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| ON THE OTHER HAND |
| My Favorite La Sallite
By Antonio C. Abaya Written Dec. 17, 2006 For the Standard Today, December 19 issue. The expanded e-version of my article Shame on You, Joe (Dec. 12), with its reference to my batch mate Jose de Venecia�s academic background in La Salle and Ateneo, drew angry protests from La Sallites. In fairness, I am reproducing excerpts from the angriest ones � but not from the one or two who used insulting language. These all appear or will soon appear in full in www. tapatt.org, together with the other reactions to that article, most of which did not comment on the Ateneo-La Salle thing. Cristine C. Remollo (AB, Batch �84 � DLSU, LLB Batch �88 �AdeMU) wrote: �Re your article below, I totally agree with you. However, you spoiled the whole point when you generalized at the end with �Perhaps he learned it in La Salle .� You should have stopped at your main discourse. Worse, with just one sentence, you lost your credibility, as well as that of your arguments. Shame on you, Tony!� Ben Santos: �I am a nominal La Sallite having gotten my BS Commerce degree from La Salle . And I do not take offense at your allusion that JDV learned his crooked ways at La Salle . However, since he spent a lot of time at the Ateneo, he must have honed it to perfection at your school�� (Actually, I did not accuse JDV of being crooked. Engineering the Con-Ass was an act of deviousness, not an act of crookedness. ACA) Pamela (no last name given): �I agree with you except for that last sentence of what JdV learned in La Salle . Maybe it should be what he learned in Ateneo since this is where he took his college and where he was influenced to be what he is now. Have you ever asked what Erap has learned in Ateneo? At least La Salle openly took a stand in asking GMA to take the supreme sacrifice. Maybe you should concentrate on writing your article and not on your insecurities. Stay focused, my friend.!� Oscar Lagman: �No, Tony, JdV could not have learned it from La Salle because JdV was there when the Christian Brothers were all newly-arrived young Americans in their 20s, fired only with the mission of spreading the word of God and teaching the American way of life, the older Brothers having been massacred by the crazed Japanese soldiers during the Liberation of Manila on February 12, 1945. Joe, like Erap and Gloria, could have only learned it at the Philippine bastion of the Jesuits, from which �switik� is derived.� Ruben Umali (DLSC BSC �67): �You don�t need anybody to tell you that you have every right to criticize JDV in print regarding his position on Con-Ass. To be personal about it and even to the extent of taking a �competing� school�s name along with your opinion speaks well of your lack of formation and good breeding, not as an Atenean per se (because I have several sincere and well-bred friends from this school), but a poorly educated Atenean. Sayang ka!� Nelson Cruz: �Shame on you for dragging La Salle �s name on your tirade against JdV. Anong pakialam ng La Salle kay JDV. Didn�t he study at Ateneo during his college days? Tsk tsk. Didn�t you know?� Sonny Martinez : �I understand your disgust about J. D. Venecia�s role in the Con-Ass issue. I agree as you�ve written: �it was a historic and overwhelming vote for naked and brazen self-interest.� However up to this writing, I still can�t imagine how a man of your background could insinuate that J. D. Venecia may have learned the brazenness displayed in the Con-Ass at La Salle . �I consider it as an irresponsible, uneducated remark . I must say I am offended. I take it as a slur against La Sallites��� Felix Zamar: �I might be persuaded that JdV learned the beginnings of a trapo in La Salle , but I have this sinking feeling that he learned the finer points of wheeling and dealing in Ateneo. This is where Erap probably learned womanizing and petty acting together with his top notch lawyer�.� Lilit Cuisia (DLSC GS �58, DLSC HS �62, DLSC BSCHE �67): �I have written you sometime back about your book � Europe by Scooter�. After my initial anger and disgust, I feel I should allow you to explain your (remarks) and what you EXACTLY meant by �Perhaps he learned it in La Salle .� Below is a copy of your (remark) which I find offensive and self_________. Well, you supply the adjective since you are so good in words and you know what I mean�..