsut. Clearly this happened because her half brother husband had been drowned after chasing after Moses and the Hebrews. Along with his army that left Egypt partially undefended.
Nefure Hatshepsut was not popular in fact she became hated yet no clear reason was explained as to why. So Kayyam that is wishful thinking on your part but the mother of Nefure Hatshepsut died when she was young and was not a Pharaoh. To have a female Pharaoh was unheard of in Egypt until Nefure Hatshepsut came along and she only got that reign of power because Moses and the living God walked all over Egypt and the ruling Pharaoh died in that battle along with his army.
Clearly Egyptian history does establish that Moses does exist. Via his adoptive mother Nefure Hatshepsut. A statue of her holding the baby Moses can still be seen in Egypt. I add that Nefure never gave birth to any male child. The statue shows her holding that male child Moses. That shows that historians do not know everything.
Kayyam you said: Wow, I am really impressed by the depth of your research. "Some Arab told me its Yesuwa". Gee, I wonder if the linguists ever thought to ask an Arab. Kayyam Starjade says: Actually I am most impressive aren�t I Kayyam :) An Islamic scholar pointed out that error to me. Now it is an Arabic matter and so I asked some one who spoke and read Arabic on that subject. It is called having a bit of common sense. The Arab of course admitted the name of Jesus is not issa it is Yesuwa, and he could not give an explanation other than perhaps someone made the error whiles translating it into a foreign language. That seemed reasonable to me however it exists in the Koran which muslims claim is perfect and what is more other Arabic speaking people were consistently using the name Issa not Yesuwa. Clearly somebody never though about consulting the Arabs on that matter except for the all-wise much loved Doomsday Prophet Starjade.
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Starjade
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Starjade says: The story of the Garden of Eden is conceptual and not a real place. Adam is just a short word for Adamon which is Hebrew and means the first of mankind. The story was writ to hide hidden transcendental fruits that grew in the conceptual garden and upon the Tree of knowledge.
The fact is that it is not possible to know of the first creation of mankind. They had no pens and paper or language that could be writ. This self obvious conclusion then shows some other reason is meant and that can be found within its text. You just need to know what you are looking for. And do not forget the oldest skeleton of man is about 70,000 years old. The Old Testament nor any other written text is not that old. So do not accept all that you read as being gospel truth. Allow me to show this link pertaining to these matters to enlighten you some. And be the wise to realise that I am something of a religious expert in my unusual filed of religious knowledge.
The Christ unveiled. http://www.geocities.com/end_of_times/TheChrist.html
Kayyam you said: Yes the Torah is the only source for some things - which is exactly the problem. Historians never rely on just one source. I do not discount it as suggestive of historical possibilities. But it is far from definitive. Why? Because it is a source based on centuries of oral transmission - i.e. legends, folktales.
Starjade says: I also never rely on any one source of data but search around and look at everything diligently. Regarding the Old Testament the above link to the Christ unveiled shows that other knowledge does exist that is hidden in the Old Testament. But for Old Testament data or any data you must first go to the source which cannot be discounted as that is the origin of the data in question. Other things following or repeating via different words are not the words of the original writer who had specific points often hidden to get across. The hidden data does not exist in the Koran because they changed the words and destroyed that hidden data.
Kayyam you said: You mentioned archeological evidence. I recently saw a documentary on the National Geographic channel which explained there is not a shred of archeological evidence for the exodus.
Starjade says: Many religions war among each other saying this is true and that is not true. They bragged the Turin Shroud was real for centuries as an example. The Old Testament the New Testament and the Koran all agree the Exodus did take place. My fulfilling absolutely the Deuteronomy Ch 18 v 15/18 Prophecy established those matters of the Old Testament as being true. The existence of Nefure Hatshepsut and as being a Pharaoh is added evidence to the existence of Moses for had that Exodus not taken place then there is no way a woman could have become a Pharaoh in Egypt.
As for my own part in all of this. I am not bound within the confines of any particular form of worship and do not care if the Exodus took place or not as it is not of my religion anyway. What matters to me is the Jews have been waiting for a Prophet to come and gather them up from the four corners of the globe and lead them all to a new promised land. Now that Exodus is the only Exodus of interest to me because I have seen world wide earthquakes and land movements and I see that mass Exodus from the four corners of the globe as being a good way to move people out of those grave earthquake zones in their millions and from all the four corners of the globe. To a Prophet likened to me I see that Exodus as a great advantage and a way I can save the lives of potentially billions of people.
