**************************************************************************************************** Session Start: Tue Oct 07 16:27:36 1997 *** Now talking in #TheWizardsWay Human order is made of rules. The wizard's order has no rules--it flows with the nature of life. Anarchy! Woo hoo! :-| };-D hi zahrim Trends, maybe. Never rules. What rules would you propose Rawn? no rules--it flows with the nature of life. Okay. Define "realm" and define "nature" well...within the physical manifestation, there are physical laws that govern all physical objects * Zahrim laughs I shy away from anything that suggests a definite. Crystalized beliefs seem contrary to the fluidity of life. Not laws that you could write down and define. such as that two physical objects cannot occupy the same space like gravity? I'm talking math & science here. You can't define either of those things in terms applicible to real life. Rawn: Well, I've never seen it happen, but I don't doubt it could. there are physical laws that cant allow that, even at the quantum level Maybe we can learn the rules of this material game we play - but the game is illusion. Thus, how can we assess the validity of those rules we ascertain from it? thinking about creative visualization...we can have what we want if we visualize it and FEEL it to be true. not easy though. I applaud the keeping of the open mind, but if you can never reach any conclusions/understanding about life, it is of no use Rawn: That's very abstract, though. It attempts to put a seperation where one doesn't exist. Physical/Mental/Spi ritual. *** AmanoJaku (~Tribe1@mariner.concentric.net) has joined #thewizardsway * Watcher casts a spell of peace and illumination upon AmanoJaku! * Zahrim waits for the drier to get done. thank you watcher Rawn: Does understanding nessecarily have to be in the form of a law? Hello, AmanoJaku hello all All say hello to, AmanoJaku *** ober has quit IRC (Leavingñ) with creative visualization...you have to be VERY specific...if you visualize freedom...you may find yourself out of of job, on the street, broke! Rawn, I don't think life can be placed into any conclusions. I think it can be experienced, and understood experientialy. you may not realize a definate seperation, but there are different aspects to the whole of the parts that operate within certain "guidelines" you have to visualize that fist full of dollars too...haha Rawn: Ok, I like that language better. I'll buy that. *chuckle* haha Jackie - {:-D Jackie: Have you achieved good results with creative visualization? and full understanding would be a law, because it would be "the truth" freedom is a state of mind, though...wouldnt you say? when i visualize something.. i sorta see it sometimes, and sorta dont.. other times i dont see it at all.. Rawn: Some believe "the truth" is fluid... thogh much of what is currently understood may not prove to be the laws they are claimed as it takes lots of focus and concentration to create by visualization...i dont have the capacity yet. Jackie: So you're theorizing? *sigh* Ok. Rawn, I don't think you can ever come to a full understanding - think of eternity & infinite - how can you ever be done? truths are fluid...but there is only one "Truth"...this cannot change, it is a singular expression laws can be broken...it's called miracles. the truths can and are fluid Rawn: Have you experienced this one "Truth?" ever be done? I have experience of parts of it as it is limited by my ignorance/understanding i mean for me to see a certain image in my mind.. and my third eye refuses to open it seems No, then. Ok. How do you know it exists, then? AmanoJaku: Get a crowbar. :) I know it because when I apply the parts of it that i do know of, it does not change, just my understanding of it does ;) Rawn: Hmm. We might be shooting at the same thing here. I'll blather my dogma now: haha...shoot AmanoJaku, sometimes we need to realized that perhaps our spirit doesn't want our third eye open just yet. Perhaps, we have more to learn in ignorance, before it is time to see beyond the veils of the physical. here. I'll blather my dogma now: same elephant from different views (and different words) I figure "Reality" is a sort of fractal pattern, and we're REALLY close. The closeness is all most can comprehend, and the big picture can't be seen all at once. Rawn: Which part of the elephant do you have? I've got his willy. :-P *** Maya (mayasweb@hailnet22.idirect.com) has joined #thewizardsway Heythere, Maya * Watcher casts a spell of peace and illumination upon Maya! hi everyone!!!!! oh...dont limit yourself like that...just accept the possibility that perhaps it can be (whether you currently can see it or not) hi gray...how are you? Rawn: Maybe I will, someday, but I'll have to get REALLY far away. maya...hiya babes Maya - I've just had a wonderful weekend hey rawn :) ((hugs)) where do you have to go? Today, I'm enjoying the thunder outside. ooo I love a good electrical storm...especially