Feel free to forward this email to all your friends and encourage them to request a free subscription.
This is Cliff's Private List, a free e-mail relating to seduction. Your comments are requested, encouraged, and greatly appreciated (note that comments from people commenting are separated by IIIIIIII) . If you know anyone who would like to be added to the list to receive this, or if you would like to be removed from the list, send an e-mail (or hit "Reply") asking to be removed to [email protected] and it will be done (I have had some problems receiving emails lately, and you might be well advised to also address a "cc" of your email to me at [email protected] ). Please note that the [email protected] address will eventually change, so it would be best to keep sending emails to the other two addresses only. If you would like to be added to the free joke list, just ask. For those of you unfamiliar with the references to Speed Seduction, we highly recommend your visiting http://www.speed-seduction.com/
By your accepting receipt of these emails, you understand that the information
contained in this email and in any other emails you may have received from us
is an expression of opinions, and they should be used for personal entertainment
purposes only. You are responsible for your own behavior, and none of anything
you read herein is to be considered legal or personal advice. You also understand
and agree that any products you may order as a result of your reading about
them in these emails are produced and sold independently from us and that any
complaints, disputes or other issues which you may have with the sponsors of
these products are to be dealt with directly with said sponsors and we are not
responsible in any way whatsoever for any issues which you may have with them.
If you are not in agreement with any of this, please email me immediately and
request to be removed from the subscription list.
For those interested in seeing the previous emails that were sent out ("the
archives"), they are available on request, or you can visit http://www.fastseduction.com/cliff/
IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII
Cliff's Comments:
Firstly, if you are in Montreal, please contact me and get on my Montreal email
list. There are sometimes events that happen here that aren't mentioned on this
list because they are too local (such as there's a meeting of Montreal SS'ers
& PUA's tonight (Sunday, Dec. 16, 2001) at Carlos & Pepe's downtown
at 7:00 pm that you would have known about if you were on that list.
Secondly, here are a few interesting links (copied from Mystery's Lounge -
see below for info on how to get into Mystery's Lounge): http://www.passwordshq.com
- All the hacked porn you can download.
http://www.scentiments.com - Someone researched the other fragrance sites and
says this one is consistently 20 to 30 dollars cheaper per bottle.
http://www.seductionnow.com - This site has a lot of links and it contains pretty
much all that an aspiring PUA needs to know.
And finally this one (not from Mystery's Lounge): http://www.ShesSingle.com This is a pretty interesting dating site because it is geared only to good looking people. If someone wants to check it out and let us know what you find, that would be great.
IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII
The following is an edited version of a lengthy exchange between Mark B.
and Ross that went on over emails:
(Commenting on: "MB: I believe this happens because he is really cute and
sexy to her even if not to us and it has to do with the fact that he may be
really her type
irrespective of other factors. In other words, if he is fat and ugly and she
is with him, it's because that is what attracts her physically. I seriously
doubt that he can win her over if there is no attraction whatsoever and if he
is not her type purely on the basis of personality or "techniques.""):
RJ: From your perspective, you are right, but from another, you are wrong.
MB: There are no absolute rights or wrongs, only opinions.
RJ: From the frame of reference of someone WITHOUT the tools or understanding
to build an airplane and fly it, FLIGHT seems impossible. So, from your
frame, you are RIGHT. From the frame of those who DO know how and USE the tools,
you are wrong.
How do women, internally recognize they are meeting someone who is their "type"?
How do women RECOGNIZE for themselves, that they ARE "attracted" to
someone? That is the question you are ignoring.
MB: As men we can never know but only assume based on what we see and what they tell us. But in my experience, physical attraction must exist as well as a connection for the complete attraction to develop and last.
RJ: But how does a woman KNOW she is attracted to a guy? In fact, if you know
how to ask the question, you'll find out. Almost always the sequence involves:
butterflies in the tummy feeling
a flush of warmth goes up the chest and into the face they make a sound to themselves
something like a moan or a sigh They picture being touched/kissed/fucked by
the guy Their throat gets tight
They feel the warmth flush and rush back down to their crotch...they get a burning,
itching, needy feeling down there.
THAT is the sequence for most of them. If you know how to re-count/revivify,
get them to run that sequence, ALL OF THE BELLS GO OFF AND BOOM: YOU HAVE THE
ATTRACTION.
MB: Yes, these must exist but the problem is that there are also feelings they feel to equal revulsion and disgust and they produce equally strong reactions in a woman. What happens if you elicit those before you have a chance to have her feel the good feelings? Also, even if you can make her feel these feelings how can you attach them to you if she just does not see you in that light? Pretty tough to do in my view.
RJ: It's common for myself and my students to get women who did not feel the SLIGHTEST attraction to us at first sight. I sleep with women 20 years younger than me, who have told me, later, that at first, before I opened my mouth, THEY THOUGHT I WAS UGLY. Or, even as bad, that I WAS NOT THEIR "TYPE".