As for the past Exodus well I was not there but from that past another Exodus can be made to happen. That is the Exodus that is of importance. And the Living God prophesied those things and I cannot doubt the living God having had such a personal encounter. So it is then all a matter of what you then believe. Scientists do not even accept the after life or astral traveling as such things are just beyond them. I can give them assistance because I know exactly where the Veil of the Abyss is in the space around this planet. To pinpoint accuracy.
As for
the past Exodus I would say lets go dig some holes and see what we find
after all if an entire Egyptian army got drowned in the Red sea then
there has to be something left behind. Now that is what archeologists
should be doing rather than just speculating. Carbon dating then
can give dates. They carbon dated the Shroud of Turin and exposed
that as a fraud just as I said all along to friends before those tests
were made. Those Christians are such sneaky people. |
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Starjade
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Kayyam you said: Of the four excerpts that you listed, this one is the closest to what you have said: 067.005
Kayyam you said: Have you ever heard of poetic license? Stars are pretty hot - according to most physicists. So it probably means that the "doom of flame" will be rather unpleasant. Kayyam
Starjade
says: I do not think that Stars are moving about Kayyam.
Atr the distance they shine they would be much larger than this planet.
I personally just love Muhammad�s sense of humor. But he did climb
up the Mountain because he knew he had gone mad. Plus the claims
of Muhammad seem to give limitations to the living God who could surely
destroy Demons in a whoosh. But then Muhammad�s Allah is the pagan
moon god hubal al�ilah. What has your research told you about
that then considering these claims of Muhammad bearing in mind also
the daughters of hubal al�ilah are said to be three stars. That
claim then is at another Time self conflictory. |
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Starjade
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Hafsa
you said: Answer to Starjade,:
Starjade says: As I am that very specific Deuteronomy Ch 18 v 15/18 Prophet it is natural to be on my mind a lot. But I do not consider myself obsessive whiles I point out how other claimants are frauds.
Hafsa you said: So when you say �So then this is a proven error that exists in the Koran�, there is nothing for your this. And your reference is still Old Testament in which you know there are various changes made. Let me be slightly naughty here and catch you in your own words..
Starjade says: Muhammad claimed that he is that Deuteronomy Ch 18 v 15/18 Prophet and Jesus claimed that he was that Deuteronomy Ch 18 v 15/18 Prophet and they are both mentioned as being the prophets that they are claiming themselves to be in the Koran. But the living God only promised to raise up just one Prophet. So one or the other or both then must be lying. It is an obvious
conclusion. So then why is the Koran promoting what must clearly be a false Prophet or too. (no Fagan jokes please)(unless they are good ones)
Hafsa you said: The only Word of Allah Ta�ala which He took to Himself to guard against evil is of course �Quraan� in which you have not given me a single real discrepancy. Starjade says: look on page 12 for another list and re read all these pages. You only managed to give an account for one error causing me to agree and withdraw it. You have not disputed successfully any other errors as everyone here can see. We are not the only ones reading these pages and so you are not being truthful. Tsk tsk tsk.. Taking your daily swim in denial.
So your point escapes me as to what this has to do with the blasphemy of Aaron.
Hafsa you said: Tell you what, put your obsession aside and relax your mind for a while about religions. Why not?
Starjade says: I find I cannot, as religion is more than a part of my life it is my life and my destiny. When it is all accomplished I can relax but till then I am simply accepting my own fate. At least I know my purpose in life and reason for existing.
Hafsa you said: After all we are all going to die and the very moment we�ll know the truth. So do not mind. What will you loose if nobody takes you as a prophet.
Starjade says: Too late Hafsa for the law of Deuteronomy Ch 19 v 15 establishes that I am a Prophet and one with a provable connection to the living God. And unlike you I have the lives of the people who died on that Doomsday on my mind and they are the ones who cried out for a Savior and so it is their prayers I answer as well.
Soon my own publications will be going to print and whiles I will not mind at all if Muslims want to make a big fuss about it. It is the wise you all have these conversations with me now so you all understand what it is all about. Besides the followers of Islam challenged me and they challenged me to challenge Islam and after they goaded me I agreed. Do not challenge the Doomsday prophet unless you can accept defeat gracefully for I always win in my conversations and I did warn you all of that in the beginnings.
Hafsa you said: A lofty rank is lofty no matter what others think. But now suppose if you are throwing wrong allegations on Allah (or call Him God) and many sacred people including prophets whom He loves, you will loose.
