Forum Interview

In June 2004 members of Derren's forum submitted some questions to him and here are his replys. Special thanks goes out to Monkeymagic!

1. If there is one thing that you could change in you live at the moment, what would that be?
   I'd like some time to relax in my new place. It's still a mess of boxes and the decorators haven't finished. Been like this since mid-January.



2. If you came onto the forum what nickname would you use and why?
   Erm... probably would use my own name so you'd know it was me? Deeply unimaginative, sorry.



3. Did you have a nickname at school, and if so what was it?
   No, managed to get through school without one.



4. What's the strangest thing anyone has given to you after a show and what's the nicest?
   The strangest is probably the home-made cakes, which came from an unusual lady last year. Unfortunately, I can't eat anything like that I'm given, as there's no way of knowing what's gone into them. There are some kind but odd people out there, and I tend to attract them. As for the nicest, I'd have to say Claudia's stuffed Rosella. I imagine she asked this question to see if I'd say that, and I have done.



5. If you could choose one artist, alive or dead, to paint a portrait of you, who would it be? Sebastian Krueger. He's a German caricaturist/portrait artist who paints in a similar vein to me (though better). I'd be very chuffed. Perhaps I should try and commission one.



6. Desert island books. Limit five.
   Bowsell's London Diaries; Roberton Davies' The Cornish Trilogy; some Dostoevsky compendium; the collected stories of Borges; Proust's In Search of Lost Time. I haven't read the last one but would like to.



7. What is your greatest regret?
   I can't think of any. There are things I would change, but nothing I feel particularly responsible for.



8. If you could have dinner with anyone, dead or alive, who would you choose and why?
   Franz Kafka. Preferably alive. I'd want to tell him what a vast impact his tiny body of work would have, and how it would define much of modernity. And I don't think he'd eat much.



9. What was the last non-classical CD you bought?
   I bought the new Nora Jones album for Coops and me to listen to in the car on tour. Our music tastes collide; so whilst I love the silence, he ended up with nothing to listen to on long drives. I enjoyed listening to his copy of the first, but we both found the second disappointing. Think he has it now. Didn't intend to keep it.



10. Not including Figaro (or his friend), what single possession could you not live without?
    My phone, I guess. If I can include the charger. A horrible but honest answer.



11. What is your main unfulfilled ambition?
    To learn Italian and live out there for periods of the year.



12. What is your favourite book and what are you currently reading?
    First part answered above. Am currently reading Macks' Who Wrote the New Testament; a very good book on how it actually came together - as opposed to the bizarre, ahistorical and defensively naive understanding of its origins I used to share with many Christians.



13. Are you happy with the way the new series has been received?
    It's been great. I had no idea how the press would respond (given the mixed reaction to the Roulette), and it's been overwhelmingly positive.



14. How do you prepare yourself before going on stage: do you do any kind of warming up or do you sit in your dressing room all alone, trying to relax?
    I have no rituals, and I don't get at all nervous once I know the show well. I tend to do a few vocal warm-ups to ensure I don't lose my voice.



15. How would you like to be remembered? How do you think you will be remembered?
    If I'm remembered privately as a pleasant person, then that's all I'd hope for. No strong desire to be remembered for the performing. And I can't begin to think what the public view of me will be by the time I die. If anyone remembers me at all that would be nice.



16. If you had the chance, would you still go through with Russian Roulette if you knew how the media would react?
    Of course - it did me massive favours in the long run. The reaction was frustrating, because I wasn't able to set the record straight about what actually happened that night. So all I'd change is to make sure that the police out there didn't get into so much trouble afterwards and need to cover their backs in the way they had to. It's nice to have a supportive press, but ultimately one has to do what one believes in, and ultimately only the support of those who 'get it' will lead to any longevity. Those who don't, will lose interest and fall away.



17. Where do you see your life heading? e.g. wife? kids? career-wise? etc
    I imagine we'll get the show out in America, that I'll tour a lot, and that I will continue to provide as much luxury and delight for myself as I can. No fixed plans beyond that.



18. Would you give all the fame and fortune up for true love?
    The fame in an instant; only some of the fortune.



19. If you be could someone else for a day, who would you be and why?
    Robert Kilroy-Silk. Then I'd go on television and apologise for myself to everyone - shortly before ending my own life. An act known, I believe, as 'countryside'.



20. What's your favourite film?
    Wim Wenders' Wings of Desire. It's what cinema was made for.

The Derren Brown Interview with Magicweek.co.uk March 2003

Ian Carpenter

It's a relaxed and consumeristically-fulfilled Mr B, who rises to greet me from the leather couch in one of Bath's numerous fine beverage emporia. Derren has been what he calls 'Celebrity Shopping': essentially shopping with an extra zero - or two. He is, he informs me, unusually excited about his Stool: the one he just purchased around the corner, to go with a similarly splendid armchair, now being made to order (doubtless complete with topit, induction coil and animatronic conygre.)