MB: There is a big difference between attraction and physical beauty. We can
all cite examples of ourselves and other men and women who were attracted to
people that were ugly or not beautiful and not attracted to men and women who
were gorgeous. Thus you can easily find women who will be attracted to you even
though you may not possess great personal beauty in the common sense. You are
discounting your value by assuming that you need to be
beautiful to be attractive to someone. You do as I and surely many others can
recall times when we felt attraction to "ugly" people. Therefore,
it's too simple to assume just because one is ugly he is not attractive and
the only way to elicit attraction is through patterns or hypnosis. It may already
be there and all it takes is developing a comfort level with the woman and making
your intent known as well as your availability and interest in her and she is
yours.
RJ: I am reminded of the guy who thinks martial arts are impossible or unnecessary, because he believes that if you have brute size and strength you can win a fight against someone untrained simply by falling on them or belting them once.
MB: I am not going into absolutes. What you are saying is that you can turn
a blind man into a sharpshooter or a Rosie O'Donnell into a ballerina. Like
in all others things in this world,
we need capacity first before you can develop potential. Try making a Sumo wrestler
into a contortionist.
(Commenting on: "MB: I know a black woman who only dated and was attracted
to white men. Then she met a half black half white guy who would not leave her
alone, kept calling her, telling her how much he likes her on and on...He then
told her a sad ass story about how rough he has it living at home and whether
he could move in with her into her spare room. She agreed.
While living there he took great interest in her 2 year old daughter and she
realized this guy could be
a good father substitute. She fell in love and they began sleeping together
within two months of him moving in. She said she became attracted to him based
on her love for him. Over time he lost weight, got himself into great shape
and had all the neighbourhood women after him. So far so good right?
WRONG - after 4 years of this she said she began losing attraction for him and
suggested they sleep in separate beds and not fuck until marriage.
RJ: SO the ENTIRE experience and "attraction" she felt gets negated and NEVER existed because she CEASED being attracted to him at some point? By your reasoning, with EVERY marriage or relationship that fails based on the attraction petering out, it MUST be because the attraction was NEVER real to begin with.
MB (Continuing): I don't see things as absolutes. There were other factors such as him being neglectful of her but we all know women who fuck their ex-boyfriends because they are physically attracted to them but they do not fulfill their other needs and want nothing else to do with them. She lost faith in him as a man and refused to sleep with him. She could have just as well continued fucking him but her attraction to him was never really fully there so even that did not happen. She said she did not really see him as a man and really had no attraction to him but saw him as a friend. Marriage never came as she met me and began sleeping with me behind his back and buddy went out the door a few months later. He to this day wants her back. Moral of the story is you better have attraction to you from a woman that comes naturally or else your success will be temporary as in the case of buddy boy here."
RJ: I don't get that conclusion at all; I get he failed to maintain her interest and attraction. How do you explain NATURAL attractions that peter out?
MB: I explain that by suggesting that the other person does something that makes them unattractive such as having a certain smell, acting weak, not being responsible, whatever.
RJ: When a woman looks at you and is immediately attracted, HOW DOES SHE KNOW?
How does she signal herself she wants you? I didn't ask, notice, what YOU
have that makes them generate the signal. I didn't discuss a better tan, leaner
muscle. I asked about what happens INSIDE her that let's her have the recognition
that these things ARE attractive to her.
MB: She has the physiological responses you mention. Just as I salivate at
the sight of a juicy steak or you at the sight of a hot young babe, these reactions
are involuntary. You can easily invoke thoughts of these feelings and even make
a woman feel them but attaching them to you is the big problem if she does not
have the capacity to naturally attach them to you "Houston
we have a problem."
RJ: No, attaching them to you is NOT a problem for students of SS who understand
how to do it. It is a problem for everyone who doesn't know how. The solution,
my friend, is called ANCHORING. You can learn many fun and easy ways to do so
at:
http://www.essential-skills.com/ My buddy Tom Vizzini needs to jump in here
and talk about this.
(Commenting on: "MB: Do you think these things are voluntary? Does she make a conscious decision to be attracted to anyone?"):
RJ: They don't need to be voluntary for them to work; they just need to be evoked. The issue isn't "are they voluntary." The issue is, DO the signals exist for her ON some level of consciousness, and can we get access to those signals, trigger them off, to get the responses we want? The plain answer is "yes." All sorts of outside of conscious awareness "things" and processes can be and routinely ARE triggered by suggestion, trance, hypnosis,etc.
MB: You can make a woman feel these things but she will think of someone she is attracted to physically.
RJ: Not if you link it to yourself. This is a proven, tested part of the SS technology. Again, if you can't do it, don't assume others can't.
MB: I actually discussed this very issue with about 10 women in the last few days and they all admitted they would sleep with an ugly guy who they found attractive but would not even if he was gorgeous but they had no attraction no matter what sorts of feelings of attraction he invoked. Can you make yourself not attracted to Pam Anderson?
RJ: News flash: I met "plastic Pam" in the flesh and found her utterly revolting. She doesn't even appear to be alive; she reminded me of nothing so much as a mannequin with a little person inside, in a hidden compartment, pulling the levers to make her work. Given a sufficiently good trance, I could have you respond to a fat, ugly, hairy woman with the SAME physiological cues you'd give off with Pam Anderson or whomever trips your trigger...granted, it would have to be a damn DEEP trance, but we COULD get there. In fact, all sorts of INVOLUNTARY things like blood flow, blood pressure, skin temperature and the like can be "controlled" through trance.