Starjade says: Whatever is found to be true will be accepted as being true and what is found to be false will be rejected as being false and that is Islamic law and I invoked that law in the beginnings. Allah is known as being hubal al�ilah the pagan moon god worshipped throughout the Middle East. Tap into your search engine hubal al�ilah and see for yourself. My words are true. Other wise I would not be saying them. T
hose who you think are Prophets from God are established as being presumptuous to think they could speak in Gods name. I would not say that if it were not true. I can back up my mouth and prove they are false Prophets who did not come from God and yet you who follow them cannot defend those false Prophets from those accusations.
Hafsa you said: The way you can prove it to yourself which side you are is that if you really wrong, you will not want to die.
Starjade says: I died way back in 1980. I prefer to be living on the other side of the Veil of the Abyss and did not ever expect to be returning back to this planet. Death has no meaning for me at all. I was already dead and out exploring and that was more interesting than being here on this planet. Do not ever fear death but embrace it for it is a wonderful experience. At least it was for me. As for the evil among you. Be the wise and hope you never die for you there is a different matter as Hell most certainly does exist. Be afraid be very very afraid.
Starjade says: I can and do prove all these things I speak about to lots of people. For me it is all easy stuff. Those who cannot believe are those who have no common sense or religious knowledge and they suffer insignificantly from the Ostrich syndrome. Why look at you and things you believed. You not so sure anymore now you were taught other things that showed your beliefs were in fact shallow. In fact what you think was already taught to you from the thoughts of others who died long ago. And they got it wrong as well. Starjade is not wrong though and that is why I can challenge the whole of Islam and Christianity too. And they are the ones who bite the dust.
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Starjade
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Mai you said; Starjade u dont know abc islam,and u dont want to know ,you are repeating some words without understanding please open ur mind ,,,they are all these 40 pages explained for u very simple concept of islam and u still repeating some word without understanding i suggest for u start from the biging ,,from real sources of islam not just lies here is some:
Starjade says: Upon reflection I wonder if you have actually bothered to read these pages or have just entered into conversations without giving what was writ much thought. Does it annoy you so that I deal only with the facts and do not heed Islamic propaganda. If I repeat anything it was because the question was repeated. I was simply replying the words others wrote. It is clear I have a greater understanding than you your pals and your religious leaders. As the thread is about the Sura 4:82 challenge and done under Islamic law which I invoked in the beginnings and is all about the Koran and its contents as well as the claims of Muhammad. Then explain why do you not accept Islamic law, the Koran and the word of Muhammad as being the sources of Islam.
Mai you said; Where Does the word "Allah" Come From? "Allah" comes from the Arabic word "elah" - (Arabic) means 'a god' or something that is worshipped. This word (elah) can be made plural, as in "aleha" and it can be male or female. "Allah" comes from "elaha" but it brings more clarification and understanding. Mai you said; i hope u get that,if u get that tell me and i will give u more
Starjade says: Copy cut and pasting comments off web sites to help you in some claim will not help you at all. "Allah" is from the compound Arabic word "al-ilah" or in english "the god." This word has been found in pre-islamic writings and other archeological finds. At the Kabah in Mecca 360 gods were worshipped, but it was built especially for the chief deity - Hubal was the top pagan moon god of the Kabah. So Allah is the generic and Hubal, the actual name, in the same way that "the God" is generic and "Jehovah" is the name.
Allah was married to the sun goddess. They are said to have produced three daughters, whose worship Muhammad would later make the mistake of condoning. The crescent moon symbol of Arabia came from this god. There is also a claim of another star being born unto them which was the morning star the planet Venus so it is known many pagan gods were worshipped in those Times.
Muhammad's family revered this particular god, Hubal al�ilah and Muhammad declared him to be the only true god. Muhammad did not re-make the pagan god, he simply removed the lower deities from the rites of worship. That is why he never had to explain who Allah was. Muhammad claimed this was the God of Abraham that was revealed thousands of years earlier to the Biblical prophets.
The Quraysh tribe into which Muhammad was born was particularly devoted to Hubal al�ilah, the moon god, and to Allah's three daughters who were viewed as intercessors between the people and Allah. The worship of the three goddesses, Al-Lat, Al-Uzza, and Manat, played a significant role in the worship at the Kabah in Mecca. The first two daughters of Allah had names which were feminine forms of Allah. An Allah idol was set up at the Kabah along with all the other idols. The pagan moon worshippers prayed toward Mecca and the Kabah because that is where their gods were stationed. It only made sense to them to face in the direction of their god and then pray. Since the idol of their moon god, Allah, was at Mecca, they prayed toward Mecca.
