Hi all,

I forgot to mention that once u pick one or more remedies that seem like a close match, u can read up on each of them in a Materia Medica (MM) for details.  This helps b/c sometimes a remedy will seem like a match when I'm repertorizing, but then when I read the MM description, I wonder how I even considered it!  Makes me wonder about all the others that might match and never came up in the repping process <sigh>

For MM-less folks, look at this URL for remedy descriptions: http://www.homeoint.org/books/boericmm/default.htm

Someone asked which remedies I used for Boo's retinal detachment.  In his case, his right eye was the one affected more so I weighted those rubrics (symptoms) more.  He also had photophobia, bleeding in the eye, dilated pupils, some opaquenss, and a lil discharge.  So based on his symptoms, I came up w/ the following remedies: Gels, Phos, Arnica, Arg Nit, and Bell
Needless to say, other kitties may have very diff symptoms. A lot of cats have no bleeding when the retina detaches, and yet others will show no symptoms until one morn will look disoriented at which point the sad human realizes that kitty has gone blind:(

For his heart, I whittled it down from about 40 remedies to the following (then had a heck of a time picking *the* one): Crataegus Oxy, Naja Trip, Prunus V, Adonis V, Convallaria, Cactus Grandiflorus, and Stroph.  Course I tried to incorporate the hi BP (i used arterial tension as a symtpom for that) and kidney rubrics too.

Jade, I add 2 pellets of a remedy in spring water, and then administer by giving 1 dropperful (or so) at a time.  I guess this is what I meant when i said liquid dose.  A lot of homeopaths call this "aqueous dosing"  I've found that it works really well so once I switched to this technique about 3 yrs ago, I have never ever taken or given a dry dose (pellets under the tongue).

Sandy, owned and operated by the mountain cats

This is a great start, Sandy!  I'm so glad this repertory is on line. Gracious though, you're right  --  it ain't exactly user-friendly.  No
wonder we pay people to tell us what to do...

These books are for humans, right?  So we just divide the dose by what for a kitten/cat?  Did I read 30?

The most amazing thing is that my cat is influencing *me* to be healthier because of what you all teach me!

Hi Kathy,

Kathy B wrote:
<<In an emergency, tho, or a crisis situation, I'm just wondering if  the  "wait and see how they react" approach is ideal. I suppose a kitty could  perk up or improve pretty quickly if the right remedy is used, yes?>>

Well, this is sort of how I do it - if it's truly an emergency situation,  then I'm headed for the vet. If there's lots of bleeding or shock or  evidence of burns/contusions, etc. I'll tend to the immediate first aid  procedures, e.g. bandaging, applying ice, whatever. Then I run for the homeo kit and administer a dose of whatever I feel is appropriate. Then we're off to the vet. Since I'm about 5 minutes away from the vet, I could be there before I would normally give another dose anyway. Then it depends what they do if any further remedy/dosing is needed.

One time, one of my d*gs started bleeding profusely from a growth she had on her head. The blood was spurting a good six feet from her with every beat of her heart. Good thing we were outside! She had bumped her head and this growth on something while rolling around in the grass. In trying to put pressure on it, I was completely covered in blood in just a minute or so as it would squirt out from under my hand. This was definitely vet time for us! I made her run with me back to the house and grabbed the homeo kit out of the car before leaving for the vet office. I gave her a remedy as it was spurting in my face  and then got her in the car and started to leave - the bleeding stopped within a minute. You could have knocked me over with a feather. I've been a fan of homeopathy for a long time, but this episode really confirmed my beliefs. So, yes, homeopathy sometimes helps very quickly.

The key for me is to assess the situation and if it warrants a vet visit, if you have time, know what to give and don't have to look a remedy up (or dig through a cupboard to find the remedy), give it and get going. If you're lucky, it might kick in before you get there. If not, you'll be getting professional help as soon as possible.