The one cloud, on an otherwise positively Caribbean interview horizon is that Derren is becoming increasingly agitated about this stool, as shop closing time approaches. He therefore excuses himself to pop round the corner and returns with this item, somewhat like a piano one, only for dwarfs, and draped in finest luxury cardboard.

Safely ensconced, and feeling brilliantly witty, I open with my carefully-planned Kolossal Killer Kenton.

Sorry, Killer Question:

My first question is - "What's my first question?"

This is met with a smirk, rather than the awe I had hoped for.

DB: Do you know, that is the second time today I've been asked that question. I'm always being asked it.

Oh.

DB: �and I always say, - "What's my first question".

Right.

Are you still writing for 'WF' (The private journal mentioned in Pure Effect)?

DB: Occasionally, from time to time I submit an article, or a picture.

What have you acquired recently, that you like?

DB: (LAUGHS) A footstool - though I haven't got that home yet. A bottle of Bruichladdich 1970 - hundred and twenty five quid. And of course a moose head - which I was given.

Was that by somebody incredibly kind, that you'd like to mention by name?

DB: It was by possibly the kindest, most generous person I've ever met - can't remember his name though� I do like my luxury goods.

And you're able to acquire more of them now.

DB: I'm able to acquire more, and more, and more. Dan Kitson the comedian was asked what he spent his money on, and he answered without a hint of irony, "Playstation and sweets". I'm kind of going to be the equivalent of that.

But presumably a little more upmarket.

A little more upmarket.

More seriously, you're appearing on more and more TV shows as a guest, and you said to me a while back that although you have an excellent manager, the whole thing has its own momentum anyway. Is that ever scary, the thought of its just grinding out another celeb?

DB: I think there's grinding out another celeb when you are just a product of a production company, like a pop star package or whatever. I hope it's not like that. I hope I'm actually selling something that is a bit different. No, it's fun, you know, it� opens doors, and it's exciting and all those things are great. And because I don't live in London, I'm not on top of it all the time. On the other hand, it means that when I do go to London, it's quite extreme. It's a real contrast to my life in Bristol, but then I like that too because it's nice to have a contrast.

You're not planning to move there then?

DB: Well I'm going to have to have a place in London as well, because I have to spend so much time there. At first, I'll be renting with a friend - with Jonathon Goodwin of Monkey Magic. Don't tell them that, it's much cooler to say I've got a flat in Hampstead, and live in London and Bristol!

You said it opens doors, what did you mean by that?

DB: You suddenly find people that know who you are, are very happy to go out of their way to help you. I went into a local restaurant round the corner from me - the kitchens had just closed, and I didn't realise, the waitress apologised, I was just about to leave - and this chap at the bar said oh, do you want some food? No problem! He made me some great stuff, didn't charge me for it, we sat till three drinking single malts! And it was great, that stuff doesn't happen, you know, otherwise. But equally, to put this in context, I'm hardly a household name.

But you do have people coming up to you when you're out?

DB: If I go out shopping , I'll get three or four people stop me. They tend to be very nice. When I was a jobbing close-up magician in Bristol, people would stop me and kind of be a lot more jostling and friendly and ask me to do stuff and all that. Whereas now they're a bit more reserved, which is ideal. But it's odd answering the question because I just don't think about it, because if you do think about you go mad, because every time you walk into a restaurant, you start thinking how many people...? You'd become obsessed by it - because It is an odd thing to walk into a place where you've never been before and have people not only know who you are, but actually know you by name. So if you think about it too much you go mad, so I really try not to.

You've written about the need for magicians to play the role of the 'hero', the facilitator of a spectator's entry into the world of mystery - rather than the usual 'Kneel Before Zod!' model. But isn't there a problem for you there now, since you are billed as the Mind Controller, which surely runs the risk of being stuck straight back into an omnipotent concept?

DB: Well I don't call myself a Mind Controller first of all, that's the name of the show, but the key to it is that it's not so much about playing God - and this idea goes back to discussions with Teller, it's his distinction, which I think is fantastic. What I mean by that is you don't just click your fingers and unilaterally create change in the primary world. In the same way in the show, you see that it takes effort, that there is a process, both for me, and that makes demands on the people I am doing it with. And then it may not work, and it's a shift in focus, and even in mentalism generally that isn't seen.

To concentrate on the mind effects, you've had to abandon your beloved Dove Magic�

DB: Yes, and the rope magic, that was a real pull.

So who has the doves now - they're not stuffed?

DB: No, they've all been humanely� drowned.

Obviously you put out the card tape, which was very splendid, and you don't basically do that any more; but you must have your moments, when you think if only I could, you know, 'be God' again?

DB: Well, yes, like the other day for example, when we were chatting, and I showed you that thing. It did stick with me for a few days and I've now got a better version of that which I'd love to show you. I've shifted it into my realm of things.

(He did, and needless to say, after a bit of a rubdown with 'Credibility' brand Emery Paper, a treatment with Mind Control Primer, and two or three coats of Gobbledegook Gloss, that ol' card trick came up shining like it was a geen-yew-wine mental miracle, fresh from our Collective Subconscious�)

DB: It's just really having a couple of things that if someone brought out a pack of cards I could do. I wouldn't really bring out a pack any more myself. The real thrill is using the psychology or the methods behind card effects, but using them in new ways, in subtler ways to achieve a very different sort of effect.

