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THEE BEARS' DEN MESSAGE BOARDS > The Prayer Board > A Word About this Board Page 1 2 << Prev Topic | Next Topic >> Author Comment bubear Administrator Posts: 11 (6/4/01 3:50:47 pm) A Word About this Board -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- This is the Prayer Board - it is uniquely designed from any other board. The Gold background represents the purity and the richness that is God. The text is in Crimson, which represents the Blood of Jesus Christ, shed on our behalf as he took our sins upon himself by the shedding of his own blood. The white represents the fact that our sins were washed away by HIS BLOOD, leaving us as white as snow. The grey represents the fact that we all sin and fall short of the Glory of God and to keep us mindful that we are only able to strive for perfection, but that we will always fall short until HE comes again to make us perfect in every way. Bill Gillum Registered User Posts: 1 (6/5/01 4:02:02 pm) Re: A Word About this Board -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Awesome. Let's continue to use this means of communication to encourage each other Ultimately to give God glory Thanks for the hard work bucomp Registered User Posts: 1 (6/11/01 4:44:29 pm) Re: A Word About this Board -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- what, no purple? Judge Baylor Registered User Posts: 11 (6/12/01 3:30:28 pm) Re: A Word About this Board -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Good point Tony. bbfan77777 Registered User Posts: 1 (8/19/01 8:18:11 am) Re: A Word About this Board -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I would like to request that we say a prayer for Queso, the cat who was murdered by Brehm and Bowers. If we're Christians, then shouldn't we do that? I understand loyalty, and I like baseball as much as the next person, and I care about Baylor, but as a Christian, I think that murder is wrong, whether it is murder against a human, or an animal or ANY of God's creatures. So, I'm asking you to please join in and say prayers for this poor little cat. Wacoso Registered User Posts: 136 (8/19/01 3:59:25 pm) Re: A Word About this Board -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- There is no murder unless a human is dead. Killing and murdering are two different things. bbfan77777 Registered User Posts: 6 (8/19/01 4:53:15 pm) Re: A Word About this Board -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- To Wacoso, I think you'll find that if you look up "killing" in the dictionary, one of the definitions is "murder". But since the end result is the same--death--that is irrelevant. And in this particular instance, it was more than just death--it caused the cat great pain and great fear and trauma. Jamie Wacoso Registered User Posts: 138 (8/19/01 5:37:20 pm) Re: A Word About this Board -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Were you there and how do you know it felt pain, fear, and trauma? I can tell you that when I shot something it feels only one thing and that is the bullet. Go spread your message to the brainwashed masses that subscribe to this type of thought and leave it off somewhere it does not belong. bbfan77777 Registered User Posts: 8 (8/19/01 5:44:31 pm) Re: A Word About this Board -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Maybe it is *you* who should go somewhere where *you* belong. I was under the impression that this was a Christian board, and you are soiling it. And I'll bet that most of the people who post to this board feel the same way I do. I don't understand why you're making something ugly out of a prayer request, which is what this board is for. I'm quite sure that there are plenty of boards out on the internet that condone murder and killing. Perhaps you're better suited to *those* boards, rather than tainting this prayer board. Sincerely, Jamie Mike George Administrator Posts: 62 (8/19/01 7:28:48 pm) Re: A Word About this Board -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I started to delete these posts, but did not want to unduly minimize what one person evidently feels strongly about, but I think you do need some education on the matter. Jamie, Cats, nor any other animals do not have souls. The scams concerning "pet cemetaries" are exactly that - something that takes advantage and money away from people who are lonely and so emotional over one or more of God's select creatures they can be scammed into believing there is a pet heaven. Well, that just is not the case. The birds, bees, and animals were all created and put on this earth for man. After the Earth was flooded, they were even given unto man to eat. Now, I am quoting from the NIV: Genesis, Chapter 9, verses 1-3: Then God blessed Noah, and his sons, saying to them, "Be fruitful and increase in number and fill the earth. The fear and dread of you will fall upon all the beasts of the earth and all the birds of the air, upon every creature that moves along the ground, and upon all the fish of the sea; they are given into your hands. Everything that lives and moves will be food for you. Just as I gave you the green plants, I now give you everything." By the way, a little trivia here - this is why we have an appendix - it was necessary for man when he ate grass. For those of you who belittle or make small of vegetarians, keep in mind that