The Christian Conscience - Apologetics Pages

The following was an exchange between myself (NYJ) and a Protestant who went by the name of Colonel Hapablap (I don't know where he derived the name from =). His comments will be in black, while mine shall be in dark red. The topic was on forgiveness and the ability of the Catholic Church to do so. The original debate was held at the CARM Catholic-centered debate forum.

Author: Col. Hapablap (--.--.--.---)
Date: 11-02-00 15:30

From the Catechism:
"There is no offense, however serious, that the Church cannot forgive." Pg. 256, #982

What about blaspheming the Holy Spirit? Can the RCC forgive that too? Not even God will forgive that, lest He be a liar (because He said He wouldn't forgive it), which means God can't forgive that sin, because God can't lie.

Col. Hapablap

Author: NYJ (--.--.--.---)
Date: 11-02-00 15:59

Chapter and Verse please.

Author: Col. Hapablap (--.--.--.---)
Date: 11-02-00 16:04

Mark 3:28-29

Col. Hapablap

Author: NYJ (--.--.--.---)
Date: 11-02-00 16:14

28 "Amen, I say to you, all sins and all blasphemies that people utter will be forgiven them.

29 But whoever blasphemes against the holy Spirit will never have forgiveness, but is guilty of an everlasting sin."

NAB Commentary:
Whoever blasphemes against the holy Spirit: this sin is called an everlasting sin because it attributes to Satan, who is the power of evil, what is actually the work of the holy Spirit, namely, victory over the demons.

What is obvious here is that Jesus is comparing those who have faith in the Son of Man and those who do not. Faith saves and results in forgiveness. Lack of faith (ie: attributing the works of the Holy Spirit to satan) results in condemnation, for to obtain the forgiveness of God, one must recognize they are a sinner and ask for forgiveness. Hell is the state of the absence of God. Rejection of God (ie: to persist in a sinful nature without remorse) results in His absence.

Author: Col. Hapablap (--.--.--.---)
Date: 11-02-00 16:33

I agree with this:

"Faith saves and results in forgiveness."

Very good response. However, why doesn't the Catechism make it clear when it says:

"There is no offense, however serious, that the Church cannot forgive." Pg. 256, #982 that the sin of blasphemy against the Holy Spirit doesn't apply? It would seem rational to ask such a question. And though this might sound strange, does the Church have the power to forgive satan? After all, blasphemy is an offense against God, and if the RCC can forgive any offense, no matter how serious, does it have the power (not that it would) to forgive satan?

Thanks,

Col. Hapablap

Author: NYJ (--.--.--.---)
Date: 11-02-00 16:40

The only unforgiven sin is one that is taken to the grave. Hence, if forgiveness is asked for, it will be given. Jesus told us to forgive those who seek forgiveness, if forgiveness is not sought, it cannot be granted. If satan were to ask for forgiveness, I suppose he might be forgiven, but we all know that is not going to happen because of what we read in Revelations. Also, satan is not of this earth, and the power to bind is that of binding here on earth:

Matthew 18:18
Truly, I say to you, whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

In addition, I have found that you only touch on a portion of #982... whether you meant to exaggerate the role of the Catholic Church or not, I will not guess upon, but you missed the main point of that paragraph:

#982.
"There is no offense, however serious, that the Church cannot forgive. 'There is no one, however wicked and guilty, who may not confidently hope for forgiveness, provided his repentance is honest.[Roman Catechism I, 11, 5.] Christ who died for all men desires that in his Church the gates of forgiveness should always be open to anyone who turns away from sin.[Cf. Mt 18:21-22 .]"

Notice the interesting section in there that it states "There is no one, however wicked and guilty, who may not confidently hope for forgiveness, provided his repentance is honest". And that, my friend is the whole point of forgiveness. It needs to be a voluntary admission of sin, with a truthful seeking for forgiveness. And the Catechism quite plainly states that the doors of the Church should be open, by the desire of Christ Himself, to any who would seek this forgiveness.

Hosted by www.Geocities.ws