    Mahmoud Musa : One State for Palestine-Israel

    Interview by Silvia Cattori.

    November 2005

    Silvia Cattori : During all these years, when the Palestinian Authority
    took part in the negotiations, the Palestinian accumulated frustrations
    and sufferings. Israel, benefiting from this time to consolidate its
    gains, is now stronger than ever. The last proposal of Ariel Sharon
    leaves to Palestinians 8% of the historic territory. How do you feel
    thinking none of the goals of the Palestinian Liberation Organization
    has been achieved so far?

      Mahmoud Musa : What has been going on for 15 years since the Madrid
      meetings cannot be called negotiations. At that time, Israel’s Prime
      Minister Itzhak Shamir said “I can keep this game going for 10 years”.
      No one expected this game to be going on 15 years later. The aim of
      Israel’s government is to take over the land, destroy the economy,
      massacre and humiliate the Palestinians, in order to continue the
      process of ethnic cleansing that was started in 1947. The Palestinian
      Authority should stop participating in this pretention.

    Silvia Cattori : So far, all accords – from Oslo to Geneva – were based
    on premises morally unacceptable, in particular the separation between
    two peoples on ethnic bases. But this option, which would end up with
    the creation of a pseudo-Palestine, which would concern only one third
    of the Palestinians and less than one fifth of their lands, does not
    seem to be unanimous. About the Road Map, dear to Bush, nobody talks. Do
    you think that a single State could be a possible alternative,
    eventually?

      Mahmoud Musa : There has been an endless number of plans : Madrid, Oslo
      I, Oslo II, Wye River, Camp David, Tenet Plan, Mitchel Paper, Sharm
      El-Sheikh Accords, Geneva Initiative, the Road Map. This is all to try
      to separate the Jews and Palestinians who are already mixed, and their
      natural resources and economies cannot be separated. In order to
      perpetuate this apartheid system, a wall and exclusive highways are
      being constructed. This process should stop and a process of building
      one democratic State be started.

    Silvia Cattori : The Palestinians, who are grouped in religious
    movements, don’t they have nationalist aspirations likable to counter
    this idea of a single State for all?

      Mahmoud Musa : These are political groups. Religion helps people
      tolerate the harsh conditions they have to live under. They are not at
      all against living in the same State if they are not discriminated
      against. Palestinians are struggling against colonialism not Judaism;
      just like Black South Africans struggled against colonialism and
      Apartheid not white people.

    Silvia Cattori : If the claim for a single State is the only viable
    solution, because more equitable and respectful of international law,
    why until now it is the solution based on two States which is put
    forward by the peace camp and the international bodies?

      Mahmoud Musa : This has gone on primarily because the Palestinian
      Authority has been calling for two States. However, this is changing
      quickly because of the realization that a viable Palestinian State is
      not possible, and the two State solution will not bring peace and
      prosperity to the region and the world at large.

    Silvia Cattori : Even if the solution of a single democratic State,
    where Israelis and Palestinians would live inside the same borders, were
    supported by the international community, don’t you think that Israel
    would prevent this idea from being concretized?

      Mahmoud Musa : Yes. Colonial-settler regimes always resist changing
      their supremacist, racist mind-set, and becoming democratic. However,
      the International Community is realizing that there is no room for
      colonialism, apartheid and ethnically pure States in the 21st century.

    Silvia Cattori : If one considers the fact that before 1948 Arabs used
    to live in harmony with the Jews, who progressively came to settle in
    Palestine, it seems possible that they all live together. But after all
    the harm done to them, could the Palestinians share their lands with the
    settlers who shows an excluding behaviour, the rejection of Palestinians
    and of Muslim religion ?

      Mahmoud Musa : Palestinians realize that the one democratic State will
      ameliorate the harsh conditions of being occupied or being refugees, and
      generate peace in the whole region.

    Silvia Cattori : Some Palestinians already live in a same State as the
    Jews, in Israel. Except that today, they are discriminated and do not
    have the same rights as the Israelis of Jewish faith. But in order to
    bring this to an end, Israel should give up its status of Jewish State,
    and become a true democratic State. However, this seems unbelievable!

      Mahmoud Musa : Colonial-settler regimes resist changing their mind-set
      as I said. However, there are many advantages for the Israelis if they
      give up these attitudes. Peace will decrease the need to waste resources
      on armament, and will open the vast market of the Arab and Muslim
      worlds. The International Community has an interest in facilitating this
      solution.

    Silvia Cattori : Hasn’t the Palestinian Authority, which has given up
    the struggle since Oslo, become a burden for the Palestinian people, who
    suffers from the occupation, in addition to Israeli oppression?

      Mahmoud Musa : The presence of the Palestinian Authority is an
      impediment to forming one State because they will lose their privileges.
      It is in the interest of bringing a solution to the conflict to have the
      authority dissolve itself and form a human rights party that will
      struggle for political and social democracy.

    Silvia Cattori : How do you feel towards all those who, in Israel and in
    the world, sustain the political project of a State which exercises
    racist discrimination and denies the Palestinians to return on their
    lands ?

      Mahmoud Musa : This is because the mass media is controlled by the
      powerful classes. However, this is changing, to a large extent due to
      the internet.

    Silvia Cattori : A Palestinian Authority hiring ambassadors and
    ministers, isn’t it foolish? Having compromised itself in negotiations
    with Israel, does the Palestinian Authority have no other choice than
    collaborating with it, and, therefore, capitulate ?

      Mahmoud Musa : The Palestinian Authority is an authority without a State
      trying to perpetuate the fantasy of a State without a homeland. It is
      supported and maintained by the United States and its allies. It is also
      very corrupt. It is an impediment to bringing peace and prosperity.

    Silvia Cattori : What message can you send to solidarity movements which
    have so far supported the policy of the Palestinian Authority ?

      Mahmoud Musa : The international solidarity movements will serve the
      interests of all the peoples of the region and the cause of
      international peace by advocating for one democratic State on all the
      area of historic Palestine.

    Silvia Cattori : In the current context, extremely gloomy, what can
    Palestinians still hope ?

      Mahmoud Musa : Palestinians have struggled for about one-hundred years.
      They see many examples of peoples who struggled longer than this and
      achieved their goals.

    Note :

      Professor Mahmoud N. Musa is a Palestinian whose family lived and worked
      with Jews in Haifa until 1948 when he became a refugee in what is now
      known as the West Bank. He trained as a medical doctor and research
      scientist in the United States and became a professor of psychiatry. He
      is currently the academic director of the Canadian Center for
      Comparative Cultural research www.ccccr.net. He is the president of the
      Association for One Democratic State in Palestine/Israel
      www.one-democratic-state.org.

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