MB: Maybe you could but I would not attach those feelings to her when in a conscious state. If I did respond to her it would not be voluntary hence the "drug in the drink" metaphor. Besides we want to be with people who are with us because of us not on the basis of some altered state. Attraction just happens based on her genetic programming, social conditioning, experience and a whole host of other factors.
RJ: ATTRACTION is not a "thing". It is a response, involving a process.
Know the process, reproduce the process. But thinking in terms of processes,
not concrete "things" requires the ability to think "abstractly."
As for genetic programming; this is bad science. In fact, genes are NOT self-emergent.
GENES ONLY ACTIVATE IN RESPONSE TO A SIGNAL FROM THE ENVIRONMENT. The messenger
molecules that bring these signals work by electro-chemically altering the shape
of the proteins that cover the genes. The proteins cover the genes like a sleeve,
preventing them from being read. When the messenger molecules pull back the
protein sleeves, ONLY then does the gene get activated. The proteins respond
100 times more effectively to electro-magnetic frequencies than they do to the
physical messenger molecules. Yes, we can make an electro-magnetic analog to
the physical molecule that works 100 times better; the proteins RESPOND TO THE
SIGNAL even though it is NOT in electro-chemical "natural" form and
respond 100 times better. (Why? Because chemical reactions lose a great deal
of energy to heat, plus chemical reactions move slowly; electro-magnetic signals
move at the speed of light; 186,000 miles per second). For more on what really
happens with genes, go to: http://www.brucelipton.com/
MB: However, the protein needs to have the necessary receptors and thus capacity to be altered by the electro magnetic signal that you are sending.
RJ: The human neurology and brain have more than enough "receptors" for any states/feelings/emotions you wish to evoke and create.
MB: Think of it this way. If you sending the strongest radio signal to a television antenna you are not going to get a response. In addition you make it seem as if the individual has no conscious control over their chemical response which is not true. Medical literature is filled with cases of individuals responding extraordinarily well to treatment which otherwise takes longer in the average person simply on the basis of their will. Other studies have shown hypothermia victims surviving more than otherwise possible in cold water on the basis of their will. People displaying superhuman strength otherwise not possible to lift a car to get their children out from below. You suggest these are involuntary responses - yes, it's true you cannot help but think of swimming in an ocean when you read "swimming in an ocean" but to motivate yourself to actually do it you need to have the capacity and desire to go ahead. Similarly if a woman just did not find you attractive by sheer strength of her conviction nothing you could do could turn her around. You can if you can elicit in her feelings of attraction. You better be able to hold them because once they start to dip you are finished as buddy boy in my story above. It seems to me that SS is a temporary solution to a permanent problem when no attraction exists to begin with."):
RJ: Whatever and wherever that takes place in her body IS the signal for her that triggers the recognition and ALL THE BEHAVIOR THAT GOES WITH IT (fucking you, wanting to fuck you, flirting, offering her number, etc.). Get her, using language and energy, to FEEL THAT SIGNAL and she WILL identify you as someone who "is her type" or someone who "she IS attracted to" because she's trained herself to act that way and think that way, once she recognizes the signals she gives herself. She will then RATIONALIZE the entire thing as being natural, when in fact, it was engineered.
(Commenting on: "MB: That's fine but you are ignoring the fact that these
occur when she is the least bit attracted to someone. If she is not then she
will see these feelings as incongruent with her physical attraction.
She'll say "this guy is not my type but why do I feel attraction? Something
is wrong here" or you may be actually able to get her but once she "glow"
wears off you are done.......Kira Kenner, a stunning porn star, said in an interview
once, that she prefers
men with large beer bellies because she likes the warmth of a big gut and that
is sexy to her. http://www.2xtreme.net/stuff/angel/kirakener.html"):
RJ: Great, that is HER personal peccadillo. Notice, it is the FEELING of the warmth and NOT the actual belly. Give her the same warmth, even amp it up, and she'll bang ya!
(Commenting on: "MB: A few weeks ago I was listening to a radio program which features men who love fat women, the fatter the better. If men can have those sorts of perverse attractions, why should we assume that some beautiful women would not find some fat men or men out of the norm of attractiveness equally attractive and assume that these men were only able to get them on the basis of personality, patterns etc?"):
RJ: Some will, but even then, you are IGNORING the internal signaling process she goes through. Hijack the process, get the behavior, regardless if you really HAVE the external look, whether that is fat, muscles, pale, tan or anything else.
MB: Dictionary.com has the following definition for hijack - To stop and rob, To steal from as if by hijacking, To swindle or subject to extortion. Is this really what you want to do to women?
Cliff's Comment: Besides all's fair in love and war, I don't think that you are realistic here. Many of us have been in the situation where we were seeing someone and some other guy came around and got her attention - is that stealing? Or, no matter how it was done, isn't it really her individual choice that is ultimately responsible for who a woman goes with and how she treats someone she may be seeing? If she decides to go with someone new because he excited her (or elicited the right responses), that happens every day and I don't know if you can equate that with "stealing."