You hang out with�

DB: �and play basketball with�

�I was going to mention the basketball, but I wasn't sure whether you wanted to talk about the basketball (LAUGHS) with� Blaine. You mentioned in the past the possibility that you might do something together. Do you think that's likely to happen in the foreseeable future?

DB: We've spoken about if the show hits off over there - there are talks underfoot, if that's a word, to get a US version of Mind Control underway. But you know, Blaine is at the top of his tree -

Or pole.

DB: Or pole, and for us to do anything together, and for that to feel right, we'd have to be at a sort of level pegging. But I'm in no rush to do that, I've gone for a much slower burn really: I haven't tried to be headline-grabbing, there have been no big stunts, no massive PR initiative, and it's nice to sort of work your way into people's consciousness. You don't get shot down as quickly, and you have more of a history to you, more substance.

You are going to do this Russian Roulette stunt, can you give some details about that? Kind of like a Bullet Catch, only with your head, yes?

DB: Yes, the idea would be to do it as authentically as possible, with the person in the country that I feel I can read the easiest, that I can predict the most.

How do you find such a person?

DB: Through a big touring� there will be a thing that will take place in several major cities that people will take part in and send things in and fill out stuff, and I'll just narrow people down to one.

People could be thinking it's a fix, he's paid them or whatever, how will you avoid that?

DB: Not if we know who the person is. I don't mean if they're famous, but if we know the person's story. I'll probably get people to send in footage of themselves, it'll all be shown as part of the stunt. Otherwise I could just ask my brother or something. Actually that might be a bad example (LAUGHS) Yes, bad example! It looks like it's going to have to be live from another country, looks like we can't do it, because you can't handle live firearms in this country.

Are there any people, actors, other magicians, comedians, that you really would like to work with?

DB: I don't know how what I do would really fit in with anybody else's act.

I see you and Zoe Ball�

DB: Sarah Cox. I've worked with Sarah Cox now, I've fulfilled that dream - I think that's it! Do put that. (LAUGHS)

You're on TV, and you said you've had a steep learning curve there, how everything has to come out much faster and punchier. How has that fed back into your performances elsewhere?

DB: That's a good question. It's taught me a huge amount. It's amazing - I think the magic world is particularly prone to this, you know, that you have some measure of success amongst your peers, come up with a few ideas that feel a bit new and you think you're It. And then you have to do a proper stage show, work with a director, or you come to do a TV show and you realise that you know so little. I mean television is a strange beast, because everything has to be very efficiently scripted, so all the writing that I do for myself or that I work on with the people I work with, it was crippling at first to realise just how sharp everything has to be.

'Crippling'! That's a strong word: really?

DB: Well, yeah, because you are so used to taking your time as a close-up magician, and it's impossible to watch that on screen, you just want to kill yourself, it's so slow. But I was particularly slow, so I had to really learn that, and then of course on stage the same thing happened again, because after I'd really got the hang of writing and performing on TV, the next big challenge was the stage show. So I did this run-in in Bristol, and I had to learn so much again about performance energy, about driving the show rather than following it, about acting and performance. Things that we don't have to ever think about as magicians because we're all too arrogant to use directors for a start, we all think we know it. And of course as performers we are the last people to know how good we are, what effect we're having on the audience.

Andrew O'Connor, my exec producer, mentioned an anecdote about Judi Dench, she was asked in an interview what was her best performance, the best thing she'd done, and she said oh I don't know, you'd have to ask my director. It's a little different, in that you're not just an actor playing a part�

(I think I heard Robert Houdin turning in his grave at this point, but was too polite to mention it),

�but learning to work with directors, learning to script things ruthlessly, learning real performance energy, especially with someone like me that's generally fairly low energy, all that is amazing, an amazing challenge, it's great, and really exciting because it's such a real learning curve, you just feel yourself advancing massively as a performer, into areas that you were too arrogant to believe that you needed.

If we do all suffer from this tendency, how did you overcome it? Just out of necessity?

DB: Out of necessity, yes. I was put in a situation where I'm working with directors, with writers, with producers, and having people shouting me down every time I open my mouth. You know, you just learn a lot through doing that. And yes that has fed back into all the work I do whether it's close-up or cabaret now, it really has, things have tightened up a lot more.

You must still want to retain some of that spontaneity?

DB: Of course, absolutely - but the key to achieving good spontaneity in performance is very good scripting. The point of scripting is that you know you can go out on a day that you've got a terrible cold and you're feeling terrible, and do the best show. And on a good day you go out and you do that show, and a hundred adlibs occur to you, they're great and then they form part of the show the next time, they get added on to the script. That's what it's about, it's not about killing spontaneity, it's about setting the framework as best as it can be, to allow you to then have the confidence to move into other areas.

