# ***For Friend From Fleeing

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Posted by Bibleman [Bibleman] on November 11, 1999 at 07:35:35 {mJnjjpluA6MRXA6xmpscslyACFuF8c}:

In Reply to: **For Friend From Fleeing posted by Shelby on November 11, 1999 at 05:22:29:

Hi Shelby,

I can understand your position. And you have to live with it for a while. But it's not that complicated really.

What you need to address is that this is the fulfillment of DANIEL'S prophecy. And in the context of what Daniel says, this tribulation was to happen to "his people."

Daniel 12:7 is very revealing: "It will be for an appointed times, appointed times and a half. And as soon as there will have been a finishing of the DASHING OF THE POWER OF THE HOLY PEOPLE TO PIECES, all these things will come to their finish."

And of course the 12:1 initial reference: "And there will certainly occur a time of distress such as has not been made to occur since there came to be a NATION until that time."

So based upon this, this dashing of the "holy ones" to pieces makes it clear that this time of distress was to happen to the "holy ones" which means Daniel's people.

So if you can just understand that when this starts out, this is a prophecy of when the Jews would be dashed to pieces during the last days. So Daniel's prophecy clearly starts off with this great tribulation being focussed on the Jews, on the dashing of the "holy ones" to pieces.

SO IT STARTS OFF AS A JEWISH CATASTROPHE at least.

Then when you consider Matthew and Mark which are the only two references to Daniel's prophecy, they again show this tribulation is against JUDEA, which also relates to the natural Jews. Who else can "JUDEA" be?

Then you have the factor of the 1290 days and the 1335 days.

After mentioning the 1290 days Daniel 12:12 says: "Happy is the one who is keeping in expectation and who arrives at the on thousand three hundred and thirty-five days!"

So in the loose interpretation of things, we have a tribulation against the "holy ones" or "Judea" which refers to the Jews which is supposed to occur during the last generation. BUT, if the Messiah is supposed to arrive at 1335 days, then this tribulation must be over 45 years before the end of that generation.

If that generation began in 1914 then it would have to end in 1994. And the "END" would have to occur before then. Not the end of the world, but the "end of the era" of the "appointed times of the nations." In other words, the end of the gentile times which ends, of course, when Christ begins his rule on the earth after kicking Satan out of heaven.

But even with those numbers 45 years from 1994 establishes that this great tribulation would have be over by 1949 at the very latest.

Now look at the specific nature of this "great tribulation."

1) It's something you can run from and escape from if you run to the mountains! That is, if you don't have baby in arms! So this is a PHYSICAL THREAT.

2) When the disgusting thing is seen in the holy place, it is imperative that you leave JUDEA or not return to JUDEA. Whatever we can understand JUDEA to mean.

3) It will be so bad that "if the days were not cut short, then NO FLESH would be saved." What is this talking about. That half the world's population would be destroyed? Or just over half the population of the "holy ones"?

4) But most importantly, it is over and done with by 1949! That's "immediately after the tribulation..." there is a period of darkness after which the Messiah would arrive. This relates to the period of 1290 days which ends the trampling of the holy ones and dashing them to pieces, and the actual arrival of the Messiah. That matches perfectly.

But the tribulation is OVER! at least 45 years before 1994 to fulfill the prophecy. So we know it's not ARMAGEDDON. And we know the "end" is not Armageddon, but just when the Messiah takes up kingdom power; the END of the era of the "appointed times of the nations."

Now...

After getting those BASIC requirements lined up, since this is AFTER-THE-FACT. It's AFTER 1994. We can check and see if these signs actually occurred to fulfill Bible prophecy. So the REALITY will give us the right interpretation.

So to briefly check things off:

1) That generation would begin with "nation against nation and kingdom against kingdom" a world war. Great. 1914 to 1994. Fulfilled by World War I.

2) "...there will be food shortages." Great Depression. Okay.

3) "...and earthquakes in one place after the other." Okay. There were earthquakes. (Check with A.F.)

4)"Then people will deliver you up to tribulation and will kill you, and you will be objects of hatred by all nations on account of my name." Okay, who are these people of God's name? The Jews? Right. Were they popular from 1914 to 1949?
No. Anti-semitism was at an all-time high.

5) "Then many will be stumbled and wil betray one another and will hate one another. And many false prophets will arise and mislead many;" No problem. This is more focussed on Jehovah's Witnesses, also "god's chosen people" in a spiritual sense. The well-known "sifting" of 1917 easily fulfills this, and no problem with false prophecies (1925, 1914 etc).

6) "...and because of the increasing of lawlessness, the love of the GREATER NUMBER will cool off." Spiritual Israel is the lesser number and the Jews who make up fleshly Israel are the greater number. So this is a reference to the violence of that age which would cause an increase in anti-Semitism of the greater number.

7) "And this good news of the kingdom will be preached in all the inhabited eath for a witness to all the nations and then the end [of the appointed times of the nations] will come." VERY IMPORTANT. The "good news" would be preached worldwide FIRST! That means the temple-class would have to become a world-wide organization and preach their message world wide before the end of the gentile times! That was the last thing to be fulfilled. And that happened. JWs were "worldwide" by 1947 and doubled their numbers by 1954, and certainly were worldwide by 1994. So that was technically fulfilled immediately after the war in 1947 when N.H. Knorr sponsored an around-the-world lecture speech. So that was fulfilled critically by 1947, certainly by 1994.

So all these things occurred. And that just leaves the details of the "great tribulation."
So the question is, were more than half the number of the "holy ones" destroyed in a "great tribulation" against them between 1914 to 1949? Was there any event that would threaten to totally wipe out the Jews unless the days of WWII were cut short? YES! If Hitler won the war, then "No flesh would have been saved" because he was determined to kill all the Jews on the planet, even half-Jews. Even so, did more than half the Jews perish between 1914 and 1949 in any unique event?

