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I have just published a book "New Skins for Old Wine" based on parts of this website.

Traditionalist Catholic and gay? 
Committed to the Tridentine Mass and homosexual
Concerned about orthodox belief, but committed to personal integrity and not just willing to toe the Vatican "party line"? 

You are not alone!  

Our Lord must have had a sexuality, unless the Docetist heretics were right! 
Whom did He love? The Beloved Apostle John, Lazarus or Judas Iscariot

Click here for Faithful to The Truth, a view of homosexuality. 

Click here to 

Click here to see other people's views of this site.
Click here for an INDEX to the subjects covered here. 
Check out this video: New Skins for Old Wine: Platos Wisdom for Todays World


I find the "problem" with reading your articles is similar to the delightful problem I have with looking up a word in the dictionary.  One gets waylaid by all the other wonderful stuff that's there, and instead of being disciplined and spending just a few minutes on the task in hand, one spends half an hour or so in delicious digression - as I have just done. It certainly is verry difficult to leave your site once in it.  What an indication of your erudition  - and  your ability to put it across in a way easily understood by readers with absolutely no theological training. [Quoted from a lay correspondant (March 2008)]

Thanks to all of you who contribute to this amazing site. A little over a year ago when I began the prcess of becoming a Roman Catholic I sought out support and direction from various sorces. The caring response I recievd from membrs of this group encouraged me to begin RCIA at our local parish. My concerns were posted here and I recieved several notes that helped ease my fears and calm my nerves. 

After attending the first few classes, my partner and I (together 19 years!) discovered a warm welcome by the members and our parish priest. This welcome extended to activiies hosted by our Bishop also. Not only were we made to feel at home, but the study deepened my faith and stimulated my mind. It soon became obvious that our priest is something of a expert on liturgical forms and practices; traditional and contemporary. The information shared here and the discussions that follow enriched this whole experience.  On Holy Saturday last year I was confirmed and recieved my first Communion. 

As Catholics, our similarities are greater than our differences. I am grateful for the support and encouragement I recieve here. Thank you for being a part of this amazing journey. Even if I don't quite
understand everything discussed here, I benefit in ways I can't describe easily. But I remember that learning is a process that occurs over time!

Thanks again and God bless you all. I will continue to read your posts, and pray for you all as well. [Quote from a lay member (October 2007)]

This is a great group. It is the best group for gay Catholic Christians that I have found on Yahoo! You will find commentary from the most liberal to the most conservative and everything in between. It is one of the most open and balanced groups that you could have found on Yahoo!
[Quote from a member of the list (June 2005)]

I am both a catholic and a man "suffering from" same sex attraction. Why am I writing "suffering from"?  Just because it is a very confusing state, and being an honest guy it is not an easy one for me. 

Only a few months ago I was strictly obedient to the "official teaching of the Church" but having browsed some web sites I have come to understand that the teaching is not as well 
based as it is presented. 

I have many doubts in my head. Maybe I will enclose them to my next posts and someone will help me to find the truth. I feel the lack of a wise, sensitive and responsible guy next to me.

I am really confused on these matters. I hope you will understand when I describe how I feel as a battle between emotions and reason.
[Quote from a new lay member (October 2005)]

Enter your email and click on the Icon to join my discussion list.

I must say that I have belonged to a few Yahoo groups in the past, but this one strikes me as the most stimulating and the most rewarding.  I think, too often, we don't tell each other enough how we appreciate the koinonia in the faith that we share, even though it be e-koinonia.  I know you'll have a whale of a time here. [Quote from a clerical member (November 2005)]

I've had a chance to see where this site of faith [the Yahoo! group - ed] has wandered. It often reminds me of the journey of the People of Israel during the forty year Exodus. I suppose there was no straight route, nor do we read of  Moses asking for directions from God or anyone, (a male thing handed down from male to male I suppose). But unlike the Exodus this site does become and Island of faith for those willing to walk on its roller coaster of answers from multiple fronts. 

How many more aren't we hearing from? How many more won't share their faith with us, thus enabling us and them to grow? We are much less then we could be if all shared. In the Eucharist we are invited to share the Body and Blood, Soul and Divinity of Our Blessed Lord Jesus Christ, in atonement for our Sins and those of the entire world.  Everyone shares there... why not here?

The amount of Priests and Bishops on here astounds me, for most share their walk of faith with the faithful, no matter who they are. Some have chosen to leave the path of the apostle, but are still welcome here. Even those away from being amongst the faith of the Church grant us their wisdom, spiced with the wisdom of whatever roads they walk presently, and to their wisdom we should be attentive. [Quote from a clerical member (December 2005)]

Hello everyone! I'm new to the group so I thought I would introduce myself and share a bit of my life's story. I must confess, it's actually been several years since i've attended the Latin Mass. Mostly because, for a long time, the spirituality I was searching for had absolutely nothing to do with what kind of Mass I attended, if I attended Mass at all. 