<<How long then would you wait before dosing again?>>

Depends on the situation and the reaction to the remedy. If it was truly an emergency and we wound up in the vet's office, then I may not get a chance to redose - especially if they go right into surgery. But if it's something I've decided to deal with at home, I'd redose if I saw some improvement when the improvement then slowed or stopped. If no improvement at all was seen after about 30 minutes or so from the first dose, I'd probably figure I had the wrong remedy and might try something else.

<<Would the animal stop improving just as quickly?>>

This (I believe) depends on the depth of the injury, the strength of the animal's vital force and the potency of the remedy. Quite a matrix to try to work out!

<< I guess as with all homeopathy, it's on an individual basis. ??>>

Now we're talking. :-) That's what makes homeopathy so wonderful and yet so challenging.

<<Also, a second point of disagreement for me is that she recommends 30C for almost everything. I think this is too high in many
cases of first aid type situations.
Nancy (or anyone who can / cares to answer), could you elaborate on this a little more? Is a low dose generally the way to go in a crisis situation? Why is that? I'm curious, cause it seems to me that the few number of homeopathic first aid kits I've seen stock 30C remedies. Would a better approach be to build a kit of individually-bought remedies in low potencies? >>

Well, I think that in a layperson's hands like me, the low potencies are  the least likely to cause any problems. They are shorter acting and not as  deep reaching. The higher potencies purportedly work on more of an emotional/sprititual level as well. They sure do cure physical problems but I feel they may also be tinkering around with some things I don't feel competent to mess with. I'd rather repeat a low potency remedy frequently than a high one just for safety's sake. Low potencies are more in tune with physical problems, so in an acute situation that's what we want to focus on. 30C is not a high potency, but the lower Cs and Xs are more suited for first aid, IMHO.

It also seems to me that the higher potencies are much more narrow in their focus than the low end. You have to nail "the one" or you won't get results. The lower ones seem to be much more forgiving of repertorizing errors.

Also, having ALL the remedies be of the same potency is just not fitting the problem to the remedy. One size does not fit all in this case as you already mentioned. I started out with a 12C kit and since then have bought mostly lower potencies to round it out. The only higher potencies I have purchased have been for my use for specific problems. The kits don't ever get anything higher than a 12C.

Be well,
Nancy and the furkids

<< Hi all you homeopathy "experts"....>>

Hi Naomi and everyone, gosh ain't none of us here "experts" but we study and observe, and study some more:)

<< Sandy, you mentioned that you always used liquid dosing because it  seemed to work well for your cats,  so how exactly do you make up the  remedy in water?  Just one pill?  How much water do you add,  do you shake (succuss),  let it stand for a certain time etc......>>

There are so may confusing things about homeopathy.  For instance, a dose is however many pills one takes at an given time; that might work out to 1or 2 or 10 pellets.  Taken once, this is a dose.  So really anything more than 1 pill would be a waste ot money.  I add either 1 or 2 pills.  I'm a laid-back type so I don't get exercized about lil things.  If my hand slips and 3 pills go in the bottle, so be it. Then I fill the rest w/ spring water.  I don't succuss b/c that would change the potency.

<<when I have tried to dissolve remedies in water,  I find that the pills take forever to dissolve so I usually have crushed them first,  or  sometimes just given the tablets directly (without touching them of course).   Would cooled boiled water be OK,  or is spring water the best to use?  Does it have to be a brown glass bottle?>>

True, some brands do take longer so in an emergency situation, it can be a pain.  I don't think crushing would hurt at all.

I'm not sure why people use spring water.  Tap water in the U.S. is mondo scarrry!  I get spring water out of my tap here b/c I live in the mountains and we have our own water co. here in this teeny town of 1,000 people.

Brown is not necessary; blue cobalt (which looks so pretty) will do.  I think keeping the light out is the idea.  But u can store in a light colored bottle and just put it away in the cupboard right away.