(Commenting on: "MB: Women, just like men, know whether or not they are attracted to someone when they first meet them."):
RJ: You are missing the implications of that statement. You aren't looking deeply enough. HOW do they know? Not what the man has that they are attracted to. But HOW do they let themselves know it?
MB: Women, as well as men, given enough time to see you know whether they are attracted and they also know whether are not you are ugly or beautiful. The two are mutually exclusive and do not depend on each other as you imply.
RJ: Who said I would "tell her"? I could help her to induce those feelings in a guided visualization, amp them up and make them stronger than she's ever "naturally" had them.
MB: Sure you can get her to feel them but like I said if she already does not have the capacity to attach them to you if you amp them high enough she will feel incongruence. The point is that SS and NLP is likely to enhance what is already there but if you have nothing to begin with you end with nothing in the end no matter what you do. 0 times any number is still 0.
RJ: You are dancing around the issue: how you use language to evoke these feelings
IS something.You seem to think that because you can't/don't/won't use language
to do
so, that none of the rest of us can/should/would. You are just plain wrong.
MB: It's much easier to say to her after you have built up trust rapport "I would like to make passionate love to you all night long" rather than "Have you ever made passionate love all night long..." This way she knows it's about you and her and she can imagine the two of you doing it together rather than with some other guy in the past and then she looks at you and thinks "this guy does not come close to the guy I just imagined".
RJ: Well, what you HAVE is rapport and the ability to gather info/elict/evoke/amp up the signals and processes that tell her "BANG THIS GUY." No "attraction" to start with does NOT mean "nothing." That is a limited premise, not one I subscribe to. I can always start with rapport and gathering the info I need for the seduction. I expand her experience with whom she can enjoy deep pleasure and good feeling.
MB: Sure you need all of the above. But why not incite her with what you can do by showing value in yourself and your offering to her rather than hoping she will attach it to you by your indirect implications. The real danger here is she will think of someone else. I can just see it "Have you ever felt passion...?" "Yes, I did with my last boyfriend, the sex was so hot" and you are left in the dust.
RJ: "Have you ever" is just one of many ways and it's an outdated one at that. We have plenty of ways to insure what we evoke is attached to us. The ability and skill of evoking deep pleasure with my language, mind and touch IS great value.
MB: No doubt and when you find women who are receptive to this you can add great value. Remember that you are getting women who are attracted to you but may not find you beautiful as discussed earlier.
RJ: No, they were not attracted to me based on what they first saw. They didn't LOOK at me and feel those butterflies, those sparks, unlike what YOU seem to describe...women hitting on you because you suddenly have a tan or more lean muscle mass.
MB: You are also only getting women that are highly suggestible to your techniques
and in essence you are not really getting her essence but a body with an altered
state. I
am not saying SS does not work. I believe that the smallest grain of attraction
must exist in order for SS to enhance what is already there. At the same time,
being more direct with her "I feel a connection between us Mary" "I
feel like we could really grow together and feel comfortable with one another
and have great passionate times" "It would be great for us to make
love to each other all night long," etc. This way you are invoking the
process as well, making sure you area attaching it to yourself, putting yourself
in the picture as well as seeing if she feels the same way.
IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII
GoneSavage:
Flying Dutchman's post on televised beach PU and follow-up interview got me
thinking. This seems like a great way for PUA's to collaborate, get feedback,
and perhaps create a PRODUCT.
PUA #1 approaches a girl or a set of girls and spits his game. Probably he is
being filmed from a distance. At least he is microphoned so we know exactly
what he is saying. Well, favorable or not, close or not, he has results. These
results can be evaluated by the other PUA collaborators.
"This is where I would have gone kino..." "What if you has said
this instead..." Get it?
But this is the fun part, the way I'm seeing things. The girl or group then
gets approached by a cameraman and an interviewer. Here we find out what made
PUA #1's approach favorable or not. "I just felt drawn to him..."
"He just wasn't tan..." all that. Great feedback for PUA #1. But the
interviewer, being a PUA himself, coupled with his social-authority front, may
decide to justify PUA #1 as a great catch, seduce the girl himself, or at least
lead the interview into highly sexual questions.
Well, I will go ahead and put the idea on the table because it's something I've
really been thinking about. If anyone wants to get together and hit Panama City
Beach, FL for Spring Break March 18-24, let's do it. It'd be one thing to get
some PUA's together on the beach, but another thing to DOCUMENT the event, which
is what I really want to do. Besides this one, most of my ideas are pretty outrageous;
it's like Girls Gone Wild meets Jackass meets BangBus or something. We could
get some of those kiss openers on video. The edutainment possibilities are endless.
Well, the invitation is out. If you think you can make it or just want to shoot
the shit, drop me an email: [email protected]
IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII
Dwacon (Dwacon Entertainment presents: Hillary Clinton's congressional striptease
http://www.dwacon.com):
I have a friend who hosts big events in the area, and he invited me to his latest
party. I had VIP access to the club which worked quite well in my favor.
I walked in and spotted three young women (20-somethings) and zeroed in on the
cutest one. Well, her friends got jealous and froze me out immediately, so I
quickly got her number and made plans to see her.
