# ************Awake! 12/8/99

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Posted by AF [AF] on October 29, 1999 at 14:20:06 {CAtoZJLIp2DjRmAxB/kMdaOt1gg/Zk}:

In Reply to: ***********Awake! 12/8/99 posted by Friend on October 28, 1999 at 20:30:35:

:: Proof: tell us what I sidestepped.

: Here I provided a link to this post . You ignored it, again.

I most certainly did not. I specifically commented thusly:

> Do you really want me to point out how you completely sidestepped each and every direct question I asked and every point I made? Exactly as you've done in this post and in this thread and in many other threads?

Rather than answering this direct question, you sidestepped it in your usual fashion with this non-answer:

> I see you again sidestep direct contradiction of your claims about how holy spirit is involved in appointing elders.

The fact is that the quotes you and I have posted prove that the Society is talking out of both sides of its mouth at the same time. It is teaching contradictory things. Your quotes do not cancel my quotes – they prove my point. Furthermore, the fact that most JWs believe that the Society is for all practical purposes inspired proves the Society’s disingenuousness.

: Here I explained what exactly you sidestepped.

Oh no you didn’t. You ignored everything I said, made a simple claim -- not an explanation -- that continued to ignore what I said and provided no explanation at all, and then stated that you were not going to provide an explanation:

> ::: does the Society teach that its leaders get information from God that they could not possibly get on their own?

> :: Yes, by means of the Bible and sharing with fellow Christians. (Hebrews 4:12; 2 Timothy 3:16,17; Matthew 28:19,20)

> :: I don’t owe you an explanation for this and will not dignify you with one.

Your comment about “by means of the Bible …” does not deal with my main point: The Society claims that it gets information directly from God or angels, not only through the Bible. If simply reading and applying the Bible, and sharing with fellow Christians were sufficient to “get information from God that they could not possibly get on their own”, then all Christians would have exactly the same claim to “active direction” from God that Watchtower leaders do. But since the latter deny this, there must be a difference. You have carefully avoided explaining this difference and why WTS leaders may be justified in claiming it.

Here you pretend you have no idea what I’m talking about, that you sidestepped nothing.

I’ve just proved that I sidestepped nothing, but that you sidestepped everything I said. You can similarly claim that the moon is made of green cheese, and you can claim that JWs don’t believe that the Society is for all practical purposes inspired, but when you provide not even an attempt at explaining away direct quotes that disprove your claims, even a dummy can see that you realize that you have no arguments to give. If you had them you’d present them instead of sidesteps.

: This post constructs the proof.

I’ve deconstructed it.

: Your other insults are not worth my very valuable time.

The only “insults” there were your own perceptions that my demands for solid answers to questions you refuse to answer are insults. Of course anyone who is backed into an intellectual corner will scream “insults” when he knows he has no answers.

Let’s recap what you can’t answer and refuse even to comment on, shall we?

The August 1, 1987 Watchtower, in the concluding paragraph of the second study article, stated explicitly that JW leaders receive, not merely passive direction from the Bible, but active direction from God:

> Thus, when we read in the Bible that Christ "is the head of the body, the congregation," we are convinced that he is not a mere titular Head. (Colossians 1:18) We know, from experience, that he is a real, active Head. When we read the book of Acts and see how Christ directed matters among the early Christians, we can observe that he is using the same means today. We see evidence of Christ's use of the holy spirit, angels, and "the faithful and discreet slave" and its Governing Body, to appoint spiritually qualified elders. Confident in Christ's active direction of things, we are determined to go on "speaking the truth" and growing up by love "in all things into him who is the head, Christ."

The April 1997 Kingdom Ministry stated that you cannot even be a Christian unless you’re one of Jehovah’s Witnesses.

Jehovah’s Witnesses individually almost all believe that the Society is for all practical purposes inspired. The fact that you don’t is irrelevant.

The 1975 Yearbook describes how A. H. Macmillan said that both he and J. F. Rutherford believed that Jehovah actively and directly caused Rutherford to come up with the name “Jehovah’s witnesses”. That is inspiration.

Now, you can either continue ignoring the above information, or you can deal with it by direct comments. This business of referring people to your past posts, as if those fully answered all possible objections, is nothing but a copout. If you do it again, then you’ll have proved what you’re made of.

AF

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- *************Awake! 12/8/99 Gedanken 14:37:06 10/29/99 (0)

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