Usually, after I make up the first diluted liquid in a bottle, I administer about 4-5 doses, maybe more if it is a lower potency than say 12C (nothing magical, I just make up my own rules based on what has worked for me).  I just figure if I give too many (who knows what that # really is) doses, then I might cause a proving or aggravation, so after a certain # of doses, I take 1 drop of that liquid, mix w/ 99 drops of water, and succuss 100 times.  So if I started w/ 9C, this will bring it to 10C.  From this liquid, I then give the remedy 4-5 times.  And so on.

Hope I didn't confuse anyone.  I think the liquid dosing is gentle, and I'm told that b/c it touches the membranes in the mouth, it works faster. i can attest to the speed myself.

HTH (Hope this helps)
Sandy, owned and operated by the mountain cats

Hi Leah,

Leah wrote:
<<  You would redose when the improvement slowed or stopped?  That's what I do, but wanted to make sure I interpreted it correctly.  My homeopathic vet mentioned re-dosing *if* there is no waxing and waning of improvement/changes; i.e. as long as there's some noticeable change going on - no need to re-dose.>>

Yup. You understood my babblings correctly. :-) I only redose when I'm sure  - or pretty sure - I have the right remedy. And then only when the original  dose seems to be "wearing off" and not doing its job anymore. Of course,  that's assuming that there is still work to be done.

<<I don't fool with the higher (above 30C) doses either without professional intervention.  What types of things do you feel they can effect?  With one  of my pets, there's more mentals and I may have to go with a higher dose   to create a more lasting change.>>

For me and trying to use homeopathy for the animals, I am wary of the  mentals. I haven't figured out how to separate my anthropomorphizing from  real, solid mental symptoms to go by in a consistent way. Knowing my  animals really well helps, but there are times when it's hard to decide if  I'm really correct in the mentals they have or if I'm just projecting or giving them a symptom I would feel. So, since the higher potencies affect mentals more, I don't give them. Then there's the spiritual aspects that higher potencies affect -- and I'm not at all ready to examine that in regards to the animals.

<<and there's where the proving comes in.  How long/how frequently would a  remedy have to be given to create a proving, do 'ya think?>>

I'm not convinced at all about the proving of remedies occurring. And if it  does, I haven't a clue how to predict in any case when or how that would  occur. What frequency of dosing, potency, strength of vf, etc. would allow  it to happen. I know that I have never proved anything with me or the animals, but maybe because I use lower potencies less often generally, that's why. Dunno. Personally I tend to think a proving with a potentized remedy would be difficult. Aggravations maybe, but proving? Course, with a raw substance it's easy or difficult depending on the substance. I've always wondered if the more toxic substances like mercury or arsenic would be more likely to be proved in the lower potencies since they are more like the original....but that's a whole 'nother can of worms. :-)

<<<Also, having ALL the remedies be of the same potency is just not fitting  the problem to the remedy. One size does not fit all in this case as you already mentioned. I started out with a 12C kit and since then have bought mostly lower potencies to round it out. The only higher potencies I have purchased have been for my use for specific problems. The kits don't everget anything higher than a 12C.>>>

<<This continues to interest me because almost all of the homeopathic vets with whom I have consulted have used 30C or higher on my cats.  After quite a bit of searching, I think the vet I have now is pretty good.  He did start out with a 6C dose intially, but we're up to 30C now. When you used a remedy for the emergency bleeding with your d** for instance, what potency was that?  Notice I didn't ask what remedy - I have learned something  from all this reading!>>

LOL. I used a 12C. And I think that actually worked in my favor. It was  really hard for me to understand initially that a higher potency did not  always equate to being more powerful or likely to make something happen quickly. It's an old allo way of thinking. If one pill works, but not completely, take 6; that'll knock it out. Her symptoms didn't completely fit the remedy, but it was the closest thing I had - and in an emergency - more important - it was the only remedy I knew of off the top of my head that had a chance of doing something. This was no time to consult a rep or MM. :-) In this case, a lower potency, having a broader spectrum of activity was a life saver.