they are only doing what man was first intended to do. Now, as far as this poor cat, think about the life it had - wandering around town, unkept and unfed, having to find its food in garbage dumpsters or getting handouts, and being made available to every other unkept animals that roamed the area, including other cats and several dogs, let alone being run over by an automobile and possibly just wounded unto death. No, Jamie, there are many people in this world and many conditions in this world we need to pray about without wasting words or especially prayers over one of God's many creatures. God told Noah and his sons right after this that Man would be held accountable for taking another Man's life, but for animals, He only insisted that we drain the animals of their lifeblood before we eat them. Well, the cat was never eaten, at least by humans. I do respect your heart, Jamie, I just think that, at least in this case, it is somewhat misplaced. Mike Edited by: Mike George at: 8/19/01 7:31:04 pm bbfan77777 Registered User Posts: 9 (8/19/01 8:46:21 pm) A Word About This Board -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Mike, Actually, it is you who needs a little further education, and I believe it is *you* who is misguided. In Genesis 1:1, it says: "God blessed them and said to them, "Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air and over every living creature that moves on the ground. Then God said, "I give you every seed-bearing plant on the face of the whole earth and every tree that has fruit with seeds in it. They will be yours for food. And to all the beasts of the earth and all the birds of the air and all the creatures that move on the ground--everything that has the breath of life in it--I give every green plant for food." And it was so." And the statement in the Bible says: "But you must not eat meat that has its lifeblood still in it." This statement means that man is not to drain the lifeblood of a living being in order to eat it. It doesn't mean that it's okay to eat it as long as we drain the lifeblood first. And as far as Queso is concerned, no, Brehm and Bowers *didn't* eat him, which only makes it worse. They did it for fun and for no valid reason at all. And as for Queso's life, a lot of people loved him and fed him on a regular basis. But even if that were not true, that still does not give Brehm and Bowers or ANYBODY the right to mutilate and kill him. So the fact that Queso was a stray with no home does not validate or justify the murder of him. I am really sorry to hear that you feel this way about the murder of an innocent cat. I am truly disappointed that you don't have any compassion for a poor cat who never did anything wrong. It almost makes me embarrassed that I'm supposed to be in the same group of people who call themselves Christians. It saddens me that you consider praying for Queso a waste of time. But, no matter how you feel about this, you will not cause me to waiver in my Christianity. There are a lot of genuine Christians. I will not let the misinterpretations and arrogance of those who falsely represent the Christian faith cause me to lose faith in God and lose faith in the world. I only hope that God is not too harsh on you when you finally meet him. Sincerely, Jamie Wacoso Registered User Posts: 139 (8/19/01 9:12:57 pm) Re: A Word About This Board -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Thank you Mike. Jamie what you fail to understand is neither of us were there of what happened to the cat and how do you push your belief of what happened and not pray for Clint and Derek in this trying time as well. I personally believe they are the ones that need the prayers now. bbfan77777 Registered User Posts: 10 (8/19/01 10:08:59 pm) Re: A Word About This Board -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Wacoso, Why do you think that we should be praying for Derek and Clint and not Queso? Is there anything you can tell me that will make me understand that reasoning? Jamie Wacoso Registered User Posts: 140 (8/20/01 12:02:42 am) Re: A Word About This Board -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- If you care more about a cat than two students that can contribute to society I think your values are a bit out of line. bbfan77777 Registered User Posts: 11 (8/20/01 1:57:15 am) Re: A Word About This Board -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- As far as my values are concerned, I'm not the one who condones murder and supports two murderers. If you think that what Bowers and Brehm have done is acceptable, then *you* are the one who has problems with values. And just what exactly do Brehm and Bowers contribute to society? Certainly not good values and good morals. Certainly not compassion and love. Certainly not setting a good example for other people to follow. Oh, I know what it is. Baseball. *That's* what they contribute. So I suppose that makes what they did all right. Apparently so, in your eyes. Well, let me tell you something--there are a lot more important things in life than baseball. And one day, you'll find that out, but when you do, it will be too late for you. Brehm and Bowers are nothing more than a couple of arrogant jerk low-lifes who got caught in a heinous act and are trying to make themselves look good. And you, my friend, are so ignorant that you can't even see that and are following along