� I meant absolutely nothing by it, Lilit. It was just a joke. An ill-advised joke, it turned out, and I apologize for ruffling green and white feathers with it. But don�t you guys have any sense of humor? In the 1960s, when I was the only member in Joma�s Kabataang Makabayan who came from an �elitist� school, I got a lot of ribbing from my comrades from UP and Lyceum, some of it not necessarily good-natured. But I did not lose any sleep over it. My father had studied in UP and Cornell, but he sent me to the Ateneo and Northwestern. My mother had gone to Santa Escolastica (today�s St. Scho) and my wife to St. Theresa�s (now defunct), but we sent our two daughters to La Salle Zobel for high school, from where Carla went on to the Philippine School for Interior Design, and Gina to Assumption and then to UC Berkeley. It wasn�t planned that way. It just happened that way. Joe College adolescent sentiments are therefore not a big thing in our family. But it does not mean we do not take pride in our schools or do not cherish our happy memories there. Admittedly, the Ateneo-La Salle rivalry does not excite me. The last Ateneo-La Salle basketball game that I ever watched, live or on TV, must have been in 1955 or 1956, before I left for the US . I haven�t watched any since I got back in 1961. And, oh yes, my Favorite La Sallite is my only son Hochi, who also attended La Salle Zobel for high school and then went on to La Salle Taft for college, where he was on the Dean�s List more often than not, graduating in 1990. He has been accepted at the City College of London for postgraduate studies. I am very proud of him, and I respect the school that educated him. ***** Reactions to [email protected]. Other articles since 2001 in www.tapatt.org OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO |
| Reactions to �My Favorite La Sallite�
I take pride of being an Atenean, but I never look down on other people because of their educational background or being a La Sallite (just kidding). Narciso Ner, [email protected], Dec. 20, 2006 Atenean wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww Hi, Tony. This article really made me laugh. I am a green-blooded La Sallite from Prep to MBA, but it seems I may be the only one who agreed with what JDV did. Again, I reiterate my belief in him. Did you watch Senator Gordon, the fanatic Atenean, in Dong Puno's Viewpoint? Dong Puno, another Atenean, got the shock of his life when he heard Senator Gordon say in front of millions of viewers that actually he was in favor of Con-Ass. As if that was not enough, he continued and said he does not know anyone in the Senate who believes in Con-Con. Of course, the clinker (you mean, the clincher. ACA) was when he said the only reason the Senate was against Con-Ass was because the House of Rep wanted joint votation instead of separate votation. In short, because the Senators knew the House had the numbers, and they knew the House wanted a unicameral parliament, they knew a joint votation would only sound the death knell of the Senate. They accused the House of being self-serving, when actually it was them who was being self-serving. Now, who do you say was being devious and dishonest? The Senate surely fooled a lot of people. Except many La Sallites like me. hah-hah. Bobby Tordesillas, [email protected], Dec. 20, 2006 La Sallite wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww Bravo, Tony! You had the last word and it was brilliant. As a La Sallite myself, I congratulate you for that fine piece you wrote about JdV and Con-Ass, school rivalries notwithstanding. As Iking Santos (my former colleague and mentor in PAL) would say, "May your tribe increase!" Merry Christmas and a prosperous New Year to you and your family (tribe, that is). Archie (Lacson), [email protected], Dec. 20, 2006 La Sallite wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww It was clear that you meant it as a joke. Obviously, these guys have no sense of humor. Oh, my! Aurora Pijuan, [email protected], Dec. 20, 2006 wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww Can Abaya be coaxed to write about his favorite Atenean? It could very well be any of the following: Erap, the First Gentleman, or, yes, JdV. Ramon L. Dolor, [email protected], Dec. 20, 2006 MY REPLY. My Favorite (living) Atenean is Antonio Meloto, founder of Gawad Kalinga, about whom I have written two pieces. As for Erap, I have referred to him in four or five columns as �a criminally inclined ignoramus.� To which, he wrote in reply that �I do not understand what it means.� wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww Ha! They take offense and I wonder why, JDV definitely does not. ChaSanPh, [email protected], Dec. 20, 2006 wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww Dear Tony, From the looks of it, neither school wants to have anything to do with him. On the other hand, it is probably a fair statement to say that our best educational institutions, both private and public, have fallen short in bringing out a strong sense of patriotism that we would have liked to see, a sense of noblesse oblige. Also, without meaning to, you probably touched a raw nerve, only present in the rivalry between these two schools. Eduardo L. David, [email protected], Dec. 20, 2006 wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww No offense meant, but from the beginning you know very well that politics dwells wherever the wind blows. So by the looks on Speaker de Venecia's ears, he truly deserves it. hehehehe! Don't ever inspire your children to do the same being in the same school, for after the next several generations, same observations and comments might come out. hehehehehe! Jun Pulido, [email protected], Dec. 20, 2006 wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww Well, Neither am I a La Sallite nor an Atenean. However, come to think of this. The presidents, senators, congressmen and loud politicians mainly came from U.P., Ateneo, San Beda and La Salle . Now, look at our country. Its politically divided, morally-challenged, corruption is at its' best, and low - morale among the many. I think most schools focus more on the academic competence rather than value-formation, Catholic-run schools pa ang karamihan. I studied college at UST, and the religion classes then were more on the study on the WHAT of religion rather than the WHY of it. Sa kanila, basta't wag ka lang pumatay, ok lang magnakaw. Parang ganun ang thinking ng mga tao, both the educated and the less fortunate. Take the case of JDV. To my mind, he is no ordinary person, intellectually and politically. Magaling talaga yang tao na yan. He wouldn�t reach the point where he is now kung common thinker lang yan. Alam naman ng lahat na manloloko yan, but he can still manage to tie strings and become the Speaker. He is just a corrupt person. May mali talaga eh. People know if one is sincere and one is full of crap. I think he is more of the latter. Takang taka lang ako sa mga taga Pangasinan, why they elect this guy eh, mas maraming Panggalatok ang mas deserving jan. Anyway, something�s wrong with this country. Thanks, Tony! Mike Delgado, [email protected], Dec. 20, 2006 wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww Good sense of humor, Tony. We could only be glad we didn't turn out to be a JDV and company no matter what school we graduated from. Best wishes to you all from both schools. Jose C. Balmadrid, [email protected], Dec. 20, 2006 wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww Dear Tony, (hope you don�t mind my calling you this) I was shaking my head as I read the reactions....as you well know I have been following your tapatt for sometime and do put my two-cents once in awhile...As you said, there's nothing wrong with some sense of humor...judging by the situation that we have all around us. I for one have always dreamt that one of my kids would be able to study in Ateneo or UP, from hearing about the prestige and all the hooplah that goes with it. . I come from a traditional Chinese school, having a total strict Chinese education which I must say I am proud to have. Not till I reached UST for my architecture course did I realize that we were way advanced in our math as well as in our study habits in my modest traditional Chinese school.. . However, fate has its turns. My husband and I had the chance to give our son an education from Xavier in High School. I might say that I was a little disappointed when he decided to choose LaSalle instead. His reason touched our hearts, so to speak - he can commute and it will be more economical....I will have a daughter who will enter the university next school year. She still hasn�t decided yet which school she will be calling as her alma mater, if ever... To put it simply, I think that no matter what school one goes to, it is always the person himself who will do and make his own destiny. One from an elitist school might end up being the biggest big time smuggler or drug pusher or one from a far-flung region could very well be a chief justice who has the best of morals and conviction... Mr Tony, may I request that this comment will not be published...People might be thinking that I am pulling you leg...My commenting here was to show that I understand very well where you were coming from, when I read that issue re JoDementia...I just smiled when I read that line, but shrugged it off.. Although I was anticipating that you might get in hot waters with that comment, and true enough.. but I never thought it would be such an "issue"... Well, some people are as passionate as the issue that we are all facing right now.... Merry Christmas to you, sir, and bountiful blessings for you