I went over to the bar where I saw a lovely young lady trying to get the bartender's
attention. I whispered to her, while doing some kino "the bartender is
gay. He must be, how could any man not want to gaze at a beauty like you."
Got her number like within 2 minutes.
Later, as the evening progressed, it became more and more icy and the HB I worked
on for about a half hour said, "You know, if I weren't already married,
you would have had a great chance with me." D-OHH !!! Forgot to check the
finger.
Speaking of which, I started getting the finger from the women I tried to approach
and figured I'd cut my losses and quit while I'm ahead. The liquid nitrogen
was flowing freely... to the point where one HB said, "We can't talk to
you, I'm waiting for my friend's husband to come out of the bathroom" although
her friend had no ring on and the bathroom was on the exact opposite side of
the building.
I got to get out of Washington DC... beating this snobbery is like swimming
up stream. Sure, you occasionally get to spawn... but the effort nearly kills
you.
IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII
Tristan:
Go figure...
This one is for the books. I meet this woman at a concert, since we have a mutual
friend conversation flows easily. She's a singer, we talk about music and so
on. Within the first half hour of conversation, when I ask her about what's
really important to her she mentions her belief in Jesus. Now, though many of
you will figure that this indicated that chances for a close would be slim,
read on, you'll be surprised! I certainly was! You see, on top of it , it wasn't
just a passing comment to indicate what religion she was. She spent the better
part of the night talking about Jesus. At that point we were sitting in a coffee
shop right next to my place. (By the way, I also ran into a gorgeous sexology
student who waitresses there, she told me that she just broke up with her boyfriend
and asked me to give her a call. It's been a good night needless to say...;-).
I did her cube and we fluffed about various things.
After that she starts with the questions. This is really unusual. I've never
met a woman SO direct. She asked me if I was bi sexual or homosexual (many classical
pianists are) and seemed very relieved when I said no. Of course, this was a
perfect time for me to ask her if SHE was bi. I was stunned to find out that
this very pious chick had had flings with women when she was younger (she's
35) though she doesn't consider herself bi.
Then, get this! SHE tells me that she finds the music too loud in the place
and wants to go someplace more quiet. So I take her to my place.
We're sitting on the couch in my living room. She had told me that she couldn't
stay too long. So at one point I say, "Well I should call you a cab now."
She takes my hand and says "No, not yet, I want to stay a while longer!"
During the course of the conversation she made it clear that she was not interested
in any short term flings. She said that the next guy would have to be the right
one. I took the opportunity to tell her that I was NOT the marrying type, that
I was not interested in anything exclusive and long term with only one woman
at this point in my life. Of course she said that that would probably change
if I met the right one. (And she pointed to herself as she said this, I have
to add!) I'm thinking " will I kiss her or not?" She also keeps telling
me that she is very happy to have met me. That she always hoped to meet a pianist
some day with whom she could give concerts. (At which point I made sure to tell
her that I was mostly doing solo and had no plans to change that. Never mix
business with pleasure.) So I'm thinking that even though she likes me alot,
because I'm intentionally telling her the things I know she won't be crazy about,
she'll figure out for herself that I might not be the one she's looking for.
She asks me what I look for in a woman. I tell her about wanting a passionate,
highly sexual woman who knows what she wants and isn't afraid to go for it.
bla bla...
I figure that this is the best moment to be REALLY honest with her. So I tell
her that I want a woman who is bisexual and will not hesitate to share our bed
with another woman. She doesn't even flinch!
She then asks me if I mind a woman who is very religious. I tell her the truth:
that I don't so long as she respects my religious and spiritual beliefs and
doesn't try to convert me.
Then she tells me that all the qualities I have enumerated describe her perfectly.
At that point I realized that she had come to the conclusion that I was Prince
Charming and so I decided I had to make things REALLY clear before making any
move to close.
I then make my last conditions clear to her. I do something similar to Riker's
brilliant 3 rules but I emphasize something a little different. I tell her (as
I look into her eyes) that though I might be in a situation where I want to
passionately kiss a woman, I will only do so if I know she is aware of who I
am, and where I am at this point in my life, and that because I respect her
I would never lie and say that she is the only one I care about only to have
sex with her and never call her back. She is cool with all of this and seems
to get it.
So I kiss her. I had never really been with a deeply religious babe and had
wrongly assumed that she would be shy and reluctant. I am dead wrong. She is
WILD with passion.
Anyways, she stopped at the bra, but it was no big deal. She told me that she
wants to wait until the next time. My calibration tells me she's sincere. In
fact, she just called me from the subway to thank me for the evening. She said
that she didn't go all the way because she's always believed that it's best
not to skip the main course to get to the dessert.
When I told her she was a hell of a kisser she said "you ain't seen nothing
yet!"
So the lessons I want to point out in this sarge is that when woman tells you
she is deeply religious it doesn't necessarily mean that she won't have sex
before marriage and won't understand your desire to keep it casual.
Another point I want to make is that it is REALLY important to make it absolutely
clear BEFORE you make the closing move what she should expect.
Or else you are setting yourself up for a heart ache.