blindly. Brehm and Bowers *broke* *the* *law*. They cruely murdered an innocent cat. They didn't just shoot Queso; they skinned him, they beat him and they cut his head off. What kind of Christian are you? What kind of human *being* are you? Not one *I* care to associate with, and thank goodness I don't have to. And, I'm quite sure that now these posts *will* be deleted. So, if anybody would like to continue this conversation, my email address is [email protected]. Chris Roose Registered User Posts: 38 (8/20/01 10:50:35 am) Re: A Word About This Board -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- murder: 1) to kill (a human being) unlawfully and with predicated malice 2) the crime of unlawfully killing a person especially with malice aforethought Jamie, Why should you pray for Brehm and Bowers? Why should you not? You should pray that they learn from this horrible experience and never do anything like it again. You should pray that they will have compassion and love along with the other things you listed. As a Christian you should forgive Brehm and Bowers, that is what Christians do. And you should not judge them, as you do not know either of them. No one on this thread has said that what Brehm and Bowers did was acceptable. If you are going to tote out all this Christian stuff, then be a Christian. Forgive and pray for them, that they will contribute something worthwhile to the community in the future, instead of calling them "a couple of arrogant jerk low-lifes." Chris Roose bbfan77777 Registered User Posts: 12 (8/20/01 11:38:48 am) Re: A Word About This Board -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- As I said in a previous post, if you look up "kill" in the dictionary, one of the definitions is "murder". My question is how are they going to learn from this experience if they're not made accountable for their actions? They're adults. They knew what they were doing. They should take responsibility for their actions. You say that no one on this board has said what they did was acceptable. But no one has said it *isn't* acceptable. What's happened here is that people have said that a cat "has no soul", one person said that when he shoots something, all it feels is the bullet, one person said that we shouldn't waste our time praying for a cat, etc. Can you honestly read these posts and tell me that these posts aren't defending Brehm and Bowers and that they think what they did is okay? And when I *did* ask that someone explain their reasoning behind praying for Brehm and Bowers rather than Queso, this is the response I got: "If you care more about a cat than two students that can contribute to society I think your values are a bit out of line." What kind of response is that? Queso is the *victim* here--not Brehm and Bowers. Queso didn't do anything wrong. Brehm and Bowers did by putting him through a horrible nightmare of pain and terror. And since I came to this board, no one has expressed any kind of caring or concern about what happened to Queso. All they do is defend Brehm and Bowers. None of any of you have stood and defended Queso. *Somebody* has to. So, I'm angry. Christians are allowed to be angry. Jamie Mike George Administrator Posts: 66 (8/20/01 11:46:58 am) Re: A Word About This Board -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Jamie - your passages came from Genesis 1 - and with the Garden of Eden, that is the way it was supposed to be. There was no murder when those things happened. When was the first blood shed in the Bible? Once Man committed the firs sin, the wages of that sin was death, immediate death: Genesis 3:21 - The Lord made garments of skin for Adam and his wife and clothed them. Now, those "skins" had to come from something, and that was the first blood shed after man committed the first sin. I will be moving this post to the Religion board because we this has moved into a decent religious conversation. Besides, IF one was to pray for the cat, what would one pray - we are not Hindus. Chris Roose Registered User Posts: 39 (8/20/01 2:36:59 pm) Re: A Word About This Board -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- First of all, to clear something up...if you murder someone, you kill them; but if you kill something does not mean you murder it. It is similar to saying all fedoras are hats, but not all hats are fedoras. Murder is a type of killing and is not correct in this case because Queso is not a human being, plus I do not believe there is any premeditation or motive which is a requirement of murder. Who says they have not been made accountable? Neither you nor I know what they have been through or what consequences they have faced. One does not have to go to jail to be held accountable or to learn from an experience. I do not understand why you would pray for a dead cat instead of two people who could use your prayer. What Brehm and Bowers did was stupid, but they can be helped. Chris Roose bbfan77777 Registered User Posts: 13 (8/20/01 3:36:48 pm) Re: A Word About this Board -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Okay, fine. So what difference does it make whether you call it murder or killing? The end result is the same. Queso is dead. And if there was no motive or premeditation, Brehm and Bowers are still dangerous. If they were just walking along and decided to "kill" Queso for the heck of it, then they're obviously loose