*Note: All Scripture quotes are from the Douay-Rheims bible.
Evan the Evangelical: Carlos, I'd like to discuss the Catholic priesthood with you.
Carlos the Catholic: Oh, don't pull the "universal priesthood" argument on me again. Exodus 19:6 says�
Evan: Actually, that's not what I want to discuss. I'd like to talk about Jesus' words in Matthew 23:9: "And call no one on earth your father; for one is your Father, who is in heaven." You Catholics call your priests "father," violating this command.
Carlos: Ok, well, Jesus obviously didn't mean that literally because Stephen called Abraham "father" in Acts 7:2, and Paul called Isaac "father" in Romans 9:10.
Evan: Well, if we read the passage in context, we see that Jesus was talking about spiritual pride. He said in verses 11-12: "he who is greatest among you shall be your servant. And whoever exalts himself shall be humbled, and whoever humbles himself shall be exalted." I agree that he wasn't speaking literally in the strictest sense; He was only referring to "father" as a term of spiritual superiority. He also said not to call anyone "Rabbi" or "master," further indicating that He was only talking about spiritual superiority. Those examples you gave refer to ancestors, so they're not relevant to this discussion.
Carlos: Ok. Paul referred to Timothy as his son (1 Timothy 1:2) and Titus as his child (Titus 1:4), indicating his spiritual fatherhood.
Evan: While Paul did refer to Timothy and Titus as his children, he never said he was their father. Child is a title of subservience, and Jesus never prohibited titles of subservience. He did, however, prohibit titles of superiority.
Carlos: Oh, so we can say, "You're subservient to me" but not "I'm superior to you"?
Evan: No. Jesus warned against being elevated by others.
Carlos: Oh, so Jesus didn't want other people to elevate us, but we can elevate ourselves?
Evan: Well, Jesus only outlawed calling someone else "father."
Carlos: As you said before, the context was about being humble, and not elevating yourself also falls under humility. However, Paul DID elevate himself spiritually above Timothy and Titus, indicating that Jesus couldn't have meant what you think He meant. Jesus was using a hyperbole, as He often did, to make a point: we are to be humble because all authority and superiority we have comes from God, not ourselves.
Evan: Well, since Paul did call Timothy and Titus his children but didn't violate Jesus' command, Jesus had to have been speaking about calling others "father."
Carlos: Ok. What about calling yourself "father"? Paul did it in 1 Corinthians 4:14-15 and 2 Corinthians 12:14, where he referred to himself as the Father of the Corinthians. Let's see exactly what Paul said:
"I write these things not to put you to shame, but to admonish you as my dearest children. For although you have ten thousand tutors in Christ, you have not many fathers. For in Christ Jesus, through the Gospel, did I beget you." - 1 Corinthians 4:14-15
Paul starts off by calling the Corinthians his children and saying that they don't have many fathers. Then he says that he begot them (which is something a father does), which is, in essence, calling himself their father! Now, you may say that he didn't specifically say "I am your father," but he talks about fathers in the previous sentence, indicating that he was their father by begetting them!
"Behold, this is the third time that I am ready to come to you. And I will not be a burden to you; for I do not seek yours, but you. For the children should not save up for the parents, but the parents for the children." - 2 Corinthians 12:14
Paul clearly referred to himself as the father of the Corinthians. The only way you could get around this is by saying that Paul referred to himself as parent, not father, of the Corinthians, but that's just ridiculous. Paul, as a male parent, was their father.
Evan: Well, there's a difference between saying "I am a father" and "I am father so-and-so." Paul just said "I am a father," but Jesus forbade saying "I am father so-and-so."
Carlos: Oh, really? Where does Jesus make this distinction? He just forbids calling someone "father," and saying "I'm a father" and "I'm father so-and-so" are both calling someone father.
Evan: Well, where in the bible is anyone addressed as father so-and-so?
Carlos: It doesn't matter; like I said, saying "I'm a father" and "I'm father so-and-so" are the same thing. But, to give you your verse, Stephen calls the members of the Sanhedrin "brethren and fathers" in Acts 7:2.
Evan: Well, since Stephen was a Christian and the Sanhedrin was Jewish, they weren't his spiritual fathers, so he was probably referring to their age. This is further supported because he calls them "brethren and fathers," indicating that some were his age and some were older.
Carlos: Christians were still Jews at this time, so the members of the Sanhedrin would have been Stephen's spiritual fathers. Your contention that Stephen was referring to their age is speculative, and his using two titles is just using two titles to refer to the same people, just like we would say "friends and brothers in Christ" or something similar. The point still remains, however, that I gave you your verse.
Evan: *Looking at his watch* Well, it's been nice talking to you again, Carlos. I wish I could stay longer, but it's time for me to go eat dinner. I look forward to discussing this with you more some other time.
Carlos: It was nice talking to you again, Evan. I also look forward to our next discussion.