# *Response to AF: Part One

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Posted by WorldlyWitness [WW] on November 02, 1999 at 16:12:53 {.c1iAaocfMTmM4Bt2duQm1EPSMpKF.}:

In Reply to: Response to AF: Part One posted by Greg Staffor on November 02, 1999 at 11:47:33:

More to chew on, Greggy seems to be in amood to argue over technical tribvialities and not actual discussion. What a waste of time!

:: AF
:: (1) In what way do you view how Jehovah uses those on the Governing Body?
: GREG
: As a non-inspired group of men

Then they have no claim to being the sole spokesmen of God on earth today. Their advice and research is by it's own definition an opinion, no better, no worse than other commentators.
Cygnus answered the next part of your 'splitting hairs' use of technical and non-technical 'apart from established creeds'.

GREG
: I believe Jehovah will use those things they accurately discern from their study of the Bible to educate mankind, so that they
might know and love Him.

AF_2
:: Now that's an interesting statement with many implications. Rather obviously, it sort of implies that Jehovah will not use those things that they inaccurately claim to discern from their study of the Bible.

GREG_2
Obviously.

So, the GB says, when we're right we are 'God's spokesman' but when we are wrong you can excuse us.
Obviously.
Well, Greggy, how are us 'Jonadabs' supposed to know which 'Biblical counsel' is not poison 'food at the proper time'?
Again, what makes them our 'guiding light' to follow in preference to other commentators?

AF_2
:: It sort of implies that Jehovah - assuming he looks at all sincere Christians impartially - will also use things that other Christians
accurately discern from their study of the Bible. Of course, JWs have traditionally rejected that notion. ::

GREG_2
Where have Jehovah’s Witnesses ever rejected the view that what “sincere Christians” have rightly discerned from the Bible will not be used by Jehovah to help educate mankind? Of course, you yourself have not defined what is a “sincere” Christian.
Please do not fail to do so in your response to my above question. But, again, your inaccurate characterization implies, if not directly states, that Jehovah’s Witnesses have rejected the notion that Jehovah will not use those things accurately discerned from His Word, by “sincere Christians”!

Why do I sense more 'hair splitting' here? I'll bet old Greggy is going to define 'sincere Christians' as 'Jdubs in good standing' and exclude all others!
Jehovah's Witnesses have consistently contended that only in association with their org can true Christianity be practiced. Though the Jonadab class are not technically Christians.

Greg:
Also, are you, Alan, a sincere Christian? Do you pray for guidance from God’s holy spirit.

Stooping low to attack Alan's personal preference of worship is typical of the insincerity you reek of, Greggy.

AF_2
This brings up an important teaching of Jehovah's Witnesses, one which JWs usually don't like to answer straightforwardly. I asked this of you in the thread in which this post began, but I saw no answer from you, even though several people asked you to answer it. The April 1997 Kingdom Ministry stated on page 3:
"Every disciple maker must realize that it is his responsibility to direct the Bible student to God's organization. (1 Tim. 4:16) Each study session should be viewed as a stepping-stone toward the happy day when the new one will symbolize his dedication to Jehovah by water baptism. One of the questions that he will be asked during the baptism ceremony is: "Do you understand that your dedication and baptism identify you as one of Jehovah's Witnesses in association with God's spirit-directed organization?"
Hence, it is important that he realize he cannot serve God without actively associating with the true Christian congregation.
A similar sentiment is expressed in the 11/15/53 Watchtower (p. 691):
"Daniel is the only one mentioned in the prophecy who was a worshiper of Jehovah, the living God. . . That is why Daniel as one of the Jewish remnant is such a good picture of Jehovah's "slave" class on earth today. (Matt. 24:45-47) No one else adheres to pure worship."
The bolded statements explicitly say that non-JWs cannot be Christians. Do you agree with that or not? ::

GREG_2
First of all, I do not recall you asking me this question, and I do not read through all of the trailers on a given thread. But I will most certainly answer you now, and my answer is that these quotes from WT literature are clearly given in reference to those who knowingly serve God. That is, those who have come into contact with the truth as preserved in God’s Word and who accept it, will naturally recognize and associate with those of the same (biblical) faith.

'Naturally', really? The Bible is full of confusing and seemingly contrary statements, why would those ones end up in the same 'faith', unless you define 'faith' as 'all of Christendom'?

Greg: HOWEVER, there are those who may unknowingly serve God and be favorably judged through Christ by Him, and be “excused.”

Wait a minute, 'unknowingly serve God?' You just skipped over, danced around AF's point by bringing up a totally different subject. You did not at all deal with the question of whether persons who worship in other churches can be true Christians! You know full well these are viewed as lost and misguided by the WTS.
What a joke you are, Greggy. All that I have seen out of you is jousting on technical terms, hair splitting and subject changing. I guess that's all you have when truth eludes your contentions.
You sound like some shiester lawyer.
WW

Follow Ups:

- **Response to AF: Part One Farkel 16:42:03 11/02/99 (1)
  - ***Response to AF: Part One WW 16:32:54 11/03/99 (0)

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