and your family. I congratulate you for having such well-bred off-springs...It�s in the family, i suppose Regards, (Name and email address withheld on request) Dec. 20, 2006 . wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww It�s a pity that in the face of a much larger and substantive issue, some would instead focus on the trivialities of the LaSalle/Ateneo school rivalry... Nonoy Yulo, [email protected], Dec. 20, 2006 wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww Antonio Thoroughly enjoyed your article! Enjoyed the passionate responses, especially from my classmate Oscar Lagman, who somehow is so much a Brown American it shows. "Christian Brothers were all newly-arrived young Americans in their 20s...� .What this has to do with Joe is beyond me! C�est la vie! Merry Christmas. Jayjay (Calero), [email protected], Dec. 20, 2006 La Sallite wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww Yes, lighten up, guys. As proud parents of children who went to different schools, our pride, like yours, rests more on what they have achieved academically and professionally. BTW, we have a daughter too who studied at Assumption ( San Lorenzo ) in the early'80's and then went to UC Berkeley ('89, Industrial Eng'g.). She eventually became a lawyer and member of the California Bar. She studied law (juris doctor) at the University of San Francisco , a "switik" school, too, like your Alma Mater. Best regards Ruth and Tom de Guzman, [email protected], Dec. 20, 2006 . Peace and Joy Every Conscious Moment! wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww Hi Tony, I took my grade school in Xavier. Took my high school in Ateneo. Took two years in Ateneo College . Took one year in Maryknoll. Took three weeks in LaSalle (OK, not La Salle but Benilde...boring). I�d say JDV got the worst of both worlds. I don�t care about the rivalry myself. It�s just stupid. When I have kids I�m not sending them to either school. Merry Christmas. Jaime Garchitorena, [email protected], Dec. 20, 2006 wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww Please don't extend the insult in your remarks about La Salle by claiming we La Sallites have no sense of humor. A sincere mea culpa would have been received better. M. Gonzalez, [email protected], Dec. 20, 2006 wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww I went to La Salle and then to Columbia in New York , and am still a poor journalist. On the other hand, I have friends who never finished college after graduating from San Beda who are now millionaires. Diplomas aren�t everything. It�s what�s within that makes one win or lose. And, of course, money isn�t everything. Manny Teodoro, [email protected], Bogota, Colombia, Dec. 21, 2006 La Sallite wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww Schools do not teach illegalities, they are only done in practice. Nonoy Ramos, [email protected], Pennsylvania , Dec. 21, 2006 wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww Hahahahaha. Joe de V got you. Angie Diaz, [email protected], Dec. 21, 2006 wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww Dear Tony, Your column criticizing La Salle caused so much uproars from Lasallites. There are good and bad eggs in every school. Ateneo has its share of bad products. Former DOJ Secretary Nani Perez is an Atenean. FG Mike "Jose Pidal" Arroyo is an Atenean. There's an Ateneo Mafia within the Department of Justice and in other government agencies. By mentioning your son also studied at La Salle doesn't help calm the tension you have created. Next time some Green Archers see you on the street, they might shoot you with their arrows. Do you know why La Salle always beats Ateneo in academics and sports? Because the Green Archers can shoot down flying bald Eagles! Mario Yuzon, [email protected], Dec. 21, 2006 wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww You're forgiven, Tony. Ateneans make a lot of mistakes and they're only human. My take on the issue is that while JDV went to both schools, he failed to live up to the values and ethical standards he was supposedly taught at La Salle and Ateneo. The greater concern I have is that JDV symbolizes a society that is generally failing to perform in an upright manner, unable to consistently and firmly apply the values and ethical standards that our educational system is supposed to inculcate in everyone. The span and depth of corrupt / criminal practices - cheating, lying, stealing, extorting, killing - and the extent of ambivalence and apathy towards the common good and the national interest, are indicative of the failure to properly educate (at home and in school), and reflected in the state of the state and the softness