You constantly remind viewers what you do is not psychic. But presumably you have encountered the 'Rowland Syndrome', where no matter how much you tell people you are not psychic, they insist on believing that you are. How do you handle that?

DB: I had a nice incident with some psychics.

Shuteyes?

DB: Oh, absolutely stapled shut eyes. This was some filming we did for one of the specials that we never showed. They would do their bit, their readings, and I would offer mine, telling people about themselves and as it turned out - without sounding pompous, but this was the point of the stunt - I would do a far more accurate job than they were, tending to sound a bit woolly.

And one of things that I mentioned in the reading for this woman was the number of the house, not the one she lived in now, but the one she used to, and a description of her house, and what it looked like inside and out and also the number of it. One of the psychics said to me, "well, you're reading her Aura. You're doing an auric reading: why won't you admit it. And I said well you know, I'm not psychic, I don't believe in that, I'm doing this and this and this, and he said "no, why won't you admit it, you're doing an auric reading?" So I said why do you think that, and he said "well you named her house number, and the aura stores information like house numbers, addresses". Fantastic! You know, you'd never need an address book�

(Might have problems checking it though, since it would presumably be above your head).

DB: Then on the other side of it, there are the letters I get from people, that are just seriously ill, wanting to scrape money together so I can come and cure them.

Not seriously?

DB: Oh, completely seriously. There's a lot of mad nutters, which is funny, and fine, Michael my manager has had two people turn up on his doorstep in tears, in a week, saying they'd had spells put on them, and they needed the spells lifting. There's plenty of that, which is manageable from my point of view. But when you get letters from people that are really really suffering, really horrible stories that I don't want to go into, and they are desperate for me to cure them, people in absolute pain.

Why do they believe you can?

DB: They just really feel with my skills and insight, as they perceive it, that I can relieve them from their torture - and it's a horrible thing. It goes through my manager and he has a response from me which explains I am a performer, all that you see is not necessarily all that it claims to be all of the time, and it wouldn't be appropriate for me to get involved. I think it's best to just draw a very clear line.

Why do you like watching Big Brother?

DB: I just got hooked on it because I watched it from the beginning and I'd never seen the series before. I wasn't 'Jade-ded'. I was very much jaded by the end of the last series, I have to say! (LAUGHS) I hardly ever watch TV, and there are a few things that I love: good comedy, I think we produce that better than any comic film. The Office, Partridge, all that kind of stuff. So I don't know why I got into Big Brother - I used to watch Sunset Beach every morning, and weep salty, girl tears, I used to love it, so no shame there at all.

Now, I have to ask you this, because it's Valentine's Day tomorrow: not all women are physically repulsed by you�

DB: No.

So is that something that forms part of your Master Plan?

DB: Oh, master plan for life, sure - but at the moment I'm not looking, not particularly interested in having a relationship. Be interesting to see if I get any cards - traditionally I don't get any at all.

[In the event, he did get one this year - from a bloke�]

Do you send any?

DB: No, I never send any. If it happens, it happens, you know. The more you go out and look for it the worse you make it for yourself. One day someone will turn up - or they wont. But I'm sure one day they will.

Is that a Prediction?

DB: Yes. It's in an envelope.

Why do you think there are no women mentalists?

DB: Oh, I think there are. I mean these are people I have encountered in discussion fora and Web groups - I did say, 'fora'.

You don't see them at Mind Magic days or conventions.

DB: I don't know how established they are, but they're out there. May even take credit for a couple myself. Some say they got into it after seeing the shows. It always makes me uneasy when I see the way that� female magicians, the roles that they're forced to choose for themselves. There's something bizarrely misogynistic about magic anyway: the social side, but also the fact that you're mutilating women in boxes on stage. It's an odd profession for a woman. I remember, was it Mandy Farrell asked somebody about whether he knew any props that she could use as a female magician, if he was aware of anything in the dealers. He suggested to her without a trace of irony, maybe a Himber wallet with a cutout flower stuck on it.

On both sides, presumably?

DB: (LAUGHS) Presumably on both sides. People like Fay Presto who are creative and single-minded enough will do a good job. With mentalism I think - there's a lot of Tarot readers and fortune-tellers out there. Someone I work with is a sort of corporate fortune teller, and all the guys, the delegates, were getting their palms read, and we got a train home. I was very cynical, oh, you know 'fortune teller': then she took her wig off, and it was just an act, she was an actress. It was a performance as far as she was concerned, she had all the gipsy stuff on, all the bangles, the whole thing, and I thought well, fair enough. I still don't like it very much, not my thing, but the tendency I imagine, the clich� would be for a female mentalist to fall into that category, rather New Agey.

During the latter part of this exchange, it became increasingly hard to ignore the nice man lugging in an Indoor Surfing Machine (oh yes, I kid you not). Especially when his electric pump began loudly inflating the bouncy castle beach that went with it (see previous brackets). Oozing wisdom as ever, our loquacious sage proposed that we adjourn to an adjacent drinketeria. Stool in tow, we did just that.

- Let's talk about the forthcoming tour of your show: it's essentially what you did when you were working it in, in Bristol, yes?

