Posted by Bibleman [Bibleman] on November 10, 1999 at 01:08:41 {AAJB0ph6mYMRXA6xmpscslyACFuF8c}:
In Reply to: *To Flee or not to Flee posted by Friend on November 09, 1999 at 20:43:25:
Oh Friend!
How disappointing! I thought you could do much better than this. And not even the Society's version either. That is their latest version.
A few corrections I can't get past:
>>However, in the case of what’s described as ‘great tribulation’, there seems to be a continuity of expression indicating that there will also be a future great tribulation associated with events prior to the sign of the Son of man. In the case of the great tribulation, there is specific and relevant reference to the elect.
You seem to imply that there are two "great tribulations" when the Bible specifically says it will be like no other event that had occurred and never will happen again. How plain can you get? It only happens once. And it only happens during the last days just before the Messiah arrives.
>>In regards to the fleeing or flight of which you question, while great tribulation can be expected in relation to the end of the age, that need not mean that any special literal fleeing from it must be done....
Sorry, but modern-day post WWII "Judea" is a reference to the resettled Jews, specifically in Warsaw, Poland, but generally where they had settled in Europe. And there needed to be some literal fleeing from that city. Now there was some "parallel" with the fall of Jerusalem in 70CE in that the Nazi armies did literally surround Warsaw, Poland in 1939 with huge tanks and bombard that city. That was the sign to flee after this occurred. Because later they walled off the entire Jewish ghetto which eventually was totally liquidated. Thus modern-day Judea, the largest settlement of Jews in the world, Warsaw, Poland, was totally liquidated. There must have been a time to get out just after the Nazis arrived and stopped bombarding the city. Those Jews and/or Jewish Jehovah's Witnesses who understood this would have known it was time to flee. Those who did not were exterminated in the gas chambers and burned up in the ovens of the death camps, Treblinka, Dachau, etc.
What I'm wondering friend, also, is how you get past Matthew 24:29 which clearly states that the great tribulation is totally OVER even before the Messiah arrives in kingdom power? It says, "IMMEDIATELY AFTER the tribulation of those days..." So this can't be Armageddon? It's one of the major signs leading up to when the Messiah would finally arrive. And Daniel 12 inserts at least 45 years from the time the trampling starts at the end of 1290 days until the Messiah arrives to fulfill the 1335 days.
So all that fits the HOLOCAUST perfectly. And all this is supposed to occur, the END is supposed to occur, that is, the "END of the gentile times" before a generation passes from the first sign which was a world war: WWI. The correct date for the Messiah's return was 1992, still 2 years to go before 1994 ends that generation.
But it is IMPOSSIBLE to have these prophecies fulfilled if you don't have the correct dating, for one. And if you don't pay attention specifically to what the scriptures say, including the fact that this was supposed to be a ONE-TIME-ONLY event that never happened before, nor would ever happen again.
Don't those words mean anything to you?
For your notes, please observe that Luke starts off like the other two gospels in describing the last days, but then when it specifically makes reference to the destruction of Jerusalem it states it is "before these things... Luke 21:12. So though Luke and only Luke describes the destruction of Jerusalem in 70CE, and it is similar, it is NOT the "great tribulation" mentioned in Matthew and Mark. Luke places the 70CE event "before these things..." Note Luke also does not mention the term "great tribulation" or "tribulation" nor mentions anything about Daniel's prophecy. That's because this was not the fulfillment of Daniel's prophecy. And finally, Luke is the only one who mentions the "appointed times of the nations" continuing as the Jews are being led out into exile. That means the "END", referring to the "end of the gentile times" did not occur at the 70CE destruction but was yet in the future. That "end" would not take place until the Messiah arrived in 1992.
So the Bible is true and eveerything happened just as it says. The "great tribulation" was a one-time event that occurred before the Messiah arrived. The great tribulation is not Armageddon and it has nothing to do with the 70CE destruction of Jerusalem.
Because the WTS has the wrong date for the fall of Jerusalem and thus the wrong date for the EOGT, they cannot possibly coordinate the Bible's reference to the "great tribulation" as occurring before the Messiah arrives.
But if you read the rest of the Bible, it is more than abundantly clear that the Messiah arrives near very end of that last generation, not at the very beginning.
So as long as you hold onto already proven to be totally wrong dates of 607BCE or 587BCE for the fall of Jerusalem, this important prophecy for the last days will never, ever, ever work. All you can have is a wrong understanding.
It's time to WAKE UP, my Friend....
Thanks for kindly answering the post, though.
Cheers,
Bibleman