I think the vets use higher potencies since they work longer and deeper than the low potencies. BUT - the good homeo vets have enough experience to know how to choose the correct remedy and not muddy the case with a bunch of remedies that don't work or cause troubles later. I just feel safer with the lower ones.

<< Leah (who's seriously studying this homeopathy "stuff")>>

I just love your questions and opinions on this "stuff" Leah. Makes me think and ponder it all. Wish I had the time to study it more myself.

Be well,
Nancy and the furkids
 

From: "Nancy " <NKorman@
Date: Fri, 19 Mar 1999 14:42:36 -0500

Hi,

Leah  wrote:
<<If someone  does find a holistic vet or homeopathy company that is selling kits in  lesser potencies, please do let me know, as I would  like to take a look.  Leah>>

Homeopathy Overnight used to sell a 20 remedy kit by Washington in the 30X potency. And a bigger kit in 12C by Washington. Also large kits - 51 remedies - in 6X by Dolisos.

http://www.homeopathyovernight.com

My traveling kit (for the car/camping) is in an old fishing tackle box. It has bandages, remedies, tweezers, herbs etc. Just love all those little compartments. :-) I have a pocket sized remedy only kit I made up in a small aluminum box. Used tiny glass vials for the remedies.

Be well,
Nancy and the furkids

The kit is sold through Pet Sage, 1-800-738-4584, web site http://www.petsage.com.  It is $35, which is a pretty good deal considering that by the time you accumulated 12 remedies you could have anywhere from $48 upwards invested, depending on individual companies.  It contains the following (I've put some notes in for some of the remedies and others can add in or delete from my observations); all are 30C except as where noted:

• Aconite  - never used this but I think good for quick onset of respiratory probs (as in colds)
• Arnica both 1M and 30C - this is good for bruises, pain management, sore limbs and body aches
• Apis   - bug or insect bites; stinging sensations
• Belladonna   conditions where there is heat and redness occurring, fevers
• Cantharis   can sometimes, although not always help with UTIs
• Hepar Sulphurus  - I'll let someone else add their .02 on this
• Hypericum  tips of nerves i.e. finger and toe injuries
• Ledum  puncture wounds or poisonous bites
• Nux Vomica   some UTI symptoms, also digestive probs
• Phosphorus   can help with bleeding after surgeries
• Rhus Tox   skin rashes, strains from overlifting, swelling in tendons and joints

Leah

Sharon C wrote:
<<I think this is the correct spelling for Nosdose.  Where can I get it and how old are the kittens before you use it on them?>>

Hi Sharon,

I have never used nosodes myself but have been reading up on them because I'm expecting a little orange kitten to come (back actually, for those of u who know about Booey) into my life in about 2 months or so.  What's interesting is that Dr. Hahnemann himself, as well as Dr. Hering used nosodes.  And there is a very provocative article in Homeopathy Today that deals w/ the prohylactic aspect of using homeo remedies, esp nosodes.  I'm becoming more and more inclined to think they are worth a shot (if you'll excuse the expression:)

Anyway, here's an article about nosodes.  The author is Marina Zacharias, a natural d*g breeder.  I was told that as long as she gets credit for the article, it is ok for me to post it here.  So here goes:
_____________
Nosodes
by Marina Zacharias, Author & Editor of Natural Rearing Newsletter
Copyright(c) 1996

The following article was reprinted from the January 1996 issue of  Natural Rearing Newsletter by permission of the author.

So what is a Nosode?

Simply stated: a nosode is a homeopathic remedy prepared from a  pathological specimen. (See Issue #6 "Homeopathy--Some Basics".) The  only difference between a nosode and any other remedy, is the starting material. It could be blood, pus, any other body secretion or excretion, or even a diseased fragment of tissue, sluch as a growth. Rabies nosode for example, starts with the saliva of a rabid dog and is then "potentized".

A nosode could be described as an "oral vaccine" in the sense that its purpose is to "immunize" the body against a specific disease. The major difference between a nosode and an "orthodox" vaccine is of course the extremely small (if any) quantity of physical substance in a nosode. Remember, it is the "energy" pattern not the "substance" that does the job in a homeopathic remedy.

Do they work?

There is a considerable body of evidence (gathered over the last 200 years) that strongly suggests they actually can provide immunity!!

As usual when discussing the origins of homeopathy, we must refer to "human" experience which only in relatively recent time has been applied to animals.

The `Father' of homeopathy, Dr. Samuel Hahnemann, was the first to use prophylactic remedies. He found that a girl whom he had treated with "Belladonna" (the homeopathic form, of course) for an unrelated problem, did not develop Scarlet Fever when the rest of her family became sick. He found the "provings" of Belladonna fit the disease picture of that particular epidemic of Scarlet Fever. (Remember the principle of 'like cures like'). He went on to show that by administering Belladonna, he
could prevent and cure that disease.

Later, homeopaths also found that "Ailanthus" could prevent Scarlet Fever. Hahnemann later advocated the use of "Camphor" to prevent or treat Cholera. He had never seen the disease, only heard descriptions of it from the east. Successful treatment and prevention of Cholera during this epidemic greatly popularized homeopathy throughout Europe at the time.

 Other homeopaths found that "Lathyrus" is able to prevent polio. "Mercurius Cyanatus" was effective in preventing diphtheria. "Baptisia" was useful for preventing typhoid fever. The list went on for measles, mumps, chicken pox, hepatitis, etc..

But it is not only in ancient history that we find compelling evidence that nosodes can and do provide effective immunization. Take Polio as an example:

•1850-Taylor Smith in Johannesburg, South Africa immunized 82 people with "Lathyrus". 12 of the 82 were in direct contact with disease in an epidemic area. There were no cases reported in any of the 82-a 100% success.
•More recent times-Grimmer in Chicago `vaccinated' 5,000 young children with "Lathyrus". None of them developed polio.
•Heisfelder, in a study between 1956-58, immunized over 6,000 children with this nosode. There were no side effects and no cases of polio.
•In 1975, during a polio epidemic in Buenos Aires, "Lathyrus" was given to 40,000 people. Not one of these developed polio.

Nosodes have been developed and used successfully for almost all animal disease and more recently for `heartworm'. The late Dr. George MacLeod, in his book "Dogs: Homeopathic Remedies" had this to say about nosodes:

"...gives a more solid immunity inasmuch as it incorporates the entire defense system, which is mobilized as soon as the vaccine is taken into the mouth and builds up protection with each further dose. This build-up leads from tonsillar tissue through the lymphatics incorporating the entire reticuloendothelial system. This procedure is equivalent to what is known as `street infection' viz., ingestion of virus etc. during daily contact with other animals, when immunity would be built up in the same way."
"...There are no side effects when using homeopathic oral vaccines-a reaction may sometimes be observed...but such reaction is transient and soon passes."
"..Another advantage in protection by homeopathic means, is that vaccination can be started very early in the pup's life, e.g., within the first week if necessary. This does not interfere with the presence of any maternal antibodies."

In the U.S.A., the primary source for nosodes is the Hahnemann Pharmacy in Berkeley, California. Interestingly, nosodes can be obtained in `singular' form or in a `combination' form. Both forms are presently being used by holistic vets with good results.

I should mention however, that there is no unanimous agreement between vets, with respect to the schedule of application. There are various protocols of administration being used, so don't be surprised if you run across different recommendations from different people.

Nosodes share the same problem as other homeopathic remedies, i.e., they don't fit into current scientific understanding. Back in the 1550's, an Italian anatomist said the heart was a pump. He was burned at the stake. Seventy-five years later, William Harvey said the same thing. He was knighted. What happened in between those two events was that the mechanical pumps came into widespread use for irrigation and mining. Homeopathy doesn't make sense to most people because it lacks a real
world metaphor. Until it has one, all the positive studies in the world won't be able to crack open the closed mind. I am thankful that there is a growing number of people that "choose to think for themselves."