Animism, is the belief that spirits inhabit rocks, trees and other elements this was also very commonplace. Some of these stones were venerated and used as a focal point for the worship of a particular tribal god. Muhammad's family had just such a stone for their own tribe - The black stone that they kept at the Kabah (where the tribal idols were set up). The rites of bowing toward Mecca, making a pilgrimage to the Kabah, running around it seven times, kissing the black stone, then running to a well to throw stones at the devil all found there way into Islamic practice. The religion of the Sabeans, a religion that worshipped the moon god planned their religious rites around the lunar calendar. One such rite was fasting from crescent moon to crescent moon, a practice which was also be adopted by Muhammad.
Muhammad did not have to explain what these words and practices meant in the Quran, for they were already well known. Even the word "Islam" which many believe to mean "submission," was a known word. In Arabic it was a secular term that denoted the strength and bravery of a desert warrior. Do not forget most Arabs of this Time were desert dwellers.
Allah. Islamic name for God. Is derived from Semitic El, and [Allah] originally applied to the Moon; he [Allah] seems to have been preceded by Ilmaqah, the Moon-god. Allat is the female counterpart of Allah. (Everyman�s Dictionary of Non-Classical Mythology,
"The first pre-Islamic inscription discovered in Dhofar Province, Oman, this bronze plaque, deciphered by Dr. Albert Jamme, dates from about the second century A.D. and gives the name of the Hadramaut moon good Sin and the name Sumhuram, a long-lost city....The moon was the chief deity of all the early South Arabian kingdoms�particularly fitting in that region where the soft light of the moon brought the rest and cool winds of night as a relief from the blinding sun and scorching heat of day.
By taking the stories, traditions, and beliefs of the Old and New Testaments and adding to them the pagan practices of his Arabian culture, Muhammad created his own religion Islam and attempted to remake Allah into a form that was more appealing to the many religious travelers that he came in contact with during his childhood. Muhammad succeeded in weeding out the lower gods, he moved Arabia from polytheism to monotheism. But being monotheistic does not make one a believer in the true God. Allah is not the living God of Abraham, Moses or the much loved Doomsday Prophet Starjade.
It is Hubal al�ilah {Allah} the moon god of the Kaba. Anyone can tap in Hubal al�ilah into your search engines and find out data about your moon god Allah. This moon god had many other names and many other gods were also given worship to in those regions. Many Muslim I have spoken with already knew that information. Why what god did you all think you were giving your worship too. ?
The cult of the Moon-god was the most popular religion throughout ancient Mesopotamia. The Assyrians, Babylonians, and the Akkadians took the word Suen and transformed it into the word Sin as their favorite name for the Moon-god. "Sin is a name essentially Sumerian in origin which had been borrowed by the Semites." In ancient Syria and Canna, the Moon-god Sin was usually represented by the moon in its crescent phase. At times the full moon was placed inside the crescent moon to emphasize all the phases of the moon. The sun-goddess was the wife of Sin and the stars were their daughters.
For example, Istar was a daughter of Sin. Sacrifices to the Moon-god are described in the Pas Shamra texts. In the Ugaritic texts, the Moon-god was sometimes called Kusuh. Many scholars have also noticed that the Moon-god's name "Sin" is a part of such Arabic words as "Sinai," the "wilderness of Sin," etc. When the popularity of the Moon-god waned elsewhere, the Arabs remained true to their conviction that the Moon-god was the greatest of all gods. While they worshipped 360 gods at the Kabah in Mecca, the Moon-god was the chief deity. Mecca was in fact built as a shrine for the Moon-god. So then Mai does that answer your question. See you can learn something new every day. Do you suppose certain Muslims are annoyed at the Americans because they landed a man on their moon god. The mind just boggles doesn�t it.? So when Muhammad speaks of paradise is that meant to be on the Dark side of the moon. Or is that only when you are smoking a spliff whiles listening to a bit of Pink Floyd.
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Starjade
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Kayyam you said: So the key is how long before they are written down. In fact, the Torah as the oldest in the group is the least accurate. It passed on for many centuries orally before it was written down. That is demonstrated by the fact that there are multiple versions of some stories - like the story of creation - that contradict each other. Kayyam
Starjade says: I do know a lot of the Jews religion does not exist in the Old Testament. The Old Testament is a sort of history of those Times. But it is to my understanding that its original text was writ during those Times. Of course some of it is lost due to wars and stuff. But the Jews did keep a lot. Of course the Jews today are very misguided as to the Old Testament text. In fact from my conversations with the Jews, I would say they are most often delusional in their beliefs. Take the next Exodus from the four corners of the globe for instance.
The Jews think the Deuteronomy Prophet will gather them up from the four corners of the globe and bring all those Jews to the land of Israel in fact some expand on that delusion and talk of Jerusalem added onto that.