of society. And we call ourselves a Christian country? We are a society where "I, me and myself" has left no room for "we, us and all of us." That's what our elected leaders have shown time and again, and that's the kind that the electorate keeps electing. Educational reform should be everyone's business if we are to survive as a nation and improve quality of life for the benefit of future generations. My favorite La Sallites are my father, Rafael Alunan, Jr. (+) and Jose W. Diokno (+), who selflessly lived up to the values and ethical standards they learned at home and in school. As for me, I'm a green thoroughbred from start (La Salle Bacolod, grade school and high school) to finish (De La Salle Taft, LiaCom '70). I belonged to an activist class that had participants in the First Quarter Storm, Edsa 1 and 2. As a witness to all three events spanning 37 years, I note with sadness that most of our problems then remain very much with us today; we keep repeating the same mistakes, proof of our continuing failure to educate ourselves properly. At the rate things are going, we will find ourselves staring at 1972 all over again if we, the people, do not collectively rise up now and put an end to the foolishness once and for all. Let me end in the same way I always greet our good friend Dick Gordon - Ateneo bulok! Hahahaha!!!!! Rafael Alunan III, [email protected], Dec. 21, 2006 La Sallite wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww Dear Tony: You really ruffled a lot of LaSallite feathers with your column on Joe de Venecia. I read that column, too, but I do not recall you ever saying that JdV learned being a crook at LaSalle. If you did, then of course LaSallites, who love their alma mater deeply, would feel offended. But because you did not, to my own recollection, I think those who took offense did so probably because they misunderstood what you wrote about JdV on this specific point. One last point: No school ever teaches a student how to be a crook. Let me know of a school, any school, which has Crook 101 in its curriculum--if you can. If later in life a student becomes a crook, it would be safe to say that he/she learned to be one somewhere else, but not at the school where he was once a student. Mariano Patalinjug, [email protected], Yonkers , NY , Dec. 21, 2006 wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww Dear Tony, This is the first time I have written you. I thought the Salle-Ateneo rivalry of eons ago was no longer in existence. Those La Sallites who responded angrily are thin-skinned and showed their immaturity over what I considered a joke. As a La Salitte this should be a non-issue. They should get a life. Let bygones be bygones . Ralph (Romero), [email protected], Houston , Texas , Dec. 21, 2006 La Sallite wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww Sir, I also came from De La Salle-Lipa, went to PMA for my BS and UP for my MA. I feel bad when LaSallites and PMAers are being tagged with so many negative adjectives and subsequently affecting the institutions in which they came from. However, we should learn how to police our ranks! We should also make sure that the people are aware that we do not condone misbehaving alumni. I AM MORE EMBARRASSED BY THE ACTIONS OF MY CO-ALUMNI RATHER THAN BY THE CRITICISMS OF MY ALMA MATER. God Bless po and More Power! Vonne Villanueva, [email protected], Dec. 21, 2006 wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww Tony, Tony, you should have known better than to take a poke at De La Salle, knowing the eternal rivalry between the two schools. I know you meant it as a joke, but this happens to be an extremely sensitive ground where sense of humor is nonexistent. When I read your column, I already predicted a barrage of violent reactions with your detractors bringing in Erap, who could barely be considered a legitimate Atenean, not even warming his classroom seat. I myself was educated at Xavier University (Ateneo de Cagayan) and take pride in being an Atenean, but I recently opted to get my certificate in Teaching English as a Second/ Foreign Language at De La Salle University. Two of my daughters went to De La Salle for college, and my son finished high school at La Salle Greenhills. At home I'm the minority, so it's never a topic of discussion at the dinner table even if I have great faith in my own education.. Regards, Yett Montalvan, [email protected], Dec. 21, 2006 wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww Don�t lose sleep over it, Tony. La Sallites are very sensitive people. I thought it was a nice joke. But the reaction of some of the La Sallites, one or two I personally know, was even funnier --- and I was rolling on the