"After looking at those whales you guys are catching in November
on Canadian waters, I was wondering- Is there a strategy employed?
One was casting, one trolling. One on a river, the other on GBay. Etc.
In fact, the gb-57 went against all advice and was caught on the calm
side of an island.
Some having this kind of success in the US have stated they target deep
water basins seeking cisco schools. And that these large fish rarely
leave these depths and/or baitfish schools.
After reading a comment about the Lake Ontario telemetry studies losing
track of fish once they head out to sea, and then finding them returning
later in the season fat & healthy (meaning they're eating something,
somewhere) I thought once again, baitfish schools in the deep may be
the key to finding shamoo?
To those of you cracking the code, care to share your thoughts? I'd
certainly agree with the sentiment that Club 57+ is a whole 'nother
beast altogether." - Wade
"Excellent topic Wade!, I was considering the very same . . . what
factors are necessary to produce these 54"+ 'skies.
IMHO you need 1) the extensive amount of forage fish base (cisco, smelt,
shad, etc.), 2) a very large body of water – everyone PLEASE note:
Ganonoque Ontario and Clayton New York (Art Lawton & Len Hartman)
is the essentially the beginning of the St. Lawrence, i.e. at the east
end of Lake Ontario, 3) a decent population of 'skies.
I'm probably just scratching the surface . . . my real hope is having
the 15 years that Mike and Chuck needed to chase down that Lady.
Attached is a link from the Trent U site and their thoughts on the next
WR:
-http://www.fishontario.com/articles/world-record_muskie/
Interestingly, the Larry only made #5 and GB #7; the legendary and large
bodies of water of northern Ontario took the first 4 spots on the potential
WR location ranking. It also lists the ingredients for a WR.
1 last very provoking thought > remember Striker's "Late
fall troll – how big is the bait" post? I just reread the
EAM article on the Larry and it discusses success with smaller baits
(10" or less) :
Quote:
"I also was intrigued in the small bait theory on the St. Lawrence.
Surprisingly large numbers of big fish were taken from the river on
very small baits. Some of these baits were less than five inches long.
Marc (Coulter; area guide) believes this occurs because the forage base
is made up of relatively small fish. This doesn't mean you can't
fish on the larger baits; it just seems to be the most productive to
go small."
I don't want to re-hash the large vs small debate again, but as
per the conclusion of that post, 'keep an open mind'. regards."
- mudbear
"Hi Wade, On the technique component of capturing & joining
Club57, the attached link has some great suggestions: http://www.muskystriker.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=105
Upon re-reading the thread, some common themes are: slow down the presentation,
fish deeper water especially around points & reefs, and trolling
(to cover more water). In hindsight, gb followed thru on his post in
a BIG way. ps. I really like the title of this thread! – pretty
elite territory & aspiration." -mudbear
"WOW... so much to digest... I'm not sure any of the thoughts
I have will be of any help, but I will try to talk a little about what
we are doing on the St. Lawrence. First of all, I know of only a few
people that are casting for musky in this area. A few more are jigging
(actually, they are really jigging for walleye, but also know that there
are musky around), but the majority of people, who are targeting musky,
are trolling. The St. Lawrence is a very large body of water and trolling
allows the most coverage... I know I have stated in previous letters
that Chuck and I have been fishing for Musky for about 15 years, but
we both very much feel we are new comers to this sport. This is probably
due, in part, to the rich history of musky fishing on the St. Lawrence,
and also due to the fact that when we got started we were sort of adopted
by our mentor ("The Sensei") Clayton Ferguson, "No Problem"
Fishing Charters, who has been guiding on the St. Lawrence since he
was 15 years old, and who's father was the legendary "Musky
Ferg" who fished the St. Lawrence all his life... Musky fishing
has changed drastically in our area just since Chuck and I started fishing.
With the introduction of zebra muscles in our area, and the clarity
of the water, and the demise of many of the weedbeds, we were forced
to change a number of our tactics (the old adage... adapt or die...)...
Fishing on the St. Lawrence is now all about deep water, long lines,
and bait presentation. Again, I am somewhat embarrassed by talking about
this, because I am by no means an expert in any of this, and am looking
to learn more from you guys than you probably will from me. The debate
or discussion on trying to target large fish certainly appears to be
a universal one, and is something that is talked about non-stop on the
St. Lawrence. Of course, as I am constantly reminded, the more I think
I know, the more I get confused. I certainly believe that catch and
release has saved our fishery, and would argue that point to my death...
We are now at a 48" legal size limit (from 44") and I would
love to see it go to 50 or 52 inches. We have certainly had our best
years (both in size and quantity) over the last 3 or 4 years, and we
continue to catch a variety of sizes. This year we have caught a 35",
a number of fish in the 40" to 45", and four fish in the 50
inch class (a 50", two 54", and a 57")... We now have
a total of 15 fish in 12 trips (our hottest streak came between Nov.