To tell you the truth, guys, I am getting some neediness vibes from her. I have
a feeling she thinks that she will be the one to "tame" me so to speak.
But because I was honest from the very start, I should be able to keep things
from getting out of hand. Nevertheless, I'm ready to bet she'll be calling me
probably more than I would want and possibly expecting more than I want to give
right now. So I'm going to have to tread carefully with this one.
It's nice to have three babes in my special circle (another one of my regulars
is coming on Tuesday). Sure beats spending Saturday nights wanking off to the
Playboy channel...
Last funny thing about tonight...it's sort of weird to have a babe telling me
that Jesus loves me right at the same time she's sticking her tongue in my mouth...
maybe I SHOULD go to church more often...
Cliff's Comment: When "she stopped at the bra" she took back control and this is not where you want to be. You'll be reading a lot more about this shortly - keep your eyes on this list.
IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII
GameMaster: Since 9/11...did you hear that the frequency of sex is up like 3X since then? We have psychology on OUR side for a change!
IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII
PRODUCTS AND LINKS (There's some NEW STUFF in here, and I will try and put something new in here as often as possible):
For those of you who are just reading about this for the first time, I decided a couple of emails ago to add links to these emails. The idea would be to get enough money in to hire someone to take over the administrative work (and also to buy things which would improve this list, such as proper mailing list software) for this list. If you were going to buy the product anyway, just use the link that appears below and you are helping to keep this list going at no extra cost to anyone.
NON SEDUCTION-RELATED SITES
One of the more useful links I have set up is to amazon.com -- I know I buy
a lot from them and I am sure that many of you also do. So I arranged a link
with them and you can now buy from them and help out this email newsletter at
the same time. If anyone has any other suggestions of sites that would be a
good one for me to set up a link to, please let me know.
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/redirect-home/nositeihaveap-20 For those in
the U.K., this should work: http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/redirect-home?tag=cliffslist-21&site=amazon
Here's a way for you to accept credit cards on your site today: http://zzz.clickbank.net/r/?cliffslist
RECOMMENDED LIST
DOUBLE YOUR DATING One of the best places for you to start your journey on becoming
more successful with women would be to get David DeAngelo's Double Your Dating
e-book. David (who posts here under the name "Sisonpyh" -- which is
"hypnosis" spelled backwards) is a good friend that I have known for
several years now that I originally met through one of Ross's Speed Seduction
seminars. His posts here have been among the most outstanding contributions
I have had over the years and his book (and the free bonuses) is highly recommended.
http://www.doubleyourdating.com/cl/ HOW TO SUCCEED WITH WOMEN Ron Louis and
David Copeland have been reading these emails for awhile and recently sent me
their Mastery Program Tape series which I have finished listening to. It has
some very good stuff on it and that, in combination with other pieces that you
can pick up here and from the other products mentioned can be a help. For those
who are just starting out learning how to deal with women, this is an excellent
basic daily course to take you through the process of dealing with women. For
those who are more advanced, you should pick up a few good ideas from this set
of tapes.
http://www.howtosucceedwithwomen.com/cgi-bin/at.cgi?a=169700 SEVEN MAGIC WORDS
Comments on this product from Tony B.:
I thought I might drop you a quick line regarding some of the more popular sites
that have been seen within this "seduction community." After seeing
several terrible reviews and "flames" from alt.seduction.fast, I decided
to make a decision for myself based upon my own ideas of what could be offered
on the Seven Magic Words product and after several months of reading great novels
about how to attract women and multiple posts about how women are most attracted
to men, I STILL found the site to be beneficial. After joining the site, I was
happy to learn all the new techniques that I have never seen on any list and
that alone made it worth the money. I am not typically the type of person that
spends money on a site especially a seduction site, I would rather pay for some
audio or video, but the information that was offered was different and unequal
to anything I have seen in the past. At any rate, I know you wanted a review..
and I have actually come to know the owner, and he puts more attention in his
members area than I would expect to see from any other site.
http://hop.clickbank.net/?cliffslist/smackudown DATING INSIDER Not only does
this next site give you an unconditional 1 year no risk money back guarantee,
but it stands alone and it's program is unmatched. Right now they're doing a
Free Trial period, and I'd take advantage of this while you can. The site reads
"Learn the proven secrets for meeting, attracting, and seducing women.
From A - Z, you'll discover the most advanced techniques for picking up women
ever developed." Check out their Free Trial (before it ends) and you'll
see why their members like this program so much. Click on
http://www.dating-insider.com/international/welcome.html.