Hi Sandy,

Hate to do this, but something here struck me. You know I'm a huge fan of homeopathy...

Sandy A wrote:
<<"There are no side effects when using homeopathic oral vaccines-a reaction may sometimes be observed?but such reaction is transient and  soon passes.">>

This is exactly what the allopaths say about regular, injected vaccinations.  I don't believe it for a second that regular vaccinations don't have long term side effects besides the immediate, just-after-the-shot side effects. But if they do, and these nosodes also have short term side effects...., well, you can see where I'm going with this. I'm just afraid we don't really know the long term effects of this. Maybe the immunity is worth it though. Tough call.

After hearing this, saying that aggravations or some such can happen and then examining the high repeat rate of most nosode dosage schedules, I just can't bring myself to use them. I'm too chicken to risk a proving. Maybe if giving the dose once or twice was enough I'd do it. Dunno. Most of my reading on using these for a specific dis-ease was for heartworm and it seemed very excessive the number of doses given. Maybe other dis-eases would be different. What have you found as far as dosage schedules for little kitty troubles?

Be well,
Nancy and the furkids

Hi Carole,

<<First, what is the difference between the c and x potencies (ie: 30C, 30X)?>>

X remedies are diluted in a 1 (tincture) to 9 (water/alcohol) ratio.  C are in a 1:99 ratio.  Easy (tho not totally accurate) rule of thumb is that a C is about twice the potency of an X w/ the same # e.g. 6C is about the same as 12X.

Where it becomes confusing is the succussion.  All Cs are succussed 100 times after each dilution to get to the next higher C potency.  But Xs can be diluted 10 times or 100 times.  Dr. H wrote 6 Organons and apparently as time went by, he changed his technique many times.  He kept honing it, using diff potencies etc.  So in the 4th Organon, he successed 10 times but in the 5th, 100 times.

An excellent article by Peter Morrell is available for viewing at the site I posted earlier in the week w/ the Boericke and Kent online Reps. I believe it's http://www.homeoint.org One of Peter's articles there has stats on which potencies Dr. H himself
used over his practicing lifetime.  I think 30C has the highest frequency.

Also, there is a very interesting book by Rima Handley called "A homeopathic love story" where she talks about how Dr. h himself often used 2 (or more) remedies at a time.  i read the book a long time ago; I remember being fascinated by it.

I spent my entire childhood thinking the so-called "classical' approach was the only way.  Now I'm reading more and more that Dr. H practised Homeopathy quite differently than how his devotees today think he did. Fascinating stuff.  I can see how he would have continued to perfect this most wonderful modality.  Who knows where it would have gone.  Alas, some homeopaths today are very narrow-minded:(  I feel whatever works for my kitties, is what I'll stick w/.

<<Second, what are your opinions on Dr. Pitcairn's remedy suggestions in his book?  Is there a better source of information for cats?>>

I think they are a great shortcut in that it saves someone the hassle of having to look up symptoms in a Repertory, settle on the top picks and then look 'em up in a an MM.  What he does is give u the oft-used remedies for a given condition.  That can be good if indeed there might have been a match anyway.  Or it can be bad b/c I've seen cases where none of his remedies would have matched had I repertorized my kitty's case properly. So it's rather hit-or-miss is what i'm trying to say.

Also, he and other authors do homeopathy a bit (ok I'm being mild; the homeo fascists on some other lists that deal w/ this topic would be foaming at the mouth) of a disservice by categorizing remedies by disease names.  Anyone who has studied homeopathy, knows that 2 people w/ the same disease e.g. a cold or the flu, might need 2 diff remedies.  It must be tailored to the individual.

Oops, I've rambled.  U guys, I need to read and think about nosodes some more before I can add anything to the discussion.  I was hoping marina's article would give u food for thought tho. <g>

BTW, I'd love to hear from anyone who has used nosodes - success stories or failure, doesn't matter.  If u don't wanna post to the list, pls feel free to write me privately.

Sandy, owned and operated by the mountain cats