DB: Yes, the whole Bristol run was to get it up to speed and the tour starts March 21st. I think the first date is in Stevenage.

You've removed Lift and Reminiscence?

DB: No, I've changed Reminiscence, I do it very differently now, and probably dropped Lift. I had a stage version of it but it never really worked so it'll have to go. Which is a shame, because I'm very fond of it.

And has it been replaced by something else?

DB: Yes: I'm going to try, and - I hate to say this unless for some reason I decide not to do this at the last minute - but the plan is to memorise the phone book of each city I visit. Have people in the audience at random in the audience call out names and addresses of people they know, and I'll tell them all the phone numbers. I can get up to about N at the moment.

Your new series features some material that's previously been shown, yes?

DB:Yes, it's a 50/50 mixture of highlights from the specials and brand new material. The original specials were really only watched by a fairly small dedicated group of fans, so the idea is to try and reach a broader audience.

And after that?

DB: The two new TV specials in October, the Russian Roulette special and another special, which will be mainly live as well. It's a change of pace, and bit more of - stunts. And then I'm signing a two-year deal now with Four, which would be another series and another two specials after that. And hopefully in there somewhere maybe the American one will come off too. Oh - DVD coming out, for the autumn, I've just heard about that. [This will be material from the current series, plus several extra segments that did not make it to broadcast]. Book in the pipeline, I do get asked about it a lot. I haven't started it yet, I'm still thinking about exactly what I want to put into that book. It's not Pure Effect, or Absolute Magic: for magicians; it's a very different sort of project; it will be a book for the general public.

You've been painting since childhood, and you do these huge caricatures - though that term almost devalues what they are�

DB: I like the word 'masterpieces'; still devalues them a little, but�

You've actually now got some proper exhibitions happening?

DB: Yes. Well nothing's been confirmed yet, but the plan is an exhibition in London in November - presuming I survive the Russian Roulette - which will be like a celeb -y VIP event, and then one for the public as well. Possibly a thing in Germany, and then one in Miami for people like Madonna� It's great because it's the 'quiet thing' that I do.

Can I come?

DB: Yes.

You were born in the wrong era for the one TV show that would have really suited you, Miami Vice. They had all sorts of people who were famous in other fields.

DB: I've still got a lot of clothes I could wear if they asked me.

If somebody said to you that you can either have a career as a mindreader, or as a successful artist, which would you choose?

DB: Artist, without a moment's hesitation. Sorry! I absolutely love performing. When you go out and perform an act that's really slick, especially now that I'm doing more cabaret stuff, which I never did, and the theatre shows - it's such an amazing feeling, especially when those people have come across the country to see you. There is no reason why I would have to stop the performing, and I would hate to. But if you pose that question, then yes, absolutely.

You're a paradox: I don't know anyone who is more concerned about having high standards, but at the same time�

(This is interrupted by Derren's tea arriving, and his making 'tea sound-effects' into the tape, ie disgusting slurping noises).

For example, your card repertoire, which you no longer perform: there are many people who would be delighted to have that as their repertoire for life. That's what you've STOPPED doing.

DB: Yes. And God knows, that video is available for sale from http://www.derrenbrown.co.uk/. The high standards thing - I really wanted to try and do things properly. I've always been like it, wanting to do something seriously, really challenge it and do it full-on. It doesn't mean that I necessarily achieve those aims or that I do it better than anyone else at all, it just means that I've always had a very single-minded approach to things: really wanting to commit to stuff, really take on board everything. That's why I don't accept that if you're a mindreader you just write something on a pad, and turn it round and say Haha! You've really got to commit to it in all sorts of ways, as a performer and everything.

But the whole performing thing still seems to come relatively low down the scale of Ultimate Importance for you.

DB: In the end it's a really enjoyable, fun way of earning a living. I love performing and there's nothing trivial about that - it's a great thing to be able to do. But at the end of the day it's entertainment. That's very valuable: I love artifice, I love illusions and I love emulation and impersonation. I think those all remind us of the essence of things. Caricature is another one, or Portrait. It reminds you of the essence of a person. Magic emulates reality in a way: you're making something as real as possible, whereas in fact there's a trick involved and it's actually impossible, but to make it convincing you're apparently following all these logical laws until the very end, and simulating reality. Great magic does that very convincingly and all that I find fascinating and worthwhile for those reasons.

(And I thought it was just the velvet jackets�)

DB: Despite all that, I've got no ambitions to be the World's Greatest Mindreader. I hope I've got a good enough business sense to always make sure I'm heading in the right direction, and getting better and more well-known. It's a very enjoyable game, it's a wonderful way of earning a living, but my life hopefully is about things that feel more substantial than that. Ultimately there's something a little dishonest at some level in performing magic.

[IRONIC GASP!]

DB: It's not the same as doing something else, where you can throw your arms open and say this is what I do, judge me on this. Canasta retired and ended up painting, I imagine somewhere I might do a similar thing at some point. It's very difficult to talk about it, especially for something that's going to be read by a lot of magicians, that it's not the be-all and end-all of my life. But equally I think that to put the most into something, and to really be good at something and make a difference at it, you have to have one foot out of it. Maybe because you don't need it, you bring to it knowledge and understanding of all sorts of other areas.

