CBC Newsworld Wednesday 1997 12 10 13:30 EST / no permission / typos all mine / transcribed from tape / spelling of proper nouns not guaranteed === begin transcript === [Joanne Stefanyk / announcer 1] This next story involves a young man who goes on Oprah. Before that, waaay before that, he was in living in Newfoundland, then moved to Toronto to follow the lifestyle of his choice. [Jordi Morgan / announcer 2] Well he was a young gay man in a small outport of Newfoundland and felt that it would be totally unacceptable lifestyle for his community and had to leave [Stefanyk] he was worried about his parents, wasn't he? [Morgan] of course. This is not the first story we've seen like this. He was worried for his parents, and worried about how they would be treated by the rest of the community as a result of his coming out. Apparently he and his dad are going to be on Oprah. [Stefanyk] He saw the Ellen show - you know, the one where she came out - and he decided he'd do the same thing. So he called his parents and told them and that was it - now they're on Oprah. We want you to take a look at this item. === [Leroy Wall, being interviewed in his Toronto home] My new lifestyle started about three years ago when I was in a relationship, but I had two separate lives. I hadn't told anyone in my past, my friends or my family, nor was I ever going to tell anybody. [Doug Grier, CBC News] Leroy Wall now lives and works in Toronto, where nobody cares what you do. The very heart of Big City Canada. But he grew up in the Codroy Valley: typical small-town Newfoundland -- a tough place to grow up gay. [Codroy is just north of Port-aux-Basques, down in the SW (bottom left) corner of Newfoundland] [Leroy] Everybody in the town is English, Catholic, white, and straight -- or at least, that's the image they present. [Jerome Wall, at his home in Newfoundland] I had no inkling he was gay, [Grier] Jerome Wall is Leroy's father. He still lives in the Codroy, and teaches school there. [Jerome] He tried the heterosexual life -- even his second last year at St F-X [St Francis Xavier university, in Antigonish NS] he come home for Christmas, he brought a female friend back with him. These were signals to us, I guess, that he was 'normal'. But he wasn't happy with it. It was an act. [Leroy] But as long as I stayed in small town Newfoundland, that's what I would have had to do, because -- it's bad even today: I'm the only person in my town that I can think of that would ever come out. [Grier] He couldn't even tell his parents. [Leroy] I tried a lot of times before: pick up the phone with the intention of telling them, and have a half hour or an hour conversation, and never work it into the conversation. I'd hang up, and then I'd go to bed mad because I wanted to tell them and I couldn't. [Grier] Then, April 30th 1997, "Ellen" brought gay pride to network TV. [Clip from "Ellen", with Ellen DeGeneres saying "I'm gay"] [Leroy] I just remember "Ellen". All the things she said in the show described exactly how I was feeling. [Grier] If Ellen DeGeneres could tell the world, Leroy Wall could tell his family. [Leroy] So I went home after the show, and before I even knew what I was doing, I picked the phone up, I called my parents, and I told them. [Jerome] It was a shocker to both of us, that's for sure. [Grier] Dad wondered how his little boy turned out gay. [Jerome] There's a school of thought that supports it being learned, and influences in your life, possibly causing you to be more comfortable with the same sex, but I don't think this was the case with Leroy. He doesn't believe it. He's told me that he is what he is, and it's innate; and there's no need to try to find fault or blame [Grier] His mother doesn't want to talk about it on TV. [Leroy] They always say "your mother knows", but she didn't suspect, so it was a complete shock. My dad was very supportive. [Jerome] You're not the first, and you won't be the last. I've known a other guys who were gay, and they're perfectly normal, live good professional lives, you'll be the same. [Leroy] He actually came to visit me in Toronto shortly after I came out and spent some time with me just to say, you know, it's OK. [Jerome] When I arrived that day at his house, and stayed with him and his friend; and he was making up the bed and said "It feels so good, Dad, to be making this up for you, instead of lying about this being 'my room' and where I used to be. I don't have to lie any more. [Grier] Then Leroy took it one very big step further. He told his mother and father about it; his aunts, uncles, friends -- everybody in rural Newfoundland had been so supportive of his coming out that he wrote a letter about it. Not to big-city Canada, but to very-big-city USA. [clip of opening of Oprah show] Talk show host Oprah Winfrey had played a part in the coming-out episode of "Ellen". Leroy wrote to Oprah. [Leroy] On