I was born and raised in Arkansas by very nominal Protestant parents. I wasn't really raised with any sort of appreciation for religion but somehow was drawn on a journey towards the Catholic Church when I was around 11 or 12 years old.

By the time I was 16, my parents (much to their disappointment) realized that this was not just a phase I was going through and it wasn't going away, so they let me begin the initiation classes. It was during this time that I was introduced to the Traditional Latin Mass and I found that I enjoyed it much more than the Novus Ordo. I started attending every chance I got and by the time I was confirmed, had decided that I wanted to attend only the TLM. 

It was during this period in my life when I decided to take spiritual direction from one of the priests of the FSSP Latin Mass Community. Most of the time the direction revolved around my homosexual tendencies and my struggles with pornography. The priest was very much in favor of reparative therapy and I spent a little over a year in phone therapy sessions with a doctor from the St. Thomas Aquinas Clinic in California. When it was apparent that the sessions where getting me nowhere my parents decided to stop paying for them. 

During all of this I was allowing myself to be influenced by the more radical thinking that is found in many Latin Mass Communities and started attending a chapel serviced by the SSPX (Society of St. Pius X). I was involved with them for about 4 years and lived at their US headquarters for some months thinking I wanted to be a priest and also attended an Ignatian Retreat at their seminary in Winona, MN. 

What got me out of the whole thing was the combination of struggling with my sexuality and my growing scrupulosities. I was very often depressed and had no joy in my spiritual life, which consisted mostly of sitting around with other "traditionalists" and talking for hours about what was wrong with the Church and the pope. Eventually I gave up on all of it and decided to come out and be proud about being gay. I got my first boyfriend and went through an agnostic phase where God might be real but organized religion was certainly all wrong and nothing truly good could come from it. 

But Our Lord, when he touches a soul, does not let us go off for too long. After a couple of years I knew I needed to return to some life and understanding of spirituality. I was eventually led to the Episcopal Church because it looked a little Catholic and sounded a little Catholic but was very open towards me and my partner. I had many more intellectual and spiritual struggles before I realized that there was only one place I could be and that was the Catholic Church; and if I was ever asked why, my reply was easy: "The Eucharist"!

Our Lady and the Eucharist had always been what drew me to the Faith, and they continue to be the two pillars of my spiritual life today. And now I find myself drawn to a more traditional, contemplative form of worship... maybe back to the Latin Mass. But I fear getting caught up in all the negativity and superior mindset that I see in many traditionalists. We'll just have to see how it all plays out. Personally I think it's a little comical how I'm being brought back to where I came from but with a totally new understanding and acceptance of myself as a gay man in love with hisCatholic faith. Nevertheless, the Lord has brought me back around and I find myself becoming more and more conservative and/or traditional. 

This poses a little bit of a problem for me. I don't think I would fit in with Parishes where GLBT people and their partners are welcomed simply because most of them tend to be quite liberal, both in theology and liturgy. Not my cup of tea! But on the other hand, where there are beautiful liturgies and abundance of devotion with sound theology, I have found very strong anti-gay sentiments. 

What's a Traditional gay Catholic to do? Go to Mass and just stay away from all the people? Never talk to anybody? And if the topics of "do you have a girlfriend" or "are you married" come up, what should I say? Should I hide such an important part of my life? From what i've seen and heard, that would probably be the only solution. 

When I was part of the FSSP apostolate, there was a transgendered person who would attend every Sunday. When it was found out that she was indeed transgendered, certain groups of people bothered the priest so much that in the end the priest had to ask this individual to stop attending the Latin Mass. Once when I confessed about my homosexual inclinations the priest told me that if I acted on them, that would make me lower than the dogs. The same thing can be said of most all parishes, at least where i live. I now go to Novus Ordo Mass at our Cathedral and although I suspect a good number of the people who go there are more liberal, the priest is certainly not! If I made too public the fact that I was gay and had a partner, he would probably tell me to end it all or stop receiving the sacraments. 

So is that the lot of a conservative/traditional gay Catholic? Just go to Mass, say my prayers, and shut up? Or are there Churches out there where gay couples are welcomed and the Mass is still celebrated with reverence and solemnity? [Quote from a lay member (June 2008)]

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On a lighter note, click here for some pictures of :  And an account of my holidays at 
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