You don't go to conventions, you don't seem really interested.

DB:I never really was, that's no disrespect to anybody or anything. When I was young I didn't know other magicians, I came into it later, and I guess you have a slightly different relationship with it.

Are you a member of anything - IBM, Hypnotists Anonymous..?

DB: I don't think I'm a member of anything at all, actually. Apart from out local sports club, which I don't even go to.

You may not want to answer this, but having seen you work as a hypnotist, and the fascinating things that are possible, it's obvious that to a degree that element is present in your TV stuff, but you never use that word or talk about it explicitly. Why is that?

There's three sides to that. One, I'm not using formal hypnosis anyway. Two I don't want to be seen as a Hypnotist because there are hypnotists and we know what they are. I think it's important to be seen as yourself for what you do and not be too easily labelled. And three there are all sorts of problems if you're known as a hypnotist in terms of getting gigs and all sorts of legal issues. I use it covertly, but at that point it ceases to be hypnosis, it becomes� suggestion, or waking hypnosis, or something that isn't strictly speaking hypnosis per se.

What are you proudest of having achieved so far in your career?

DB: It's in the nature of making a show like that, you don't come up with all the ideas yourself. I have a small team, three or four of us that talk things through. So it's very difficult pointing at the show and going oh, I'm very proud of that. Having said that, there are methods that I've come up with, things that I know are new, it's satisfying coming up with that. There are a lot of magicians that do speculate on methods that I use, but there are one or two things that I've come up with. You want to run and tell all your magic buddies but you can't.

I don't know if pride is really the word: a quiet satisfaction perhaps, without wanting to sound smug. It's not doing any larger good. The blind athlete, that piece felt really good, not because it was someone who was blind, but because it was somebody that hadn't had first hand experience of magic and therefore didn't have all the jaded assumptions that people have about magic who've seen too much of it. His reaction to it was so genuine and heartfelt, that stuck with me, that was a nice thing to give someone who hadn't had it before. Proud, I don't know - it feels good.

Finally, what about your imitators, what would you say to them?

DB: I can't pretend anything other as a performer than it is always a bit galling when you see stuff that you put a lot of love and effort into over months or years and having it bandied about. On the other hand as magicians we've all been there, we've all had to copy someone at some point in order to find out where we want to go, I think it's part of the learning process. As long as if you are doing that, you in the back of your mind remember that's not what it's about. If you use it to discover your own voice and your own thing, then you know - great. If something of mine was part of that then fair enough.

But as soon as possible, you should be doing your own material, and certainly don't do stuff by other magicians that isn't published, or without their permission. I've had copies of the book illegally reproduced, chapters sold off it and all that. I've got a solicitor now that takes care of that when it happens, so that side of it is a shame. How much it bothers me, depends how often I read the Internet! (LAUGHS).

And with that, tea drunk, we repair to the aptly-named Jolly's for some further late-night Celebrity Shopping. Any fleeting doubts as to whether Derren's powers would remain intact, when encumbered by his four-legged friend, quickly vanished as he effortlessly got the Clinique girl to guard the stool during the visit. She even seemed to enjoy his nearly demolishing the display stand with it, as we left.

Loaded Magazine

The Great Loaded Mind Control Experiment: Will Storr

Half an hour after reading the secret thoughts of six random souls from loaded and making us all go �Wooaahh, f*ckinell!� a lot, Derren brown tells me I�m special. The 31-year-old mind-reader has spent the morning performing brain-bending stunts on us and he�s now sitting with me upstairs, in the studio�s empty canteen.

�You caught me out consistently,� he says. �I know the predictable pattern, and you didn�t follow it on either occasion.�

The experiment started with Brown asking us to stand up and hide a coin in one hand, behind our backs.

�I�m going to try and influence which hand you put it in, so don�t make a decision yet. You can either put the coin in the hand on one side, which, if you�re opposite me, would be your left, I guess. It�s not my left, but your left, if you�re opposite me.�

We�re all shooting each other very confused looks.

�It�s entirely up to you. So, give it some thought and when you�re ready, bring your hands out.�

For the first time that day, the six of us are silent. Having recently watch Derren brown�s Mind Control TV Specials that were filmed for Channel 4, we�re tense with expectation. In the shows, he made a cashier at the dogs pay out on a losing ticket, made a medical student�s hand go numb and pushed a needle through it, and guessed almost exactly the concept two advertising execs would come up with after being locked in a room and told to create an ad for a taxidermist (a bear playing a harp). And now, the little posh man with the funny beard has us enthralled.

�This is a test just to see what you�re like. I�ve told you that I�m going to influence your behaviour, then I make a point of slightly over-emphasising the left hand, and I count on most of you picking up on that and doing the exact opposite. So if you did that, and put it in your right hand, you�re out of the game. Sit down.�

Four sit down. There are two of us left.