8th - 11th when we caught 7 fish in 4 trips). We are constantly looking
for baitfish, and there is belief that the temperature of the water
affects feeding patterns. We know that later in the year, after the
water temperature drops, the fish that we have caught always leave a
ton of poop in the back of our boat, and appear to be gorging themselves
on baitfish. We have friends that fish Lake St. Clair in the summer
and they report the same thing there. It is interesting to note, that
in the summer they troll smaller bait at faster speeds, and than use
larger baits and slower speeds in the fall. In reading some of the posts
on this forum, the idea of larger bait and slower speeds in the fall
seems to be used in casting as well. Well, I have managed to ramble
on, and I really do not know if I have answered anyone's questions,
so I will end here and wait to see if anyone replies... Again, I would
like to thank Musky Striker, and everyone else for all the positive
feedback and comments..." -finlander (aka- Mike Kehoe)
"You answered a ton of questions I had or would have had after
you answered the first ones. The temp/baitfish concept is very interesting.
Since I am a caster (trolling is illegal on 90% of my usual haunts)
any info concerning trolling is appreciated. Big water and trolling
certainly seem to go hand in hand. I know when I'm casting in 10,000
acres of wild blue, it seems so pitiful (at least when I strike out).
Well it's that great US tradition and I must go EAT, watch NFL football
and then EAT some more or I will be drummed out of America.
Congrats again Finlander on an amazing C&R. And thanks ALL for answering
my query! Cheers! ps- mudbear, your post pre-dated mine by a month.
Had I read it, I probably would have saved the bandwidth. EVERYONE on
this board should be granted ambassador status by your MNR! You've
all twitched Canadian water so successfully, I'm way past primed
to venture past the Windsor blockade. I'm guessing those like me
in the USA are also dreaming of "next season" on the shield..."
-Wade
"Thanks again everyone for the kind words and interest. Wow, what
a forum to talk and learn about musky fishing.
As far as size of bait is concerned... we fish (and are true "believers")
Believer lures... We have had luck on most of them, although we have
our favorites (primarily natural colors). We use the 8" and 10"
(both straight and jointed)... We use to use Radtke and Creek Chubs
(they are 7" double jointed lures), but have been using primarily
Believers over the last 4 or 5 years. When we fished Lake St. Clair
in the summer, we were trolling with smaller baits (Stalkers and Super
Stalkers, Loki, and small believers) at a faster speed.
With regard to water temperatures... I don't have any research,
other than what I have experienced, and what I can learn/steal from
other fisherman. There has been a long standing belief that musky gorge
in the fall in order to build up fat for the winter and that this feeding
frenzy is triggered by the temperature of the water... thus, the colder
temps. in the fall trigger better fishing... again, I have no idea if
this is true or not, but I do know that the fish we catch later in the
year crap all over our boat... I have also heard stories that you should
troll slower in the fall because their metabolism slows down in colder
water temperatures... I don't know about this idea... we troll slow
because we feel that the bait we use presents itself better at the speeds
we use (we troll around 2.5 to 3.5 miles an hour), and that seems to
work best for us. I know there are others that troll faster, and I am
sure that they catch fish too... As far as the fish moving slower...
well, I have no proof of this, and, in fact, the fish I have felt on
the other end of the line feel like they are moving pretty fast... If
their metabolism has slowed, I would hate to see them when they have
sped up again!!! But again, this is just from my personal experience,
and I am sure there are others that know much more about this topic
than I..." -finlander
"Wade, The other thread took a course along the methods perspective.
Yours more on location and habitat ingredients – as well as methods.
Both are very insightful and necessary. I think if we started another
thread it would take on a life of its own . . . gotta luv the variety
of knowledge and experiences! ps. It's harder to get into this club
than Steve Rubell's. Thanks. -mb (now I'm a 'believer'!)."
REPROBAIT LURES
is a brand new manufacturer of baits derived from the Out2llunge line.
The Hitman, Slim Jim and Delinquent are all outstanding
baits handmade with quality by O2L. Probably a little bigger bait than
most in Sawyer County tend to throw as well so there's probably
something NEW to add to your tacklebox.
Joining
the ReproBait Team is Musky-man Spinnerbaits with Mark's complete
roster of safety-pin style SBs, in-lines & buzzers. I recently
ordered a custom-tied Red Knight from Mark which is a 2 oz. spinnerbait
with red & black hair, flash hackle and changeable blades (and
bucktails too)! It is one fine piece of work Mark!
I'd also like to mention that I received the advance copy of the
BRAND NEW ReproBaits' DVD - Musky & Pike Tackle
Making!!! A no-frills, straight-up 2 disc set featuring
Out2llunge and Musky Man
presenting techniques & tips on lure making.
Covering crankbaits, jerkbaits, bucktails, spinnerbaits, leaders and
much, much more, this DVD will provide you with the perfect resource
to launch your new bait making endeavor. As someone grinding out my
own walk-the-dog surface gliders for almost 15 years, I didn't
realize how much I stood to learn until I watched this DVD on "Musky
& Pike Bait Making". Everything you need to know is covered
including some common mistakes you'll want to avoid THE FIRST
TIME.
Visit them today at www.reprobaitlures.com and be sure to let 'em
know Wade sent ya!
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