at night up at the cottage..with all the lights out Oh, no place specific, just back away from the part I'm in. Perhaps ascension or detachment or a hot dog is called for. *shrug* yeh graymind went skinny dipping this weekend... sounds good well then gray...I guess you had a good time....I assume you were not alone :) * Zahrim starts up the bad funk music. It was a wondreful camp out, with wonderful friends Stayed up watching for shooting stars with a great girl named Jessica. Then, went to the Whole Life Expo the next day. I was abandoned by my family this weekend....and grateful for it..hehehehe I treated myself to candles, bubble bath..mediation, and listening to my new cassette of Deepak Chopra reciting the Baghavadgita Maya - OOoooooooooo! girl named Jessica. excellent tape....EVERYONE should get it.... it is called Sacred Sounds, Sacred Verse,..I think So much fun to say. Deepak Chopra.. "Sacred Verses, Helaing Sounds" * Zahrim just bought the newest Sarah McLachlan CD healing...sheeesh Maya - what do oyu know about chakras? excellent tape....EVERYONE should get it.... Green's the heart chakra. It's at yer sternum So much fun to say. Deepak Chopra.. * Zahrim nods * ladynada sneaks back into the channel I was speaking with someone the other day about joining the crown & root chakras together.. How? Kundalini? We weren't talking about how to do it - as much as we were talking about what it would represent (sorry Zahrim) Or something more autoerotic, perhaps? I know I'm not that flexible, but... zahrim: how did you learn about the chakras? * Zahrim feels his mind spin Yoga And books i learned from books AmanoJaku: Done much work with it? yes, but just transmitting energies I don't remember who I was talking with - but she seemed to see the joining of the Root & Crown chakras as our aim in life. AmanoJaku: I donut understand. Please explain. well, I think they are already joined :) though if you are talking about expanding your consciousness to know that...this I would understand The union of Spirit & Physical - Heaven on Earth.. GrayMind: You could do that with kundalini. That IS their aim. Most others just want to align the chakras properly. GrayMind: What? <<<<< Random Quote >>>>>> "We come spinning out of nothingness, scattering stars like dust." Rumi <<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>> well bringing light into say the green chakra then sending that green ray up the spinal chord to the indigo chakra where i create a funnel to transmit love into another for manifestation or for healing AmanoJaku: Hmm. Okay. I've only briefly read about Kundalini - looks like time to study up on it. for manifestation or for healing I think you focus on where your attention already IS GrayMind: It's not about union of heaven and earth, really. More about ecscatic union with shiva/sakti. i just recently practiced a Kundalini Meditation and attempted levitation AmanoJaku: Did it work? Zahrim, please explain. I think you focus on where your attention already IS could feel the new circuitry in my brain connecting and a lot of "almost" working urges zahrim: i dont think im ready to conciously accept the fact the I can levitate GrayMind: Well, depends how you approach it, I suppose. Some vedics do kundalini.. Anyways, the tantrics see kundalini as a snake coiled at the base of your spine. That's siva, who wants to climb up your back to reach sakti. Oooh - I like the imagery. the fact the I can levitate ecstatic experience than a transcendental one, from what I read. who said: " A Wise man is: Someone who can live and express itself on its own.." ??? zahrim: sakti being the crown chakra or higher self? * Zahrim shrugs Lao Tzu, maybe? read. substituted) Not really higher... i was wondering cause i was tought to rise it even past the chakras up to the higher self *** DarkWay (Hamburgler@ip62-200.vcv.primenet.com) has joined #thewizardsway * Watcher casts a spell of peace and illumination upon DarkWay! Hello no found out in Bridge it was a quote from Powder. what about kundalini now? past the chakras up to the higher self your head, yeah. DarkWay: What? Is that a kind of pasta? ;-) *** Powder (powder@portD40.Generation.NET) has joined #TheWizardsWay * Watcher casts a spell of peace and illumination upon Powder! there are 12 chakras I believe...some extend above the physical vehicle. *** ^SunBeam (eva@ppp3.zeuter.com) has joined #thewizardsway * Watcher casts a spell of peace and illumination upon ^SunBeam! #TheWizardsWay kundalini.. but when i do i feel the difference intensely now i brought everybunny over from Bridge...haha Jackie: Not in straight yoga. only 7 there. So far i'v gotten to the 8th <^SunBeam> hehhe yeah hiya jackie :) the 8th is outside the body Again, not in straight yoga. dark: gotten to? Yes.I'v taped.open to i only know of 7.. and the higher self *Maya* when the energy in a room is so sparatic, it is difficult for me to relay my impressions on a topic with much clarity...I would love to chat about chakras with you sometime when perhaps it is not so busy started experienceing streaching of concioussness.it doesn't happen much anymore Well <^SunBeam> bave to go bye for now *** ^SunBeam has quit IRC (Let the love be with you always !!!!!!