cannons who are not fit to remain in society. What makes them so special and so different that they should be excluded from punishment that anyone else who committed this crime would be required to undergo? So, I suppose you call being suspended from a couple of baseball games being made accountable? I don't. All I know is they're still in school among other students, some of who are not all that happy about being around them. And if you don't know them, then how can you defend them? Look at the scenario here: Brehm and Bowers skinned a living creature, beat him and cut his head off. Do you really think that someone who is capable of committing such a violent act is going to just all of a sudden stop because he has been suspended from a couple of baseball games and made to make a public apology? And in the apology, they don't even apologize to Queso--they just apologized for causing their family and school embarrassment? I'm praying for a "dead cat" because he was a victim of a violent crime through no fault of his own. I do would do the same thing for any *person* who was a victim of a violent crime. And I don't understand why *you* have no compassion for this poor animal. I can't even *begin* to fathom that kind of thinking. And I think using the word "stupid" to describe what Brehm and Bowers did is inappropriate. I'm sure Brehm and Bowers think it was stupid because they got caught. Jamie Mike George Administrator Posts: 71 (8/20/01 4:29:49 pm) Re: A Word About this Board -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "not fit to remain in society" because they killed a cat? Woah, woah, how about the little kid who gets his first BB-Gun and goes out and kills a sparrow. He is not going to eat it either, so let's take him out of society too. Before we start worrying about people killing cats, or shooting birds, or stepping on insects, or swatting fly and mosquitoes, let's pray for a society that kills unborn babies, and people who kill other people, and students who kill their teachers and then other students. Let's pray for small children who kill other small children and get tried as adults and really taken out of society. Your obsession over some dead, insignificant (compared to the things I mentioned) @#%$ cat is concerning. Don't get me wrong, to respect all forms of life is commendable, but to the degree whereas you place the importance of an animal's life over that of a human's, in this case two humans, well you have to be one of those "over the top" animal activists who don't even like to see animals used in experiments that can greatly benefit man and help save his life. Please correct me if I am wrong. I know I would hate to be accused of being one of those if I wasn't. Page 1 2 << Prev Topic | Next Topic >> Email This To a Friend Topic Commands (Moderator only) Subscribe Click to receive email notification of replies Unsubscribe Click to stop receiving email notification of replies jump to: Baylor FootballBaylor BasketballBaylor BaseballRecruiting - FootballRecruiting - All Other SportsSoccer / Volleyball / Cross CountryBaylor SoftballTrack and FieldLady Bears BasketballGolf and Tennis - Men & WomenGeneral BoardPolitics and ReligionThe Prayer Board - THEE BEARS' DEN MESSAGE BOARDS - The Prayer Board - TheeBearsDen - Powered By ezboard� Ver. 6.3 b4 Copyright �1999-2001 ezboard, Inc. THEE BEARS' DEN MESSAGE BOARDS > The Prayer Board > A Word About this Board Page 1 2 << Prev Topic | Next Topic >> Author Comment ScottS Registered User Posts: 138 (8/21/01 5:18:18 pm) Re: A Word About this Board -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 777777 = Auggie DrDean Registered User Posts: 152 (8/22/01 1:52:24 am) Queso -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Jamie, how long have you been a Christian? To wave the Christian flag like you do and show such ignorance of the Bible and the sanctity of HUMAN life is embarassing and appalling. The Bible states only humans have souls. We have dominion over ALL other creatures and forms of life. Your idol-like view of cats and nonhuman animal life is HERESY and not Christian at all. Do you worship a golden cat? Would you if you could? It sounds like it. As a dedicated Christian, your misguided animal worship is an affront to me and all other real Christians. Quit hiding under the name of Christ and reveal yourself for whatever Eastern religion you actually represent. Page 1 2 << Prev Topic | Next Topic >> Email This To a Friend Topic Commands (Moderator only) Subscribe Click to receive email notification of replies Unsubscribe Click to stop receiving email notification of replies jump to: Baylor FootballBaylor BasketballBaylor BaseballRecruiting - FootballRecruiting - All Other SportsSoccer / Volleyball / Cross CountryBaylor SoftballTrack and FieldLady Bears BasketballGolf and Tennis - Men & WomenGeneral BoardPolitics and ReligionThe Prayer Board - THEE BEARS' DEN MESSAGE BOARDS - The Prayer Board - TheeBearsDen - Powered By ezboard� Ver. 6.3 b4 Copyright �1999-2001 ezboard, Inc. |
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| dtaylor Registered User Posts: 18 (8/27/01 4:49:28 pm) Jamie, You Friggin' Idiot -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- How do you explain animal sacrifices and burnt offerings? Was that murder? or worship? |