Well...yes, actually. 2/3rds of the Jews died during the HOLOCAUST.

So did the "great tribulation" get fulfilled? YES.

Now if we apply the numbers, if the HOLOCAUST was the "great tribulation" and it ended in Germany in 1945, then it fits the requirement of having from 1914 to 1949. So just based upon that, they could expect the Messiah to appear anytime 45 years later, which would be sometime between 1990 to 1994.

But the technical end of the HOLOCAUST or the trampling might not have ended until 1947. That's because as long as the Jews didn't have a place of their own, they would always be subject to trampling. But if they had a place of their own, their own land, there would be at least one place where this trampling of the nations would not be possible. So that is a significant event for the symbolic end of the trampling. That would be 1947-48 when the U.N. approved the partitioning of Palestine. But that is a specific 6-month period!
If that is the technical end of the 1290 days, however, then we have a very specific date for the return of the Messiah after 45 years which would be from the fall of 1992 to the spring of 1993.

Now does this make sense?

YES!

Why?

Two reasons:

1) Because the Messiah was supposed to appear near the end, but not later than a generation from 1914. 1992 is two years short of 1994. So that means the END did come before that generation ended if the Messiah arrived in 1992.

2) Because the Messiah's return is SPECIFICALLY DATED 2520 years after the fall of Jerusalem! It must also fulfill the "7 times" prophecy. If this occurred in 1992, therefore, it is suggested that Jerusalem must have fallen in 529BCE. We know know based upon astronomical text double-dating that that is precisely what the original dating for the fall of Jerusalem was.

That is, for your reference, there are two critical texts dating the Neo-Babylonian Period and they are the VAT4956 and the SK400. The VAT4956 has been used to specifically absolute-date the 37th year of Nebuchadnezzar II in 568BCE! But because of modern inventions of astronomical programs and a closer look at the text, it has been discovered that some of the dates belong to 511BCE, meaning the text dates the 37th year of Nebuchadnezzar II in either 568BCE or 511BCE. Does that make sense?

Yes, if there was a conspiracy to manipulate the dating for this period, which had already been suspected. But this also simply means that the 511BCE date for Year 37 must have been the original dating and 568BCE is the revised dating.

Does that make sense?

Yes.

Why?

Because, if 511BCE was really the original Year 37 of Neb-2, then his first year occurred in 547BCE and his 19th year in 529BCE, the year Jeusalem fell. So we know from this text that in order for the Bible to be true, with the 19th year falling in 529BCE that the Messiah was supposed to arrive in 1992.

But that's not enough. You also have the SK400, another double-dated text. In this text, there are two lunar eclipses dated to "Year 7". The eclipses are six months apart, the first a partial exlipse of 50% magnitude dated Tammuz 14 followed by a total eclipse dated Tebet 14. But the EXACT TIMES OF THE NIGHT are given for the eclipses. Thus you can determine the exact interval between the eclipses. To make a long story short, the interval based upon the text was supposed to be 2:46 (2 hours 46 minutes), dated to 523BCE, the "7th of Kambyses." But it doesn't work in 523BCE because even though the eclipses match the dates and intensities, the INTERVAL is 4:46! 2 hours too much.

But, it so happens that very similar eclipses happen 18 years apart. And in this series, the similar eclipses every 18 years, had an increase in the interval time by 2 hours. That is, the first interval might be 46 minutes, then the second 2:46, then the third 4:46, etc.

So it works out that 18 years earlier in 541BCE, the interval between two similar eclipses was exactly 2:45! So there is an exact MATCH of the text eclipses to 541BCE. Is this a mistake? What can we presume?

Well, was Year 7 of Kambyses in 541BCE? No. That doesn't work.

Well, since the actual name of Kambyses was not on the text, does this fit any other "Year 7" of any other king? Well, let's see... Let's try Nebuchadnezzar II. He's pretty connected!

Well if we date "Year 7" to Nebuchadnezzar II in 541BCE, then his first year would be in 547BCE and his 19th year would fall in...(oh no...no....you're kidding! I don't believe it. I need to sit down....I need a drink!)...You got it!
I-NEED-A-DRINK 529 BCE!

Sooooo. at this point it's over. We know the Seleucids not just changed their chronology and astronomical texts, but also tried to hide references to the original chronology in some of their texts, and so by that means we know FOR SURE what the original chronology was confirmed by two texts. No other "evidence" provides "absolute dating" except astronomical texts, and these are the prime two. Who would have ever dreamed they were really designed to double-date the original chronology?

So it's OVER!

The final question is, therefore, Did the Messiah really appear in 1992? Did the "sign of the Son of Man" occur in 1992 which is the forced date from modern and ancient history for the APPOINTED TIME of the gentiles to end?

Some claim they saw the "sign of the Son of Man appear in the clouds" on December 26, 1992.

But since per the Bible the Messiah comes as a theif at first, and thus in total secrecy from the world, there is no way we can confirm that alleged unsubstantiated report of an eyewitness, who just might be crazy or a Bible nut trying to make this last bit of the prophecy come true since everything else came true.

But, if the Messiah did actually appear in the flesh in 1992, then that would mean the Bible has a 100% TOTAL PERFECT RECORD FOR FULFILLMENT OF ALL IT'S PROPHECIES!

Only problem is, that it cannot be totally fulfilled unless you make the "great tribulation" the HOLOCAUST....

So I'm afraid there is not much choice here.

I hope that's a help.

Cheers,
Bibleman

Follow Ups:

- ****For Friend From Fleeing Shelby 11:40:11 11/11/99 (1)
  - *****For Friend From Fleeing Bibleman 15:27:56 11/11/99 (0)

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