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| Subject: Christmas Day |
| How is everyone going to spend Christmas day. Tell us
how you are going to spend it even if you are a Christian, atheist or what ever Thanks please post back. |
| From: "what_do_u_believe" |
| Subject: Re: Christmas Day |
| We are cooking a large dinner, and having friends
over. Money is extremely tight this year. Usually, we have a tree and exchange presents and all that. Its a big family day. bright blessings, 3/4angel |
| From: "threequartersangel" |
| Subject: Re: [what_do_u_believe] Christmas Day |
| We don't really celebrate christmas day, it's the eve
that we are centered around. On Christmas Day, we will probably be shopping. |
| From: "Fredrik Malmquist" |
| Subject: Re: [what_do_u_believe] Christmas Day |
| I am atheist,..I would think excluding the origans of
the holiday and everything else,...It is held as a day ,..for each to share their values and appreciation to the ones they love and hold closest to in life.And a sort of respective coexistence with everyone else,.....this is my first post here,..let me just say Happy Holidays,...Dont drink and drive,...and "Enjoy your existence",..for it is truely the most important one,...Cheers to Happiness,... |
| From: [email protected] |
| Subject: Re: Christmas Day |
| "...this is my first post here," Hello and Welcome :). My Holiday season is going to be fairly nice and quiet (hopefully). My grandparents flew out a couple days ago from the east coast, so they'll be spending the vacation with us. On Christmas day I'll probably sleep in as late as possible (it will be about 4 am before someone wakes me) We'll have a good breakfast, then sit in the living room and open our gifts. That will be pretty much it until we have dinner, and maybe watch a movie. Nice, relaxing day :). Happy Holidays to everyone out there. |
| From: "odi_brassicium" |
| Subject: YO! |
| Hey, no ones posting :(. Alrighty this calls for something drastic... What are everyones opinions on abortion? Personally I'm for it right up until the baby is out of the mother. To me, when the child is still in the womb it is still physically dependent on the mother, and therefore the mother has the right to decide what to do with her own body. Once the child is out, it is able to survive physically (not emotionally) on it's own, without getting nutrients from the mother. Some claim it's okay up until the child develops the brain, I disagree because, although it has a brain, it hasn't achieved conciousness yet. It is unable to determine its rights, or even its existence. |
| From: "odi_brassicium" |
| Subject: Re: [what_do_u_believe] YO! |
| Yeah that's pretty much my opinion too. Since the
baby doesn't know what life is, it doesn't really care about it. It may be the shock from leaving the mother that actually wakes it up to conciousness. |
| From: "Fredrik Malmquist" |
| Subject: Re: YO! |
| It is unable to determine its rights, or even its > > existence.> what??? A 2 year old isnt able to etermine its rights or understand its existance either :P I however am pro-choice, but only during the 1st trimester. That gives the woman enough time to determine if they want the child or not, for any reason, and it the "problem" taken care of in the manner that she (or the couple) sees fit. Like I said, I am pro-choice when it comes to passing laws because I dont want it outlawed. However, when it comes to my own personal beliefs, I am Pro- life. I could never go thru that procedure, and I see the baby as a living being from conception. the bible looks at it that way(if you are christian) and I look at it that way just because of my own moral beliefs. to each thier own. bb, 3/4angel |
| From: "threequartersangel" |
| Subject: Re: [what_do_u_believe] YO! |
| I would think abortion should be legal and moral as
long as it isnt practiced after the baby becomes conscious,..wich I think happens a couple monthes before birth,..but Im still not sure,...regardless it has to have an objective bases |
| From: [email protected] |
| Subject: Re: YO! |
| "what??? A 2 year old isnt able to etermine its
rights or understand its existance either :P " I think a 2 year wants to live, it realizes it wants to survive. I think I phrased it wrong when I said determine its rights. But that wasn't even my main point, just the reason I disagree that the formation of the neural tube is the drawing line where one shouldn't abort. The brain development just forms the structure, it doesn't mean the baby can think like you and I. The best drawing line for me is when the baby becomes a physically independent organism. |
| From: "odi_brassicium" |
| Subject: Re: YO! |
| How do you know that a baby(still in the womb) doesnt
know if it wants to live or not? Did you not hear the report not too long ago of the dr. that was doing something to a baby still in the uterus (sorry,i dont remember exactly what he was doing) and the unborn child reached his/her hand out and actually grabbed the dr.s finger? sorry, but to me that is a living being that deserves to live. Have you ever seen animals born before that came out but were still in the sac? (yeah, bad analogy but follow me here...) Although it is fully developed and alive, it is still in the fluid-filled sac. it isnt "officially" born by your standards but non-the-less it is a living being. to each their own, I guess. bb, 3/4angel |
| From: "threequartersangel" |
| Subject: Re: YO! |
| "How do you know that a baby(still in the womb)
doesnt know if it wants to live or not? Did you not hear the report not too long ago of the dr. that was doing something to a baby still in the uterus (sorry,i dont remember exactly what he was doing) and the unborn child reached his/her hand out and actually grabbed the dr.s finger?" I don't see how that has any relevence to the subject. Are you saying the baby was afraid of the finger and was trying to get it out? Humans have several inborn instincts, they know to grab and hold onto things, and also to suck. A fetus has no desire to live or die, it simply doesn't have enough conciousness. I'd say the will to survive comes into play as soon as a human shows the instincts of fear. Fear is our most powerful emotion, and the one most necessary to survival. This doesn't mean I'm saying abortion is ok until this emotion develops mind you, but it's one of the reasons that I think abortion is acceptable after the neural tube develops. "sorry, but to me that is a living being that deserves to live. Have you ever seen animals born before that came out but were still in the sac? (yeah, bad analogy but follow me here...) Although it is fully developed and alive, it is still in the fluid-filled sac. it isnt "officially" born by your standards but non-the-less it is a living being. to each their own, I guess." By my standards the animal is born. It is able to survive on its own, once the sack breaks it (I assume) will breath and be on its own. It does not need the mother, or anyone else to rob nutrients from. A baby is born when it's removed from the mother, and no longer needs her body to survive. |
| From: "odi_brassicium" |
| Subject: Re: YO! |
| "a human shows the instincts of fear. Fear is
our most powerful > emotion, and the one most necessary to survival. This doesn't mean > I'm saying abortion is ok until this emotion develops mind you, but > it's one of the reasons that I think abortion is acceptable after the > neural tube develops" I'm glad you clarified that. Honestly, I dont know how you think you for sure know that a fetus has no will to live or die...you just dont know for sure, and I know of no guaranteed 110% scientific way you can prove that point one way or the other. Besides, it almost seems like the whole basis of your arguement is that the baby robs the mother of nutrients until it is fully developed and exits the womb. This brings to mind 2 seperate thoughts to me... 1. is a parasite then a living being or not? they are fully developed, but must be attached to an organism,robbing it of its nutrients,etc, in order to survive. and 2, what about half way to 3/4 developed animals that exit the womb to live outside the female's body to develope the rest of the way. they arent developed fully (like the fetus) but they are outside of the body, still living on it to develope all the way. what do you think about that? It's obvious that neither one of us will ever change our minds, but this is an interesting conversation to provoke thought on both sides of the arguement. Just remember I did say i am pro-choice...just not for the same reasons you are. bb, 3/4angel |
| From: "threequartersangel" |