ñ) 8th is soul i belive. 9 is universe and 10 is union and knowleg of all.relization of self. Siva climbing up the spine to reach Sakti... is the meditational practice similar to the practice of traversing up the 10 levels of Qaballah? Doesn't make it any less valid, just makes it unorthodox. -> *Maya* I would enjoy that very much. Kundalini for me is kinda bizzare.It has gone all the way past brain stem and stuff.but I have no controll on when it rises gray: thats how i think of it GrayMind: Not exactly, though comparrisons could be made. there are many perceptions on the idea of chakras...includ ing a perception of a ONE CHAKRA system dark: pretend you have control and you will begin to actually have it yes shiva silver ensulated cord is a old pratice Maya: Yeah, the hara. That's mainly Japanese, methinks. amano.I can make it stimulat maybe move it but the hge burst happen when they want to AmanoJaku...wouldn't a great part of you KNOW you are pretending? hara.I remember studying that.It is another name for kundalini I belive spiritual center pretending=creative visualization? maya: well you do have to seriously belive it one 2 inch under the belly button also. -> *Maya* I initialy wanted to see how you thought about how I could include the idea of joining our chakras together in the scope of my book. It seems to be another way to represent the spiritual growth towards the union of physical (root chakra) with the spiritual (crown chakra) jackie: right.. or vizualize DarkWay: Nope. It's the "one point." Center of balance in martial arts like ninjitsu and aikido. believe is different than know....though we are good at believing illusions till it drives us crazy dark: i havent had a big explosion in a LONG time.. the trick to make it work is to FEEL it to be true, not actual pretending. DarkWay: That's the right position, too. * Zahrim shrugs yeah.when I was younger I was like reading some 70's ninjitsu book.Thats were I remeber hara from.spiritual/psysica l meeting point and center I must be going. I have to drive for 2 hours or so now. Seeya bye Zahrim *Maya* well...you could think of both chakras having a very similar purpose....I mean...what comes AFTER the crown...and what came before the ROOT? cya Zahrim *** Zahrim has quit IRC (Don't trip angry.ñ) dark: although my reality lately is constantly shifting and sometimes seems unstable Better to remain fluid yeah.My reality has become jagged.with much negitive stuff happening around me. -> *maya* good questions... gray: fluid? *Maya* it is simply a matter of perspective really kundalini happens when it wants to I just flow with it hmmm...there is that fluid againd...time to drink some reality *Maya* if you ARE in the CROWN..whats the view What came before the Root chakra, what comes after the crown chakra... ? gray: flow with the soul? *Maya* if you ARE in the root...whats the view *Maya* all around gray: all begins and ends in mystery ;) *Maya* if you ARE in the HEART *Maya* etc * GrayMind smiles. The root is the first.in soem ulter it is the second stimulated by the "second" one AmanoJaku - I meant it is better to be fluid in our beliefs than to become crystalized. *Maya* the heart chakra has often been symbolized as the Bridal Chamber gray: ahh.. yes ofcourse after the crown.I belive there is the energy thing.Soemthing that involves all the energys.then the soul and then universe abstract thinking ;) all is one.. the Law is ONE -> *Maya* I heard a lecture at the Expo on awakening the Heart Chakra. u can connect the root to the center of earth *Maya* probably 98 per cent of humanity is in the lower chakras -> *H* SAY #thewizardsway Do not assume that you know all. Be contented and remain empty, and learn to sustain the Beginner's Mind. Do not assume that you know all. Be contented and remain empty, and learn to sustain the Beginner's Mind. *Maya* yet, many decieve themselves and delude themselves into thinking otherwise brb coffee run * GrayMind thows some 0,5~~~5,0D *COFFEE* 0,5~~~5,0D to ladynada !!!!!!!! 12 chakra.. just like the DNA is supposed to have 12 little spirales.. 7 chakra near the body and 5 in different universes. (IMHO) Multi-dimensonal beings aren't we? watcher: i cant help but feel like a beginner ;).. i am just now realizing so many things ;) *Maya* the heart center is also recognized as Christ Consciousness there are times to BE energy and other times to DO energy...it takes balance of these two to be successful. well self relization is the true goal. am just now realizing so many things ;) amano.well get back on that goal dark: the one i seem to drift further from every day Session Close: Tue Oct 07 18:14:12 1997 ***************************************************