Posted by spirit v. flesh [Joshua1992] on November 14, 1999 at 23:12:16 {fiuUEQ5dxUMRXA6xmpscgm0mCI9FhA}:
Is Gog's attack upon spiritual Israel, Jehovah's Witnesses org., or fleshly Israel?
That's a good question. The Bible indicates that it must be FLESHLY ISRAEL!
Notice Ezekiel 39:21:
"And I shall set my glory among the nations; and all the nations will have to see my judgment and that I have executed and my hand that I have placed among them. 22 And those of the house of Israel will have to know that I am Jehovah their God from that day and forward. 23 And the nations will have to know that it was because of their error that they, the house of Israel, went into exile, on account of the fact that they behaved unfaithfully toward me, so that I concealed my face from them and gave them into the hand of their adversaries, and they kept falling, all of them, by the sword. 24 According to their uncleaness and according to their transgressions I did with them, and I kept concealing my face from them."25 "Therefore this is what the Sovereign Lord Jehovah has said, 'Now is when I shall bring back the captive ones of Jacob and actually have mercy upon all the house of Israel; and I will show exclusive devotion for my holy name. 26 And they will have borne thier humiliation and all their unfaithfulness with which they have acted toward me, when they dwell on their soil in security, with no one to make them tremble. 27 When I bring them back from the peoples and I actually collect them together out of the lands of their enemies, I will also scantify myself among them before the eyes of many nations."
This is clearly about fleshly Israel. Other indications are that the reason for the attack is to get a "big spoil" and money.
Also note that at this time Israel has been collected together out of the nations where they were formerly scattered. So this implies that the Jews would have returned to Israel and would be dwelling in peace and security in their own land, safe from the nations. And that is the case.
So who is Gog of Magog and when is this to happen?
A clue to this is mentioned which is "in the final part of the years" (Ezk. 38:8). But another big clue is at Ezekiel 39:17 which mentions the birds coming together to feast on the dead bodies. If we relate that to the same event in Revelation, then it comes basically at Armageddon!
So who is Gog of Magog? Gog of Magog must be those nations who are the descendants of Noah's oldest son, Japheth, that is, those primarily of Indo-European descent. This is understandable since it is clear that some "leaders" among the European nations, such as Hitler, has used racial pride and concepts of Aryan supremacy to focus on the Jews as a threat to their world dominance. In addition, it seems that the Christian bloc of nations is also centered in the Europeoan culture. It was the Christian European Germans who exterminated two-thirds of the Jews and many others whom they considered inferior during the HOLOCAUST.
But that HOLOCAUST was permitted, as the above verse shows, because Israel had been disobedient and it was a consequence of them being in exile and upon enemy territory. But now they have been brought back to Israel and have established themselves as a viable and wealthy nation again.
It would appear, for some reason, that Israel would now be under legal and/or military attack in order to confiscate it's wealth for some reason. But the confrontation will end up badly for the leaders of this attack, as Jehovah will fight for Israel and make a name for himself, and Gog and his crowd will fall on the soil of Israel and the birds will eat their flesh.
So this seems to be the very last event before the millennium.
What about "spiritual Israel"? Well, there may be some component of Jehovah's Witnesses being represented as God's spiritual Israel. But it doesn't seem particularly indicated as being substantially apart of the nation of Israel. Of note, Jehovah's witnesses had a symbolic trampling by the "disgusting thing causing desolation" which turned out to be the Nazis, when they were singled out as targets of the Nazis along with the Jews. But still, the natural Jews were the primary target.
So in this last battle, it seems as though it will be through the natural nation of Israel that Jehovah will vindicate his name among the nations.
Another reason why it doesn't seem he will be overly vindicating his name via spiritual Israel, which are Jehovah's Witnesses, is because the leader of that organization, who is called the "false prophet" and represented as the Lamb-Dragon beast in Revelation is thrown into the lake of fire along with the 666-Beast at Armageddon. So it doesn't seem this group, which seemingly would still be under the control of the false prophet right up until Armageddon is very much of a candidate for vindicating Jehovah's name in as much as they have failed in being any kind of a "faithful slave" toward Jehovah's sheep.
Furthermore, the context of what goes on in that organization is that Christ, when he comes, separates out his sheep from the goats within this organization and they join "other sheep" gathered elsewhere, Jesus abandoning the "false prophet" and his doomed and abandoned organization.
So the focus is on fleshly Israel now. And one scripture does say that "ten men will grab hold of the skirt of a Jew" because they will see how God is with those people. And certainly, the nation of Israel is far more known for being the people of Yahweh than are Jehovah's Witnesses.
That is the way it looks right now. Anyone with any other ideas I encourage you to share them. This is just a general observation right now but it looks as though this final confrontation of the nations will culminate on an unjustified attack on the nation of Israel in an effort to steal their money or confiscate their funds and they will lose, being defeated, perhaps even by miraculous means by Isael.
Also of note, "Persia" and othes will be joining in this fight, so it seems Israel's longtime enemies of Iraq and Iran will be part of Gog's coalition against Israel. This may even be a U.N. sponsored maneuver. We'll have to see how things develop.
One other thing that is noteworthy and that is Jehovah puts it into the heart of the scarlet colored wild beast to destroy "Babylon the Great". That beast is the U.N. And it is said that Jehovah likewise manipulates Gog in focusing him on this attack by putting hooks into his jaws to focus on this final attack. This may link the two events in general, if not specifically. That is, the attack on "Babylon the Great" may spill over to the attack on the nation of Israel by the U.N. Especially if there is perceived to be a direct or indirect connection. It is clear that MONEY will be part of that motivation.
But Jehovah will vindicate his name in the end and the all the nations will know that Jehovah has rechosen Israel, after having abandoned them and punished them for having broken his covenant earlier, sending them into exile.
The fundamental traditional pyshological and political polemics of Nazism and white supremacy are in place already as far as the Jews are concerned, thus it can be understood why the attack would come from this Christian-Euro-Aryan segment of those most focussed on world domination by Aryans who for some reason feel threatened by the Jews.
Since most of the other prophecies have already been fulfilled, it is important to focus on what final ones to expect. Defining who Gog of Magog is as well as which "Israel" will be attacked is thus an important issue to consider.
All comments pro and con are welcomed.
Cheers,
Joshua1992