�So you are the challengers. The ones most likely to catch me out. You didn�t fall for it. So put your hands behind your back and do it again. Now bring them back out.

�Great, OK. So the second time I tell you that you�re challengers and that should appeal to your pride and you make you want to catch me out again. When I say you will do the same thing again, I�m making you try to put the coin in the same hand again. If you did, sit down.�

And then, there�s just me.

�Marvellous. That leaves you as the least predictable person here. You�ve caught me out twice in a row. Fifty quid says I can guess you right fives times in a row.�

Rather than studying Law and German, as he was supposed to in his first years at university, Derren Brown worked on hypnosis. �I was inspired by a stage hypnotist, but I didn�t really want to do that � I didn�t want to make people look stupid. So I started doing magic. But the trouble with magic is that it�s either naff or, however good a trick it is, you know it�s just a trick. It�s inherently quite patronising. If you say, �When I click my fingers the coin travels through the air,� you know it�s rubbish.�

Twelve years since he saw that stage hypnotist, brown, a fiercely intelligent and charismatic Bristolian, has developed his own unique act. It�s not magic, it�s not hypnosis, but the exploitation of the extraordinary complexities of the human mind.

�It�s difficult to explain,� he says. �I�m going for an effect, so I will stack things in my favour and cheat a bit through psychological techniques. It�s like when two people are in conversation, one person talks about the family and pets, then the other person talks about their family and pets. It�s two people talking about themselves. If you listen and watch, they tell you everything about how they see the world, what their triggers are and what their filters are between them and the rest of the world, what their predictable patterns are, how you can influence them. So, when you all walked in this morning, I was watching you and deciding, who�s the challenger? Who�s the joker? Who�s the cynic? I�m building a profile. Once I�ve done that, I know which effect I�ll do on whom.�

Derren keeps his �50. not only does he get me right every time, but he explains precisely the thought process that has led to each decision. I sit down, feeling dunceful, obvious and haunted. It�s as though the disembodied goatee-bearded mouth of the psy-controller was floating around behind my eyes and whispering secret instructions to me.

�Think of a number between 30 and 100,� he says, turning his attention to my boss, Danny. �Write it down and read what you�ve written a couple of times. Now get rid of it, put it in your pocket or something. You�ve now got the number right in front of your mind. Statistically, people will go for certain numbers. I�m going to write a few down, so be careful you don�t react in a big way.�

Brown opens a pad and writes eight number down.

�A lot of it works on introverts and extroverts. An extrovert, classically, will choose these numbers. I think you would have reacted to one there if it had been one of them, so I�m guessing it probably isn�t.�

Danny sits watching, giving nothing away�

�Why did you pick Danny?� I ask later, fishing for damaging psychological info that I can use against him at a later date.

�I knew he was going to be much more cynical, much more detached. He�s the type who�ll keep calm and solid and have explanations for everything.�

He�s right. Danny is exactly that type of person. B*stard. The ability Brown has to read people so quickly must be an excellent life skill. Imagine, for example, being able to tell if a girl�s mental or not within ten minutes of meeting her. �Ten minutes?� he says. �I could tell in two. Every conversation they have is a microcosm, a tiny version of how they are going to react to things in life and what their natural patterns of things are, what chains of thought they go through, how they represent things to themselves and then react to those things with an emotional response.�

I wonder about other situations where Brown uses his skills. He coyly admits to using the fake-payout stunt at the races to make money, getting away with free meals in restaurants, and says he used to use his knowledge to persuade women into going out with him. But that was then. He�s single now, describing himself as �quite a loner around Bristol�, and he doesn�t enjoy the experience of being stopped in the street by lady fans. He says the �Oh my God� reaction from women is exactly the thing that turns him off. �What you want,� he says, �is somebody who is just not going to pay attention.�

Women and money may be out these days, but there are other, more unexpected, occasions where his knowledge has proved vital.

�I was coming back from this gig in Wales and this guy walked past. He was really drunk, and I�m wearing a velvet suit, not looking good. And he was like, �What the f*ck are you looking at?� and he came up close, really nasty. So I said to him �Well, the wall outside my house isn�t four feet high.� And he was like, �What?� And I said, �When I was in Spain, the walls were really tall, but over here they�re really way down here.� And then he just looked at me and went, �Aargh!� and broke down in tears.

�I was completely calm and in control. What I said made sense, but his brain was going: �Have I? Is it? What if�?� and the rug was completely pulled from under him. It�s all about bending and pushing a situation without making it seem like you�re doing anything at all. It�s these weird states of mind we get in where we become massively suggestible.�

We�re not sure at which point Brown put Danny into a suggestible state this morning, he�s obviously done something spooky.

�So it�s none of these numbers?� he says, noting Danny�s lack of reaction to the eight numbers he�s written down. �Well, an introvert picks very different numbers.� He writes down another eight numbers. �Again, you�re not reacting to any of them, so I�m guessing it�s none of these or any obvious combination of them. Look at me, just think of the number. I�m getting one and four. Is it 41?�

�No.� says Danny, smiling. We all sit up. Hang on�

�Oh. So 41 isn�t right. But I�m guessing it�s none of the numbers I�ve written down and no immediate combination of them.�

�There is a combination,� Danny says, pointing at the three.