How to Lay Girls Guide The ultimate SEDUCTION SECRETS database: http://www.layguide.com/cgi-bin/affiliates/clickthru.cgi?id=Cliffslist
NEW RECOMMENDATIONS:
I have finished reading The Sexual Key and it is one of the best works I have
read about understanding the language that women respond to. I give this a strong
recommendation and the price is right, too. The book, and/or its companion book,
Gut Instinct (which I will be reviewing) can be downloaded off the net for $39.97
each or $49.97 for both.
http://hop.clickbank.net/?cliffslist.sexualkey
THE UNKNOWN! (Not reviewed)
HYPNO-TECH Here's another one which I think has been reviewed here in the past
but I haven't gone through the old emails to check. "Do You Want To Know
A Simple, Two Minute Hypnotic Technique That Lets YOU Secretly Put Any Woman
Into An Instant Trance And Persuades Her To Ask YOU Out?
http://hop.clickbank.net/?cliffslist/hypnotech ADVANCED MACKING Advanced Macking
has one of the most enticing websites. An updated review would also be welcome.
http://links.verotel.com/cgi-bin/showsite.verotel?vercode=66629804000000274976
This one also looked pretty interesting. The link for more information on breakups
and loving-styles is http://hop.clickbank.net/?cliffslist/Tigress Success Secrets
Our free newsletter reveals it all Money and Personal Finance secrets; Business
& Marketing secrets; Health, Fitness, and Weight-Loss advice; Self Defense
secrets; Memory Improvement tips; Smart Advice on Flirting, Dating, Sex, and
Relationships; Personal Development tips; Communication and Negotiation tips;
Tax Secrets & Loopholes!
Investment and Stock Market tips; and Much More http://hop.clickbank.net/?cliffslist/prodeskcom
The Ultimate Guide to Powerful Relationships is only $8.95 and looks very interesting.
Comments, please. http://hop.clickbank.net/?cliffslist/unicades Here's a new
one I found which needs to be reviewed: "Guys! Get More Pussy with our
Adult Personals Inside Secrets Guide! Plus! Free Survey Results of Women Using
Personals for Sex The Guide contains the following Inside Secrets Replying to
ads - how to get noticed and get a date for hot sex.
Placing ads - how to beat the competition and get lots of replies How to handle
follow up communication to keep her interested. Examples of replies that worked
on us. You can just copy and paste these into your ads or replies. Saves you
time and increases your chances! A directory of the best websites for meeting
hot women! Sick of chicks who are only into cybersex and nothing else! The Guide
contains a list of the best adult personals sites."
http://secure.ibill.com/cgi-win/ccard/rscookie.exe?RevShareID=9804000000274976&
returnto=http://www.mysexinfo.com
Secrets of Power Persuasion! A course by Jian Wang to teach you how to write
hypnotic language to make others obey your command.
http://hop.clickbank.net/?cliffslist/mrchange (if this doesn't work, try this:
http://www.mrchange.com/?hop=cliffslist.mrchange, but both worked for me) Arte's
New Sex Video is kind of interesting. He shows a lot about playing with a woman's
g spot (which he demonstrates on his comely girlfriend - but I could have done
without seeing your dick, Arte). I will do a more extensive review after I have
watched it again more carefully: http://amos.simonweb.com/loveebook/affiliates/clickthru.cgi?id=lrec
HERE'S A NEW ONE
Suspect your spouse of cheating on you? Check this out http://hop.clickbank.net/?cliffslist/spouse1
FREE PLUGS
The following are all recommended but clicking on the links and buying from
them doesn't send any money back here (it is also recommended that the sponsors
of these sites consider setting this up -- from the little experience I have
had since I started the commercial section a couple of weeks ago, I think you
are missing a lot of business by not doing this) http://www.speed-seduction.com/
- The # 1 source; read the free newsletters & get the basic course.
http://www.trucor.com/ - Major Mark's site, the place to learn hypnosis and
about married women
http://www.essential-skills.com/ - learn anchoring, tonality, rapport, goal
getting, etc.
http://www.davidshade.com/ Give women incredible pleasure get David Shade's
Manual
http://www.fastseduction.com/ - great resource, a must visit http://www.sosuave.com/
- lots of free materials, many good ideas and articles http://www.mindcontrolmanual.com/
- seduce men and women through the power of the mind
http://www.oscarbruce.com/ - All his books deal with perusasion, manipulation
and a mild form of seduction. Books like School for Scoundrels focus on getting
your way with people and getting them to see things your way.
http://www.pickupguide.com - Maniac High's PUA Archive
Get on Mystery's Lounge - send him an email at [email protected] (note
this new email address) with REQUEST MEMBERSHIP in the subject line.
Include your REAL name, your experience, background in the PUA, some online
PUA's who can vouch for you (references), and a real pic of yourself. If you
do not wish to give this REAL information, don't join. Only the PRO's are in
there anyways - we discuss lots of stuff but it's the REAL pix of our conquests
and the fact that we don't HIDE who we are to each other that makes it appealing.
MANY of the members Mystery has personally sarged with.
The rule is simple don't fuck up anyone's game. If you can abide by that and
have a track record for contributing, then that's basically good as gold. Pix
are a requirement, however. The Lounge is in many ways an EXTENSION of Cliff's
List and is not an alternative. You don't have to be a PRO, but you MUST play
the game. If you are only WANTING to ONE DAY chase skirts, please don't bother
joining.
Mystery is now offering his in-field Mystery Method (MM) BASIC TRAINING workshop
in several cities. Click www.mysterymethod.com for more information, workshop
locations, dates & to sign up.
