Posted by Jaypeeto [Jaypeeto] on April 01, 1999 at 07:04:16 {feW1wc1uNQ/CPYT8orz2Hq/lZhRVmk}:
In Reply to: ***Friend-False prophecy posted by Friend on March 31, 1999 at 17:59:32:
Hi Friend!
On this statement,
"the automatic condemnatory judgment of Deuteronomy 18 is not applied by
Jesus towards his followers. That being the case then it is
inappropriate for any Christian today to apply that
automatic judgment.
Jesus allowed time for repentance."
====== re the automatic condemnatory judgment
is not applied (automatically) by jesus...
you make a salient point.
I fully agree that Jesus allows time for repentance,
and probably a lot more than my hot temper would sometimes allow, even tho' I'm workin' real hard on that!
The question, for me, is ARE THESE MEN IN BROOKLYN really "followers" of Jesus, regardless of their subjective opinion to be
so?
I won't say they don't WANT to be, that's not my place. The question, even bigger, for me,
is DID Jesus EVER, in point of FACT, APPOINT these
men to ANY office of oversight over Christians whatsoever?
My answer to THAT, considering
1) their BASIC doctrines (predictions irrelevant).
2) their claim to have restored apostolic
early christianity.
3) the clear evidence that NOBODY ever
held these basic interpretations
in the first 2
centuries A.D. (C.E.)
(complete APART from the issue of
their numerous failed predictions!!)
4) compared with the promise of Jesus
(made repeatedly in different ways)
that the True Faith would never
vanish from the earth in order to
"have to be" "restored" 1800 years later.
in light of the foregoing, in light of their claim of a GRADUAL apostasy (note THAT!) in the first three centuries FROM the BASIC SYSTEM of doctrine which
they now hold (APART COMPLETELY from the issue of any predictions about 1914, 1925, 1935, 1975, whenever), in light of clear historical evidence that NO APOSTASY took place, EVER, from an early JW Doctrinal System of
Interpretations,
that is clear proof that
a) They have NOT been raised up
by God to "restore" early Christianity's
doctrinal system,
therefore
b) Their claim to have been raised up to
do PRECISELY THAT, is a
false claim.
therefore
c) Their "office" is false at it's
very foundations, regardless of their
REPEATED ASSERTION to be
"Jehovah's Chosen Theocratic Representatives,"
and to be "The Faithful and Discreet
Slave"
whom God has "APPOINTED over ALL his
belongings."
Their claim is no more historically grounded than is the claim of the leadership of the
MORMON church to have DONE THE SAME THING.
So, for me, the question of
repentance becomes even bigger than just a repentance from making
repeated false predictions. These men
operate on the basis of their claimed RIGHT and GOD GIVEN RIGHT, mind you, to PULL PEOPLE OUT
of historic Christianity and
INTO the Society
and UNDER their (claimed) AUTHORITY over all
God's Belongings.
My statement is that they have NO such authority, and never have had it.
You raised another point, Friend:
"On the other hand, there is no
indication today that Jesus is providing
personal chastisement toward any Christian group,"
===that is your sincere opinion, and I respect that, but I also have to respectfully disagree.
I regard the bloody 16th century revolt
known as the Reformation as a POWERFUL CHASTISEMENT
by Jesus Christ, which I believe that he allowed to happen, in order to shake the Catholic Church OUT of it's 16th century materialism, greed, and hypocrisy, and I say THAT without
approving of the unique doctrines of the Reformers.
And I believe he disciplines the Church TODAY too.
And will continue to do so, because the
Church ALWAYS needs that.
I appreciate your candor, even if on some points I have to disagree with you.
Best to you,
Jaypeeto :)