�Was that the number you were thinking of?� Derren says, frowning. �Thirty-three? Hmm, I�m clutching at straws a bit here, but that� � he points at all the numbers in the bottom line � �adds up to 33. That works. If you go along the top, that adds up to 33. If you take a diagonal like that, that adds up to 33, too. If you take that box there, that adds up to 33. The box in the middle adds up to 33, and the numbers in the corner, 14, 10, eight and one, add up to your number.�

�Does everyone pick 33?� Danny says, sounding a little crumpled.

�You�re going to worry about that for the rest of you life.� Says Derren

The refreshing thing about Brown is that he doesn�t claim to be �magic�. Unlike his irritating pal, the repellent David Blaine, he doesn�t draw eyeballs on his hand with a biro on breakfast TV and imagine he�s fooled everyone into thinking he�s got special powers. In fact, brown�s journey into areas that are traditionally drowned in half-boiled spiritualist cock-water has convinced him not to believe in the supernatural.

This pragmatic approach engages the audience in a unique way, as he gives out real clues about what�s going on while he�s doing each stunt. For instance, earlier he said to the pale man of loaded�s picture desk. �Simon, I can�t read your mind. This is not about mind-reading. I want you to think of a hobby or interest that you�ve been into that nobody else knows about.�

�OK.� Simon says, peering up nervously from under his startling eyebrows.

�Well, you�ll have gone for something that you think will reflect well to your group. It will be something creative, something you do with your hands. Don�t take this the wrong way, but it�s not going to be anything sociable. It�ll be something you would do on your own. You still keep things associated with it. Are you making stuff? Like aeroplanes stuff? Like, models?�

�Jesus, yeah.� Simon says, smiling.

Two days after out interview, I�m transcribing the tape I made of the coin trick Derren did on me. The one where he told me I was special, that I�d caught him out every time. Something about it makes me suspicious. I write him an email:

Derren,
Just been reading through the coin stunt and I�m now convinced that you actually whittled me down as the person most open to suggestion, and all that stuff about being the �least predictable� was just flattery and part of the smoke and mirrors.
Will

Two hours later, I get a response

Will,
You might be right. But that would be telling.
Derren.

Derren's Guide to...

Not paying Parking Tickets

"This will work with all sorts of situations, but you need a very natural and confident manner to carry it off. This is essentially what I did at the dog track to make them pay out on losing tickets. This is bad. Illustration purposes only of course..."

Step 1
Approach the warden saying "No problem - I do apologize, entirely my fault. You clearly have a job to do and I should have been more careful, and I should learn to shake my hand." This last bit, which makes no sense, is said quickly and casually, as you extend your hand in a friendly gesture. He should take it, which he wouldn't otherwise. Then as he does, say, "Hey, I met your dad yesterday. He's looking well." You are going to induce a state of confusion and suggestibility.

Step 2
Don't quite shake hands with him. Take his wrist with your left hand and slowly bring his hand up in front of his face. Point at his palm with your right forefinger. Firmly but calmly say, "Look here. And of course you'll wonder what the ticket is, just like waking up out of a dream three minutes from now and not sure what you're doing. That's fine, you can just throw it away wherever you like. Or put it in your pocket, it's up to you."

Step 3
If you've done step 2 right, he'll be very tranced out and just staring at his hand while you drive off. His unconscious will act upon your instructions as a relief from the utterly blank mind-state which you have induced. And giving him the double-bind option of whether to throw it away or putting it in his pocket is like asking a kid whether he wants to go to bed at 7:30 or *pm. Either way he goes to bed early, but he feels like he's making the decision.

Derren's guide to...

Seducing Women

"These techniques only work when combined with a natural charming manner. But if you are still a bad person then use them."

Step 1
Maintaining a distance and a lack of obviously coarse interest, hold eye-contact and talk in a calm, rhythmical manner. As soon as is natural, get her on the subject of something she passionately enjoys.

Step 2
Be interested in how this activity/interest makes her feel. You want her to really experience that state as she's talking to you. The more details you ask for, the more she has to create it to answer.

Step 3
Wait until she's psychologically involved in that good feeling. You need to anchor that state to you. This works in the same way that a soon might take you back to a good or bad time and recreate that state. At the right moment, make a gesture, like straightening your tie or touching your ear, and repeat this every time she's fully caught up in her 'good' feelings. After three or so times, you should have a good trigger.

Step 4
Now change the subject, be your normal charming self, and at some point say something like, "I'm sure that you, like me, could do with a top up...". As you say the words "you like me", slow your voice down a tad and make your trigger gesture.

Step 5
She should return to that state, and start to attach it to you. Use sentences like, "Do you have to read before you go to sleep? With me, I rarely have trouble getting off smoothly." Watch for pupil dilation and for her feet to remain pointing to you, even if she appears uninterested.