Playerware which is designed specifically for men who like to date and interact
with a large number of women. The program is essentially an electronic chick
organizer. It contains features such as contact management, photo storage, an
electronic journal, a sophisticated rating and comparison system, date/interaction
tracking, as well as other unique features. Visit the site and you can get a
40 day free trial. Full registration is currently only
$15. http://www.playerware.com/default.asp?refid=10
IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII
New Links to be explored (WE NEED THESE REVIEWED!): 1) The website reads as
follows and we need someone's review of this: "Impress everybody! Make
your life happen on purpose! Matthew Whiting an English and Psychology graduate
from Canterbury University and later a graduate of The National Academy of Performing
Arts, has created this revolutionary step-by-step training system which will
give you the means to becoming irresistibly attractive. Hence enabling you to
gain the relationship and life that you want. Whether it is on stage or in real
life we all know the "x" factor when we see it! But can we produce
our own individual "x factor"? In this book Matthew Whiting's radical
new approach to "being irresistibly attractive" will show you how
to: Master these personal strategies to become more Charismatic: · Learn
how to be master of your own intention · Taking action
· Being a successful leader
· Learning confidence
· ...and a lot more...
Master these personal strategies for more Passion: · How to be funny
· Leaving a lasting impression
· How to utilize the power of speech
· Extraordinary kissing
· Flirting - a delightful, innocent, and respectful way to play with
each other!
· ...and a lot more...(18 Chapters in total!) This book is jam-packed
with tonnes of information, (185 A4-size pages). It is written in a tongue-in-cheek
manner which is easy to follow, and you are sure to enjoy. Once you experience
the marvelous changes that Matthew Whiting enables you to make, you can shape
your relationships and other life circumstances exactly as you'd like them to
be." http://hop.clickbank.net/?cliffslist/unicades 2) How to create sexual
chemistry! This one looks interesting -- we need a review!
http://www.attractwomennow.com/cgi-bin/affiliates/clickthru.cgi/Cliffslist 3)
Welcome to CheekyCherry.co.uk, home of what has been called the bible of 'attracting
women, keeping them and sleeping with them'.
http://www.cheekycherry.co.uk/Main_categories/seduction_and_dating/dating_guide.html
4) Courses for women to seduce men!
http://www.ihrt.co.uk/seductionsystems/text%20gals.htm 5) Guys Guide to Girls
- A guide to relationships. How to overcome shyness and understand your partner...
http://www.philipov.com/guys1.htm 6) Wally's Seduction Tips for Desperate Bachelors
http://www.wallyandmurk.com/wally/sedution/Wallymag.html 7) Help with seduction
- for women who want to seduce men.
http://www.seducehim.com/
8) The website reads as follows and we need someone's review of this: "Ladies!
Never date a stranger unless you've checked him out first!
Fortunately, a basic background check is an easy thing to do, via the telephone
and the Internet. In just a matter of minutes, you can find out a great deal
on your own about any potential date (or even your fiance' or husband) using
the simple, free background check techniques described in our new "how-to"
manual.
CHECK HIM OUT FIRST! "Check Him Out! - The American Woman's Guide to Background
Investigations" guides you through the entire background check process
using clear, nontechnical language. You'll be amazed to learn that there's a
lot that can be done just by using the telephone intelligently!
Without even touching a computer, you can usually verify someone's name, address,
age, occupation, and even marital status over the telephone if you know which
government public records office to call and what information to ask for. "Check
Him Out!" is written for you -- the American woman with no knowledge of
public records and background checks, but with a need to do some quick basic
checking. It's easy to follow, and while it won't make you a seasoned "gumshoe,"
it will make you quite knowledgeable about the subject and will teach you all
you need to know to conduct a thorough basic background check on your own --
plus, it will show you where and how to get competent, reasonably priced help
if you later decide you want a more complex, in-depth background check done.
All this for $11.95 is hard to beat!" http://hop.clickbank.net/?cliffslist/washres
9) For those of you interested in being a bigger man, check out: http://www.angelfire.com/amiga/yourown/bigdickie.htm
10)What Every Man Should Know About Women! Learn the secrets to getting more
dates
than you thought were possible in the year 2001. What works, and what doesn't
work. How to spend less money and less time, to meet more women, and get more
dates. Self-Improvement skills for single men is what this material is all about!
Don't waste your time and money, get the facts on how to find Love efficiently
and effectively! Tired of not getting Lucky? Luck is when preparation meets
opportunity.
These Articles are guaranteed to teach you how to get and stay prepared, and
how to use the Internet to find more dates than you thought possible.
The information in these Articles will produce Ten Times the results of any
professional dating service. This material includes everything you need to get
own track. You need not purchase any other books. Our Total price for everything
is only $19.95 with a full
refund guarantee, if not 200% satisfied that this material will pay for itself
many
times over. http://www.howmengetdates.com/ 11) A long time subscriber to these
emails, Kenrick Cleveland was one of Ross Jeffries first teachers. These days
he is well known as the author of Max Persuasion, a course designed to help
people in all their pursuits in life that require the ability to persuade. I
have seen many reviews highly recommending his products but we could use one
for this list in relation to seduction. You can check it out
at:
<http://www.maxpersuasion.com/cgi-bin/content/clickthru.cgi?content=Cliff604>
IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII
</x-flowed>
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.307 / Virus Database: 168 - Release Date: 11/12/01