Now think logically here which is something the Jews have been unable to comprehend. All the Jews all over the four corners of the globe collectively just would not fit on the present land of Israel even if they include Jerusalem. Jerusalem by the way is owned by the blasphemous Roman Christians. And they have no plans to give up Jerusalem without a fight.
So then this belief by the Jews that the Deuteronomy Prophet would gather up the Jews from the four corners of the globe is most illogical when that land is too small to house them and sustain them. Hence they are mistaken in that belief. So it is logical to sell off that land of Israel for larger land in North West Africa owned and dominated by Muslims. Muslims want the land of Israel so it is a simple swap. Larger tracts of land in Africa in exchange for the present land of Israel. That way they can all await the new land that I have promised them which will arrive in the South Eastern Atlantic basin next to Africa on that future apocalyptic Doomsday.
And of
course the orthodox Jews do not account for the other descendants of
Abraham. Which adds to an even greater total of Jews.
I add also to sustain them growing fields for food and water and factories
for clothes and other items is a large project. All of which cannot
logically fit onto the small land of Israel and even Jerusalem.
Clearly Jews are being misguided and do not appear to have any common
sense anymore. |
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Starjade
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Naturally
Jesus and Muhammad did not work out such plans. It is just as
well Starjade has such depth of thought. It shows that nobody
on this planet could ever walk in my shoes |
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hafsa 
Junior Member Joined: 22 February 2006 Location: Pakistan Online Status: Online Religion: Islam(Muslim) Posts: 157 |
starjade your plus point
is only that you can put tooooooooooooooooo much time to it all. afterall
i understand you live for it. on the other hand we take them as your
follies and delibrate effort to denounce our religion that we love.
so when we give time to answering you, it is us giving time to
you, one person, whom we don't take as a prophet. so we can't give time
to you all the time and every time, we want to move on. in the right
direction, which is not your direction.
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Starjade
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Hafsa you say: starjade your plus point is only that you can put tooooooooooooooooo much time to it all. afterall i understand you live for it. on the other hand we take them as your follies and delibrate effort to denounce our religion that we love.
Starjade says: yes I am dedicated to the things I do after all I am the Deuteronomy Ch 18 v 15/18 Doomsday prophet. You are just miffed that I gave sound answers to all you said. As I invoked Islamic law and then challenged Islam with the Sura 4:82 to which you have no sound reply then these matters are hardly folly. You are starting to speak like a Kuffar shirker. I have little interest in any religions. It is the claim Muhammad made regarding the Koran coming from God and in his silly claim to being that Prophet that God promised Moses he would raise up that I am arguing against and proving my points. You cannot expect me to care for the thoughts and feelings of some idol worshipping can you ? Why I know other Muslims who are appalled also at the idol worship going on in Islam.
Hafsa you say: so when we give time to answering you, it is us giving time to you, one person, whom we don't take as a prophet.
Starjade says: You thought you could defend Islam and the Koran and Muhammad from my God given Revelations and you failed. I challenged Islam and you took up that challenge so let us not have mere excuses. You could not defend Islam or the Koran or Muhammad�s claims and Islamic law states you must reject what is not true and if you do not then that makes you a shirker. What kind of Muslim ignores Islamic law eh. Not a very good one.
Deuteronomy law Ch 19 v 15 as brought down from the living God by Moses himself establishes that I am a prophet with a provable connection to the living God. So nobody was asking you for your opinion on that matter.
Hafsa you say: so we can't give time to you all the time and every time, we want to move on. in the right direction, which is not your direction.
Starjade
says: So now you are unable to defend the Koran and the claims
of Muhammad from my Revelations you are making excuses to Shirk away.
That makes you a shirker then a Kuffar shirker. Who stands against
Islamic law and Deuteronomy law and the Sura 4:82 challenge of the Koran.
Dumb Dumb Dumb Dumb and another one bites the Dust.
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At least I am being practical. Where do you see any
other who claim they are that Deuteronomy Ch 18 v 15/18 Prophet that
the living God promised Moses he would raise up. Making such deep
thinking plans for the Exodus of those Jews from the four corners of
the globe. 
You see I can talk the talk and I do walk the walk.
And I considered all of the descendants of Abraham and of more
of his descendants than anyone else did on this earth. To this
day I insist my Exodus plans are carried out to the letter. Including
the building of the Third Temple in North West Africa. That will
be the apocalyptic city that is planned to house all those descendants
of Abraham. When they do Exodus from the four corners of the globe.
Without it they will certainly all die and this planet will be