# *AF-GREG DEBATE BACK ON!!!

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Posted by Gedanken [Gedanken] on November 05, 1999 at 12:06:54 {6xiCHW3gJ2HdgEG/iekYGxDfYXLgH2}:

In Reply to: AF-GREG DEBATE BACK ON!!! posted by barJonah on November 05, 1999 at 02:20:20:

bJ

:If nothing else, I hope this message from Greg will give pause to some of those who were so quick to jump all over him in the last few days.

I don't see why it would. He deserves all he has received and more. The man has shown himself to be (a) deceitful, (b) an arrogant and boastful liar and (c) an idiot by doing what he did. He could make some amends by apologizing but he is, evidently, too arrogant even to do that. Let's put things in perspective; an author of a book tries to pose as an independent and unbiased onlooker on a noticeboard and then proceeds to label his critics liars while declaring himself the "winner." At the same time he indulges in a level of self-praise that can only be described as nauseating. Can you imagine what would happen to say, Martin Amis if he did that? The Times would crucify him, and rightly so. Perhaps this little episode should be included in the book reviews at Amazon.com as a public service to warn those who might be tempted to fall for his lies. Remember that there is more at stake than poor little Greg Stafford.

The only thing that saves Stafford's reputation is that his book was already viewed as being a waste of money by most experts in the field. In other words he had no reputation to destroy except among JWs. It is clear, however, that his recent actions are more a reflection of his self-proclaimed "scholarly" standards than they are an aberration. His book is dishonest and now we know that so is he. I would emphasize that no legitimate scholar would even think of doing what he did, let alone try it (and then blow it!) As harsh as this may seem, there is nothing more dangerous than someone who callously passes himself off as an expert in print but who, in reality, will lie to advance his agenda. His book hurts people. Stafford has lost all credibility and, in my opinion, there is no further reason to continue to take him seriously. If anyone wants to advance the arguments that Stafford makes in his book then I am sure that there will be many here, including me, willing to debate those issues. However, I have no interest whatsoever in debating someone as intellectually dishonest as is Stafford. In any case, only a half-wit could conclude that AF did not only win the debate but did so by several miles. As an academic myself I cannot begin to describe how appalled I am by the way that Stafford has misused and sullied the mantle of scholarship. He is a disgrace and a charlatan.

Does Stafford deserve to be forgiven for his act? Of course, provided he apologizes and publicly eats humble pie. But whether he does or he doesn't he has forfeited his right to be taken seriously for a long time, probably permanently. Scholars simply do not act the way he did. Like Esau he sold whatever claim he may have had to being considered a "scholar" for a mess of potage. He asked people to take him seriously and then he lied to them. What else is there to say?

Gedanken

Follow Ups:

- **AF-GREG DEBATE BACK ON!!! Observer 20:17:26 11/05/99 (2)
  - ***AF-GREG DEBATE BACK ON!!! Gedanken 09:04:57 11/06/99 (1)
    - ****AF-GREG DEBATE BACK ON!!! Observer 14:15:23 11/06/99 (0)
- **AF-GREG DEBATE BACK ON!!! Observer 20:16:02 11/05/99 (0)
- **AF-GREG DEBATE BACK ON!!! Adam Covington 19:57:16 11/05/99 (3)
  - ***AF-GREG DEBATE BACK ON!!! AF 21:38:06 11/05/99 (2)
    - ****AF-GREG DEBATE BACK ON!!! Adam Covington 23:54:30 11/05/99 (1)
      - *****AF-GREG DEBATE BACK ON!!! AF 02:09:27 11/06/99 (0)
- **AF-GREG DEBATE BACK ON!!! barJonah 15:30:32 11/05/99 (8)
  - ***AF-GREG DEBATE BACK ON!!! Gedanken 16:02:46 11/05/99 (7)
    - ****AF-GREG DEBATE BACK ON!!! Adam Covington 20:01:38 11/05/99 (5)
      - *****AF-GREG DEBATE BACK ON!!! AF 21:34:58 11/05/99 (4)
        - ******AF-GREG DEBATE BACK ON!!! Randall Watters 09:16:56 11/06/99 (0)
        - ******AF-GREG DEBATE BACK ON!!! AdamCovington 00:09:17 11/06/99 (2)
          - *******AF-GREG DEBATE BACK ON!!! AF 01:58:46 11/06/99 (1)
            - ********AF-GREG DEBATE BACK ON!!! Julie 06:42:14 11/06/99 (0)
    - ****AF-GREG DEBATE BACK ON!!! Tantalus 16:36:22 11/05/99 (0)
- **AF-GREG DEBATE BACK ON!!! Cygnus 15:27:09 11/05/99 (3)
  - ***AF-GREG DEBATE BACK ON!!! Tom 17:02:46 11/05/99 (0)
  - ***AF-GREG DEBATE BACK ON!!! J.H. 16:41:22 11/05/99 (0)
  - ***AF-GREG DEBATE BACK ON!!! Gedanken 15:50:57 11/05/99 (0)
- **AF-GREG DEBATE BACK ON!!! Mod101 13:01:17 11/05/99 (9)
  - ***AF-GREG DEBATE BACK ON!!! Gedanken 13:43:30 11/05/99 (8)
    - ****AF-GREG DEBATE BACK ON!!! Rick 17:55:57 11/05/99 (1)
      - *****AF-GREG DEBATE BACK ON!!! Gedanken 18:15:04 11/05/99 (0)
    - ****AF-GREG DEBATE BACK ON!!! Dean 17:23:16 11/05/99 (4)
      - *****AF-GREG DEBATE BACK ON!!! Gedanken 18:04:39 11/05/99 (3)
        - ******AF-GREG DEBATE BACK ON!!! Dean 22:17:50 11/05/99 (2)
          - *******AF-GREG DEBATE BACK ON!!! AF 01:47:15 11/06/99 (1)
            - ********AF-GREG DEBATE BACK ON!!! Observer 06:01:09 11/06/99 (0)
    - ****AF-GREG DEBATE BACK ON!!! correction 14:32:43 11/05/99 (0)
- **AF-GREG DEBATE BACK ON!!! J 13:00:49 11/05/99 (0)
- **AF-GREG DEBATE BACK ON!!! ps: 12:24:05 11/05/99 (0)

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