Posted by WW on March 21, 1999 at 10:09:20 {MWOuU2yvobPRY}:
There is a lot of reason to place one's faith in science and I will not critisize those who decide this is for them personally. That is a decision for each one to make and reflects in no way on their character or morals. I would like to point out that the Talk Origins site has a lot of fine information but it does not in the least convince me that there is no God.
GAP: "The modern assemblage can be traced with little question to the base of the Eocene" says Carroll
(1988). But
before that, the origins of the very earliest primates are FUZZY. There is a group of Paleocene primitive primate-like
animals called "plesiadapids" that MAY BE ancestral to primates, or may be "cousins" to
primates. (see Beard, in Szalay
et al., 1993.)
Palaechthon, Purgatorius (middle Paleocene) -- Very primitive plesiadapids. To modern eyes they look
NOTHING LIKE primates, being simply pointy-faced, small early mammals
with mostly primitive teeth, and claws
instead of nails. But they show the first signs of primate-like teeth; lost an incisor and a premolar, and had
relatively blunt-cusped, squarish molars.
GAP: Here's that
Oligocene gap mentioned above in the timescale. Very few primate fossils are known between the
late Eocene and early Oligocene, when there was a sharp change in global climate. Several other mammal groups have a similar gap.
Dryopithecus (mid-Miocene) -- A later ape PROBABLY ancestral to the great apes & humans. At this point
Africa & Asia connected via Arabia, and the non-gibbon apes divided into two lines:
1.Sivapithecus
(including "Gigantopithecus" & "Ramapithecus", mid- Miocene) -- Moved to Asia & gave
rise to the orangutan.
2.Kenyapithecus (mid-Miocene, about 16 Ma) -- Stayed in Africa & gave rise to the African great
apes
& humans.
Wait, but look here, where is the evidence?
GAP: There are NO KNOWN fossil hominids or apes from Africa between 14 and 4 Ma. Frustratingly, molecular data shows that this is when the African great apes
(chimps, gorillas) diverged from hominids, probably 5-7 Ma.
The gap MAY BE another case of poor fossilization of forest animals. At the end of the gap we start finding some very ape-like
bipedal hominids:
Australopithecus
ramidus (mid-Pliocene, 4.4 Ma) -- A recently discovered very early hominid (or early
chimp?), from just after the split with the apes. Not well known. Possibly bipedal (only the skull was found).
Teeth both apelike
and humanlike; one baby tooth is very chimp-like. (White et al., 1994; Wood 1994)
This is evidence of a conclusive variety? We are supposed to forget faith in God's role in creation due to 'evidence' like this? Lemurs and then ape-like
hominds? A tooth like a baby chimp? Molars similiar to an ape? A skull or skull fragment?
Not well known, possibly, GAPS in fossil lines, may be, could be, might be, may never be!!!
Scientists seem to have as many 'outs' as your
average Jdub on the writing committee! For the crucial time period there is not even a FOSSIL RECORD! This statement is incredible:
To modern eyes they look
nothing like primates, being simply pointy-faced, small early
mammals with mostly primitive teeth, and claws
instead of nails. But they show the first signs of primate-like teeth; lost an incisor and a premolar, and had relatively blunt-cusped, squarish molars.
Yes, I realize that this
is only part of one page on the web site. I have looked at other pages here and have not been convinced of many of the assertions made. The results are not conclusive enough to rule out the handiwork of a creator at some point in the
evolutionary chain, where it even exists in enough links to be confirmed that is.
Even granting 97% of our DNA is the same as apes confirms nothing as far as us not being created beings, whether in mid-stream or original. Would not the
DNA be expected since we are all made from the same substances and along similar designs?
I have moved on at least. I can see that evolution does not necessarily conflict with the existence of a creator. However, it falls far short of
explaining life and it's development to the degree that I would forsake faith.
WW