| VoiceforVoiceless Registered User Posts: 1 (8/28/01 9:24:17 am) Re: A Word About this Board -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I am very disturbed at the arrogance displayed on a board that basically is designed to request prayer, and share thoughts, etc. A poster here innocently asked that you pray for that poor little cat that was cruelly and heartlessly killed by two of your students. To say that animals have no souls is to usurp God's sovereignty and arrogantly decide what is valuable or what is not valuable. Just who do we think we are? Everything that has been written down through the ages has been written via the "human" hand. I won't even attempt to discuss "interpretation," how do we know animals have no souls? WHERE IS IT WRITTEN? Have you been to Heaven? Do you know the mind of God? Have you ever looked into the eyes of an adoring dog, or stroked the silken neck of a beautiful horse and felt that possibly, these creatures are not simply non-human beings, but creatures who possess minds, a whole range of feelings and thought processes, and yes, souls! For any of you to proclaim that the Bible says animals have no souls is to take on the authority of deciding who and what is valuable and worthy of being revered, respected, and loved. If I were to ask, "who has no soul?"--Derek Brehm and Clint Bowers, or that pathetic, struggling-to-live (and now sadly murdered!) cat, Queso, based on the cirumstances surrounding Queso's death, I would not hesitate to say, Derek Brehm and Clint Bowers behaved as if THEY have no souls. No human being that professes to love God, seeks to do His will, and lives a reasonably righteous life, would ever entertain a thought of harming another living being the way they harmed Queso. But what is even sadder than their behavior, is the reaction by you, the supporters, officials, and alumni of Baylor University! It grieves me to see such overbearing, childish responses, chastising people who care about all life, including animals. You people have done more harm to this University than an army of atheists, pro-abortionists, or animal rights' extremists could ever do. And you�ve done it by smugly hiding behind the cloak of "legalism," which incidently, Christ loathed. You have made a mockery of Christianity! You should all be ashamed. Derek Brehm and Clint Bowers MUST be held accountable for their evil act. They have clearly shown they are completely devoid of feeling. God knows my heart. He knows I care about human suffering and he knows that I love animals and have dedicated my life to helping those innocents who have no voice and cannot speak for themselves but only through our compassion and care. I could forgive these two misguided men if they were indeed remorseful for Queso. Sure, they issued a "written statement" apologizing for the embarrassment they caused their families, their friends and fellow students, and the entire University and staff. But not once did they ever admit that what they did was vicious, senseless, and that they were sorry for cruelly killing Queso. To Brehm and Bowers, Queso was nothing. I find their act particularly disgusting since that pitiful cat was "homeless," struggling to survive, and willingly and trustingly came up to them to receive kindness and possibly a morsel of food. In turn, Queso is shot, beaten with a golf club, and finally skinned and decapitated. In my opinion any human being that does something so base and heartless to such an innocent little creature is either mentally unstable, or just plain "evil." They should be expelled from your University. They must stand trial, and be sentenced to jail time. They chose to carry out this heartless act. Now they must suffer the consequences. Yes, Christ will forgive them, as should the community, their friends and fellow students, and the University itself. However, to attempt to trivialize the seriousness of their act because the victim had fur and four legs is completely unacceptable! Before you start throwing stones at people who have a heart that�s big enough to care for all of God�s creation, you might just want to examine your own hearts. What you have expressed here on this board would never convince a "non-believer" that Christianity espouses love and compassion. You are very quick to shake a finger at those who do have deep compassion and accuse them of NOT being a Christian because they happen to love and respect animals. God is the judge, not you. He knows our hearts. Ask yourself, "what would Jesus do?" Do you think Jesus would not condemn their act? Yes, He would forgive them, but He would also require them to live with the consequences of their actions and abide by the laws of our land, which in this case involves paying the price for cruelty and brutality to animals. May God help us all! Susan ~ a voice for the voiceless ~ "For that which befalleth the sons of men befalleth beasts; even one thing befalleth them: as the one dieth, so dieth the other; yea, they have all one breth; so that a man hath no preeminence above a beast: for all is vanity. All go unto one place; all are of the dust, and all turn to dust again. Who knoweth the spirit of man that goeth upward, and the spirit of the beast that goeth downward to the earth?" Ecclesiastes 3:19-21 dtaylor Registered User Posts: 21 (9/5/01 10:08:13 am) Sorry, Animals do not have immortal souls -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- www.apologeticspress.org/...r9912a.htm |