06160012.txt 16-Jun-00


Subject: Re: Goodbye ZAC
From: "Brian Feldman " <brian@grafxsoft.com>

Hi Will,

>
If its not a secret how do the sales of Clipper compare with
  those of VO?
>
No secret, VO outsells Clipper but I'd have to say it's
  close. Clearly Clipper is a "slowly declining market" and
  Visual Objects is a budding market.  From a market
  prospective, it's incredible that Clipper is anywhere
  close to the VO or any other market.  I'm not sure of how
  many people realize the impact that Clipper had on the
  world.
It's of great amusement to me that this thread on"Goodbye
  Zac"  has turned into a "What's the better product?", Why
  did CA abandon me".( I think Len would have like this)
  I'm also glad to see as may faces as I know from the VO NG
  here still checking up on what's happening with Clipper.
Delphi, VB, VO, VDB are all good products  Statements like
  "This products sucks", with no explanation, do no one on
  this news group any good what so ever. Gordon, says "Look
  at the jobs on Monster.com" and you'll know why he is
  using Delphi....  Well, that works for Gordon... cause
  Gordon must be a "head" for hire. If your a programmer for
  hire, than man, you best learn VB too, no matter what you
  think of it.  If your working on your own product,(Or you
  call the shots) than you may see things differently...or
  not... depending on the PROJECT, not the language !  After
  all, its the project that dictates the  tools not the
  other way around.  Point is, a product is only GOOD if you
  can MAKE MONEY with it. It doesn't matter if its VB, VO,
  VDB, Delphi or anything else.
CA has not abandon anyone.
1. If Clipper was not sold to CA...do you think Clipper
  would still be around... being sold and supported.....?.
2. CA, like other large corporations, does not know how to
  communicate with its customers.(OK this is not good, but
  does it mean they do not continue to develop and support
  the products that they buy).. Clearly they do develop and
  support the products they buy... You can still get support
  for DB Fast.. CA Cricket Graph for Mac..
3. Visual Object is and was purchased by CA not only to
  market, but to use for internal development. Portions of
  Inaculan (CA Virus software) are developed in CA Visual
  Objects.
4. CA's ad budget works something like this... Spend all
  the CA budget on product" X" for 3 years. In 95, 96, 97
  that products was CA-VO... 98, 99, 2000 was Jasmine...2001
  it will be "Ted Nugent(s)" <g>
5. As Gary Stark points out...if CA performance is a
  failure....than bring it on for me !
I personally use VO, why ?   I'm a Clipper guy from way
  back. I'm getting to old and crusty to throw out
  everything that I knew about clipper and learn a new
  language.  I don't have to learn C++ to get 99% of what I
  need to get accomplished. Since I only write software for

  my own business, and since we have tons of Clipper legacy
  stuff around here, VO seemed a natural choice.
I disagree with those that say 1.0 was a disaster. (Because
  its like saying VO sucks with out a reason why)... I will
  grant anyone that it was certain features  unstable till
  1.0c, yet I was able to write an application in VO 1.0
  that was put on the CA-VO 2.0 distribution disk /Grafx ,
  not as an example application, but as a sales tool for my
  company.
Because I personally use VO, does NOT mean that other tools,
  in my opinion are as good or bad. My son uses both VB and
  Delphi.... I show him why VO can do something better, and
  he shows me how with a click of a property he can do the
  same thing without writing any code...who's right?
  Neither one of us.
For me, Goodbye Zac is BIG news.   Zac had a lot of loyal
  followers that are now out in the cold. I'd like to invite
  them to our campfire.
http://www.grafxsoft.com
(Wow, that's what happens when you have too much coffee
  early in the AM..<G> Sorry for the length of this)

Brian


Subject: Re: Goodbye ZAC
From: "Will Chapman" <willchapman@dial.pipex.com>

>
Hi Will,
3. Visual Object is and was purchased by CA not only to
  market, but to use for internal development. Portions of
  Inaculan (CA Virus software) are developed in CA Visual
  Objects.
>
Which is probably a very strong reason why CA will continue
  to support it and have even less reason to kill it.
THe question that usually sparks this debate (on this ng) is
  when a Clipper user comes in with the question 'what is
  the best way to go from Clipper to Windows'. I agree with
  you Brian that it does no-body any favours when some of us
  rubbish the other's favourite product; they all have their
  strengths (and weaknesses) and if we are to do a service
  to our fellow Clipperheads we would be giving them a non-
  emotive, accurate assessment of the products that we
  favour and leave it up to the reader to decide which is
  the best choice for them.

Cheers..
Will