Monday, I'm sitting at my desk in the office, and the phone rings, and I answer the phone and I hear "Hi Leroy, this is Oprah calling". And I go "yeah, right, Oprah is going to call me." So she started talking about my letter, and I knew it had to be her, because nobody else knew that I'd written this letter. [Grier] Next thing, Leroy's on a plane to Chicago for a taping of the Oprah show, along with Jerome. [Jerome] Something that ought to be talked about more, I expect. I probably didn't feel that way in the past, but now I have a closer association with homosexuality I want more people to become more aware of it; and not to have fears or phobias about it. [Leroy] It means a lot that my dad's going. He's the one person who I thought would never accept it. He always wanted the athletic kid, and I never thought that he would ever accept -- and he was the most accepting. [Jerome] He was one of my kids, and he was normal, and he hasn't changed. It's just I now know something about him that I didn't know before. [Grier] Doug Grier, CBC News. === Oprah Winfrey Show 1997 12 10 / no permission and all that [Oprah] The number one show, to provoke the biggest audience response -- 5000 of you wrote when Ellen DeGeneres broke the silence and came out of the closet about her sexuality. [clip of Ellen/Oprah interview] [Oprah] Why was it necessary for you to come out, tell the public was it necessary for the character to do so. [Ellen] Because it's OK. Because it IS okay. [Oprah] We did two shows on Ellen DeGeneres this year. I appeared as you all know as her therapist in her coming out episode on the sitcom "Ellen". Leroy Wall of Toronto wrote to tell me that he took a dramatic step out in his own life after those shows. Leroy says [reading from letter] "your appearance on the 'Ellen' show changed my life. Shortly after the show I informed all my family and friends of my two-year relationship with the most wonderful person on this earth. I've never been one to follow the lives of celebrities, but when someone does so much to change my life I feel the need to follow it up. Take care. Leroy." Well, Leroy, so this was - this was your coming out? [Leroy]Yes, I watched you on - first of all, I have to thank you. It was you and it was Ellen. I lived a double life for a number of years. A double life at work, a double life among my family, a double life among my friends. I had a straight life, and I had a gay life that could never meet. [Oprah] How do you do that? [Leroy] Well, it's tough. [Oprah] This is your father -- this is Leroy's father Jerome. Did you not know your son was gay? [Jerome] no, I didn't know. [Oprah] you're kidding - you didn't know? I always think that parents Know. Does your mother know? [Leroy] They always say "your mother knows", she was the most shocked of all. [Oprah] really! [Jerome] the signals that we got suggested he was heterosexual; he used to bring women home and so on. [Oprah] So that's what you mean by double life. [Leroy] Yes -- I had fictitious girlfriends. I was always telling people I had a girlfriend when I never did. For the last two years I was in a relationship and actually lying to everybody. When I watched the "Ellen" show, before I knew what I was doing, I watched you as a therapist tell her it was okay, as soon as the show was over, I turned off the TV and I picked up the phone and just called. I called my parents, I called my brother, my sister, and within a week I called all my friends. And now the double life is over. You've changed my life, now I can live ONE, happy life. [Oprah] really! [applause] And how did your family react? How did you react, Jerome? [Jerome] at first it was shocking, disturbing, we were disappointed. Kinda wondered what could have brought this about, but reality set in [Oprah] do you have other children? [Jerome] Yes I do, an older son and a daughter. [Oprah] does your brother know? Did they know? [Leroy] My sister's known for about a year. [Oprah] but you're not living a lie any more. [Leroy] well in fact after this week, when I had to ask for time off from my work, they know at work, now I'm completely out, everyone knows -- and I guess after today EVERYbody knows. [Oprah] well I guess so! [laughter] You know, I got a LOT of criticism for doing that episode, and I still feel that people should be allowed -- I believe that God created people, all of us, the way you are, and I believe that you should be allowed to live your own truth. I really do believe that. Is that what you've come to? [Jerome] yes. Reality set in right fast. As quickly as my holidays came, I drove up to Toronto to support him. Did some boating together, that sort of thing. [Oprah] Did you feel differently towards your son? [Jerome] I think we've become closer. [Oprah] Well you are a model for parenting, then. So thank you both. Thank you so much. [Leroy, Jerome] Thank you. ==== end transcripts ====