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Doctor patient discussion after WHI trial partially halted
Posted to alt.support.menopause by Terri 07/12/2002
author retains copyright and responsibility for content
to WHI trial   
to Alice through the menopause   
(another personal response)   
 
 "A Wyeth spokesman said the company hadn't seen the suit but doesn't believe there is any legal or factual basis for any claims against the company related to Prempro or the study. Wyeth has sent 500,000 letters to doctors and other health-care providers urging them to consider when they talk to patients the "critical role" Prempro has in relieving the symptoms of menopause."
I'd love to be a fly on the wall during one of these discussions between doctor and patient.  Let's see how it might go.

Ms X is a 52 year old woman who's been taking prempro for 6 months for hot flashes and night sweats.  While her hot flashes and night sweats are improved somewhat, she also has irregular bleeding, sore breasts and considerable water retention.  Her doctor has urged her to persevere with the drug to see if this will all improve over time.  But Ms X listens to the news, gets a little concerned, and makes an appointment to discuss taking these drugs for a longer period of time.
 

Ms X : I hear that taking these pills may cause me to have a heart attack, a stroke, a blood clot in my lung and after 4 years will increase my risk of breast cancer.  Is that right, doctor?

Dr. Y: Well it's possible that this drug might increase your risk for those things, but you are not at high risk for them in the first place so don't worry about it.  Just keep taking them.

Ms X: But doctor, from what I can tell, there's no way of knowing ahead of time which women are at risk for these problems.  Is that true?

Dr. Y: Well, yes, but your risk is low.

Ms X: Why do you say that?

Dr. Y: Well you haven't had any problems like that yet, and it's been six months....

Ms X: So the danger period for blood clots and strokes and heart attacks is past?  If I haven't already had them I probably won't?

Dr. Y: Well not exactly.  Your increased risk for stroke doesn't begin until you've been taking them for one year, and your risk for heart attack is highest in the second year and your risk for blood clots is 4 times as high as in someone not taking these pills for the first two years.  The good news is that after two years your risk of blood clots is only double normal, and your increase in risk of heart attack and stroke aren't as high after two years although they're still higher than they would be if you didn't take the pills.  But if you take them for three years you'll still be more likely to have a stroke or heart attack or blood clot, but you will be at lower risk for a hip fracture or colon cancer.  We think the colon cancer benefit might be real but we aren't sure, and there weren't a lot of hip fractures and they were all in women in their late 60's....

Ms X: And after 4 years I'll be more likely to get breast cancer from the pills?

Dr. Y: Well, yes and the risk gets higher every year after that.

Ms X: So let me see.  I'm putting myself at higher risk for blood clots, heart attacks, strokes over the next year and a half, and after four I am increasing my risk for breast cancer.  I have this nuisance irregular vaginal bleeding, my breasts hurt all the time and my ankles are so swollen I can't wear my shoes by evening.  On the plus side, I have only 2 hot flashes a day instead of the 4 I used to have and I only wake up once a night sweating instead of twice.  I may be less likely to get colon cancer and I may be less likely to break my hip if I'm taking it when I'm in my late 60's if I take it for three years.  The pills and the doctor visits and tests because of the pills are costing me more than $600 a year.  What will happen if I stop taking the pills now?

Dr. Y: Well, the hot flashes and night sweats will probably come back.  They may be worse than before.

Ms X: What if I stop in 4 years?  I mean I *really* don't want to increase my risk of breast cancer.

Dr. Y: Well the hot flashes and other problems will probably come back then too.  That's what happens for about 2/3 of women.

Ms X: You know doc, this really looks like a no brainer to me.  I get minimal benefit now and quite a bit of discomfort, I might have a stroke or a heart attack or a blood clot I wouldn't have had if I weren't taking the pills, and all I'm doing is delaying the damn symptoms anyway?  (voice rising dangerously) Why the bloody hell didn't you tell me all this before I started taking the things?

Dr. Y: (startled) but I didn't know about some of it and I thought it wouldn't hurt you.  The increased risk is so small....

Ms X: I read that more than 25,000 women a year might have these problems if a few million all use this drug.  That doesn't look small to me.  I hear that 100 more women in the study had these problems.  That's 100 out 8400?  I don't think that's small at all.  I think it's pretty big.  Okay.  I've decided.  No more pills.  Good Day Doctor.
 

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