floor while reading them. Glicerio Sicat, [email protected], Dec. 21, 2006 La Sallite wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww Tony, I am happy my parents sent me to San Beda College. Mike Moreno. [email protected], Richmond , B.C. Canada , Dec. 21, 2006 wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww I�m not bothered at all by graduates of either school. I have two brothers who graduated from high school in La Salle and two nephews who graduated from Ateneo and they are all perfectly mature adults with good and moral judgment. It just so happened that JDV is an emotional, mental, developmental and moral retardate child of a morally lesser god. This will sound like hitting below the belt but I look back to his genes and the parenting he had. Exposure to school and environment are just ways of perfecting how he was shaped from the womb. Let us all hope that he and rest of the members of Congress (include GMA and her bitter half) review their growing up years and try to determine why they are what they are and get rid of their baggages. They might still be saved from the fires of hell. I can tolerate your less kind words. Long live UP! Pura Flor Isleta, [email protected], , Dec. 21, 2006 wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww Helloer, First of all best wishes for the New Year. The reactions you got to your "JdV/La Salle" article were hilarious. These guys either do not have a sense of humour or missed the point entirely. Nash Toledo, [email protected], UK, Dec. 27, 2006 wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww Reactions to �Post Office Thievery� (Dec. 07) When I was processing my dual citizenship at the Immigration office in Manila , the clerk told me that they do not use the regular postal mail; instead I have to come and get my certification at their office. Though I'm surprised in this modern age but I realized now why we cannot get our business be more efficient because we lack an honest postal service. Postal service can help the economy if they can deliver checks enclosed in letters. It saves business cost and provide efficiency in business transactions, but such things are totally unknown to the crooks in the post office because their interest is only for themselves. The Philippine Post Office requires cleaning. I wish we can recall Mr. Golez to purge the crooks. Nonoy Ramos, [email protected], Pennsylvania , Dec. 27, 2006 wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww Hello, Mr. Abaya! I'm amazed and also pleased that Filipinos from other parts of the world responded to your article. You can even start a movement. How about starting in January 2007 "Keep Philippine Cool" campaign. The idea is to start planting trees all over the country. Then maybe later we can build playgrounds which every community is sorely lacking. If we play together then maybe we can truly become a community. Wishes for a Happy New Year to you and your loved ones! I hope you will continue to keep this communication going. In 2007 let us celebrate the Good Pinoys! They are the staffs and volunteers of the community-based health projects, the Fil-Ams who are giving them their undying support, the Americans who allowed the Filipino struggle into their hearts and to the local supporters of the cause. Good luck to you. I think you are going to wake up a sleeping Juan de la Cruz. Lucita Luciani, [email protected], Dec. 28, 2006 wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww Hi Tony, Thanks for including my note (see above) in your "Reaction to My Favorite La Sallite" article but there is a little error that I must correct soonest (I just read this article a couple of minutes ago). I was tagged as a "La Sallite". While I would be most proud to be tagged as such, I do not deserve being part of such stratospheric group of people because I did not have the opportunity to study at La Salle . The closest I got to La Salle was when I took the Masters in Business Management Program that was a joint venture (or some such structure) between La Salle and Ateneo (U.P. was supposed to be part of it but, as I understand it, U.P.'s charter would not allow it to be part of a consortium). It was a true merger of the two schools and we had very good samplings of both Ateneo and La Salle graduates, except that we were housed in Ateneo Padre Faura and we received Ateneo diplomas upon graduation. The Ateneo/La Salle MBM Program was discontinued when it was taken over by the Asian Institute of Management. So maybe you can tag me as an Atenean but, heaven forbid, not a La Sallite! (Joke only!!!) Glicerio Sicat, [email protected], Jan. 09, 2007 OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO |