Session Start: Thu Oct 02 14:47:05 1997
*** Now talking in #TheWizardsWay
<Itzeo> the MUST be ONE chakra, disconnected when we became
   physical
<Wu_Ming> Itzeo - reminds me of a quote/prophesy from
  a movie : "What was sundered and undone, shall be whole- the
  two made one!"
<Wu_Ming> That would be from The Dark Crystal, a
  favorite of mine - though I saw it in the movie theatre when I
  was maybe 3.
<^alex^> according to what I've read about auras that is of
   course using the chakras for the whole...when a person
   becomes completely balanced the aura tends to be like a
   rainbow that shows all connected...and in all the colors
   showing as a rainbow of the chakras with the overeteral auric
   body becoming more white or golden...
<Itzeo> alex... let me throw a monkey wrench in your thought
   just for a second, then I will connect it to our chakra
   discussion
<Itzeo> ever see a double rainbow??
<SHAMAN> yes!
<Itzeo> notice how on the duplicate, the colors are reversed??
<SHAMAN> yes
<Itzeo> but, not only are the colors reversed, there is a
   distinct separation between the two rainbows
<Itzeo> why?
<Itzeo> I've lately seen rainbows reversed where all colors
   connect!
<^alex^> hmmm...never noticed the colors reversed...but in what
   I've seen of the example it is like a rainbow on either
   side...connecting at the crown and base chakra...
<wu> wow... neat, itzeo
<Itzeo>side...connecting at the crown and base chakra...
   between them, you have red/orange/yellow/blue/green/indigo/vio
   let/indigo/green/etc
<Itzeo> ppl just are so wrapped up in life, they forget to look
   up!
<wu> related to chakras, itzwo
<^alex^> I saw that effect around the sun once...I was
   amazed...had never seen anything like it...
<Itzeo> ok...relating to chakras
<Itzeo> the colors of the rainbow = colors of the chakras
   up!
<wu> hmmmm.... in same order?
<Itzeo> why the reversal of colors
<Itzeo> mirrored, wu
<Itzeo> and only one indigo band, not two
<wu> hmmmm........ can there be a front without a back
<Itzeo> indigo = crown chakra, correct??
<SHAMAN> yes
<Itzeo> not in this dimension, wu, no
<wu> k
<Itzeo> hence, the hypothesis that the crown chakra and base
   chakra need to be connected, as in front/back, but more
   closely in this instance, top/bottom
<Itzeo> the connection would create a TRUE energy center within
   our bodies that would facilitate opening and feeding of all
   remaining chakras in the body
<Itzeo> would leave no question WHERE that center was
<Itzeo> see?
<Wu_Ming> I wonder if what is seen in the rainbows, depends on
  who is looking.  i.e. Someone who's chakras have begun to
  balance & blend would see the blending of the two rainbows....
    or is it something which reflects the state of all of us.
<Itzeo> Wu_, nature has been trying to give us clues for a long
   time, we just haven't noticed in most cases
<Wu_Ming> Itzeo - it seems lately Nature has lost it's temper
  with us
<Itzeo> or we look, and project a more basal, more physical
   meaning to what we are shown
<Itzeo> we forget to expand our awareness
<Itzeo> it's just YELLING at us now to get our attention,
   because subtlety has been lost on most human forms
<SHAMAN> true
<Wu_Ming> I know
<Itzeo> used to be you could whisper to get someone's attention,
   now ya gotta poke them because they are so distracted
<Itzeo> nature's using same ploy
<Itzeo> Shaman.... back to your concept of the connectedness of
   that tree image,please?
<SHAMAN> you wre sayin you had a vision of a tree..green/silver/&
    gold
<SHAMAN> no ordiary tre
<Itzeo> yeah.... it came in conjunction with the hypothesis of
   connecting the two chakras
<Itzeo> it was nearly blinding it was so bright, forgot to say
   that... but a comfortable blinding, if you understand
<SHAMAN> i was just thinking the tree could symbolize chakras in
   that it is grounded & it also reaches upwards>>
<wu> and it is all connected to itself
<SHAMAN> yes
<Itzeo> you said something about the roots right before my
   hiccup here
<SHAMAN> the tree grows toward the light as well
<Itzeo> as do we
<SHAMAN> well of course the roots & the root chakra corrilate
<Wu_Ming> I've got a quote in a paper I wrote Shaman, that
  sounds like what you are saying... hold on I'll get it.
<SHAMAN> many corrilations there
<SHAMAN> good symbol
<SHAMAN> k
<Itzeo> yes... energy drawing is accomplished from base to
   crown... as nutrients flow up a tree
<SHAMAN> yeah,
* Itzeo feels like she's working a jigsaw puzzle for some reason
<Itzeo> the missing piece..... ok.... who's got it???????? ~%^/
<Itzeo> fyi... there will be another Star Knowledge Conference
   in Estes Park, Colorado November 21-23
<Wu_Ming> Here's that quote Shaman
<Wu_Ming> When I think of the relationship between the universe
  and the human
<Wu_Ming> brain an image that comes to mind is that of a tree--
  not just its
<Wu_Ming> glorious crown of branches but also its system of
  roots, which may
<Wu_Ming> extend as far into the earth as the branches spread
  into the sky.  To
<Wu_Ming> me, the branches symbolize the observed universe,
  while the roots
<Wu_Ming> symbolize the brain.  Both systems are constantly
  growing and
<Wu_Ming> evolving, and they depend on each other.(Ferris 71)
***************************************************
<Itzeo> commercial over... back to chakras
<Itzeo> ;)
<Itzeo> shaman.... if you take all the colors of the rainbow,
   and mix them, what color do you get?
<Itzeo> I realize light and crayons mixing produce different
   results
* Wu_Ming loves those giant boxes of crayons.
<SHAMAN> black
<Itzeo> or brown?
*wu* ok..... that would be great....ah... do you play a musical
  instrument?
<SHAMAN> yeah mud
<SHAMAN> :)
<SHAMAN> lol
<Wu_Ming> All light together creates white
-> *wu* Not well.
<Itzeo> ok..... THAT is what I was getting at
<SHAMAN> white is the absence of color
<Wu_Ming> black is the absence of color
*wu* i have a synthesizer... but I do not play it well either
<Itzeo> it is the color missing in everyone, whatever color it is
<SHAMAN> but not white light
<SHAMAN> oh forget it
<SHAMAN> i need to go back to art shcol
*wu* shaman and I were talking about jamming while ya'll were
  here... so... bring something
* Wu_Ming slaps SHAMAN around a bit with an illusory mental
  construct.
<Itzeo> shaman... in order to figure this out, you'd need to be
   expert in lighting for stages, I think
* SHAMAN has to go ...:(
<SHAMAN> bbl....bye everyone!
<Itzeo> primary light colors are different than 'crayon' colors
*wu* we can share our ineptitude
<SHAMAN> hehehe
<Itzeo> oh man... I can see a book coming out of all the parts
   of this hypothesis
-> *wu*  I could bring my Irish Tin Whistle?  Or my accoustic
   guitar - though I play the whistle better than the guitar.
<SHAMAN> bye wu.,ITZEO,wu-ming.,alex.
<Wu_Ming> Take care Shaman!
<Itzeo> nice talking at ya, shaman.... thanks!
*wu* sounds great  (so far)   :))
<Watcher> bye shaman ...i love you!
<SHAMAN> k
<Wu_Ming> Better practice your music for the retreat
*** SHAMAN (tho364.air@gw3-ppp29.its.iadfw.net) has left
#Thewizardsway
*wu* Shaman is going to bring his guitar
<Itzeo> I needed this, today...
<Itzeo> alex?? you still there?
*** SHAMAN has left IRC
<Wu_Ming> Itzeo, I am glad we were here for you.
<Wu_Ming> As you are here for us
<Wu_Ming> I am thankful for the insight you provided about the
  union of the chakras
<Itzeo> :)
<Itzeo> I've needed to express lately, and in my 'home' channel,
   there has been some 'thwarting' of ideas lately
<Itzeo> sad to say
*wu* ok... back to channel
<Wu_Ming> I am working on a book about the Wu Ming
<Wu_Ming> thwarting of ideas?
<Itzeo> Wu_, somehow I feel we've only touched surface on this
   union
<wu> what is the wu-ming, Wu ming?
<Wu_Ming> 0,1Wu Ming is a 4,1TAO 0,1concept meaning:
<Wu_Ming> 14,1The Neutralization of Duality0,1.
<Wu_Ming> 1,14It is similar to the concept of GrayMind.
<Itzeo> that much more will come from this and very soon, too
<Wu_Ming> Itzeo, you've certainly given me a new slant on chakra
  meditation.
<Itzeo> yes, thwarting.... minds set in paths unable to look
   around openly
<Wu_Ming> let's see
<Itzeo> I'll be outside under my cottonwood meditating tonight,
   no matter how chilly it is
<wu> cool
<Wu_Ming> That sounds like the people in your 'home' channel
  should hear quote 89
<Itzeo> 89?
-> *H* SAY #thewizardsway I'll reference quote 89 for you now..
<Watcher> I'll reference quote 89 for you now..
<Watcher> Do not assume that you know all. Be contented and
   remain empty, and learn to sustain the Beginner's Mind.
<Itzeo> k
<Itzeo> sheesh... that's practically a motto for me!
<wu> zen mind.. beginners mind.... it is me
* Wu_Ming smiles
<Wu_Ming> It is a motto for me as well
<Itzeo> and for that, probably why the insight was given to me
   earlier today! ;)
<Wu_Ming> Itzeo, you said earlier that you were a born psychic?
<Wu_Ming> You seem a fascinating person, I'd like to know you
  better.
<Itzeo> I still have one more thing to think about, concerning
   the vision of that tree.... I stood to the right of it as I
   saw it
<wu> Itz.... what implication is there for the underatand of the
   connection of chakras?
<wu> understanding
* Itzeo reads fluent typo
<wu> heheh
<wu> good
<Itzeo> could be the 'missing link' to totality with the
   universe, wu
<wu> sometms I mkae mistkases
<Itzeo> or could be something entirely different.... food for
   thought, tho
* Wu_Ming chuckles.
<Itzeo> I agree with the conjecture that the chakras were
   probably deliberately disconnected when we became physical
<Itzeo> to make us physical, or to disconnect our understanding
   to force growth?
<wu> are we not always already connected to the totality of the
   universe?
<Itzeo> are we?? I think not.... not even unconsciously
<Wu_Ming> Well - that is symbolic of the birth of duality ....
  Birth of Opposites = Birth of Opposistion.
<Itzeo> back to the rainbow hehe
<Wu_Ming> I think that the Duality is illusion.
<wu> yes...
<wu> agreed
<Wu_Ming> I don't think we can ever cease being both Creator &
  Created - but we decided to fool ourselves with illusion so
  that we could experience individuality.
<Itzeo> trying to think of a way to phrase the sense I have on
   duality
<Wu_Ming> That is one of the premises I'm going on in my book.
<wu> and relationship
<Itzeo> most ppl spend their entire life trying to reconnect
   with that energy in one way or another, tho, true?
<wu> well put
<Wu_Ming> Itzeo - true
<Itzeo> so, how can we be constantly connected??
<wu> we sense it... that it is us
<Wu_Ming> Yet, also - they are always connected.  We just don't
  know it.
<Itzeo> I think the link would partly be joined by completing
   the Life Chakra... ie.. base connected to crown chakra
<wu> how do you keep from knowing Itzeo?
* Itzeo wonders where that name came from????????
<Itzeo> by constantly questioning, wu
<wu> hehehe.... yes... thats it..
<Itzeo> finding premises, theories that counter 'concrete'
   formats
<wu> the great search is for resistance
<Itzeo> not resistance, flow
<Itzeo> resistance is a premise that counters a format, you see?
<wu> to resist knowing, itz
<Wu_Ming> I heard it nicely put in the book Conversations with
  God... We are already in heaven, but we don't realize it.  We
  have this idea that we have to go somewhere to get to heaven.
  So we leave where we are.  Thusly, we go through Hell, only to
  arrive where we begain - Heaven.
<wu> we resist knowing our non-dual self
<Itzeo> good point, Wu_
<Itzeo> quite the opposite, wu... re resist knowing our duality!
<wu> Wu.. I was just discussing that concept the other evening
<Itzeo> that is why there's such a gender conflict
<Itzeo> ppl don't recognize/accept we are dual, both genders
<Wu_Ming> wu, these ideas are being heard by many people these
  days.
<wu> genders... hmmmm..... that is not what i mean by duality
<Itzeo> without the final connection, the only way we can
   experience both genders is to reincarnate in different gender
<Wu_Ming> Become androgenous
* Wu_Ming winks
<Itzeo> use it as a physical manifestation easily recognized, wu
<Itzeo> gender, I mean
<Itzeo> we are more than our sexual gender where duality is
   concerned, but the image of gender is easier to grasp for most
*** Itzeo is now known as Pat
<Pat> ;)
*** Pat is now known as Itzeo
<Itzeo> androgenous enough for ya?
<wu> itz... you are more female than male right?
* Itzeo grabs neck of tshirt.... looks down.....
*** JEP has left IRC
<Itzeo> yup
<wu> hehehe
<Itzeo> actually, I'm both.... sitting here just like a guy would
<wu> me too
<wu> hehehe
<Itzeo> physical body says ALL WOMAN, but I have many masculine
   traits (without makeup, anyway)
<Wu_Ming> Well, Itzeo - we are finishing the process of
  recognizing the uniqueness of both genders - I think we have
  come to see the duality.  But that is not the end.  Once we
  fully know each side of the duality, then we are ready to
  bring the back together in union
<wu> we are all always both
<wu> just a quantative thing
<Itzeo> perhaps that is one of the prerequisites to connecting
   that chakra?????
<Wu_Ming> Possibly
<Itzeo> one of the steps.... comment made earlier was that
   simply connecting the chakra parts would be a shortcut
<Wu_Ming> hmm
<wu> I dont know enought bout chakras to enter this
<Itzeo> my comment was that ppl would miss if they merely tried
   to connect the chakra without learning/growing/understanding
   before the 'mechanical' union took place
<Itzeo> but, perhaps the union itself will create that
   understanding??????
<Wu_Ming> I'm not sure I feel comfortable with the idea of
  short-cuts on the path towards spiritual awakening
<Itzeo> we won't know until someone actually manages to connect
   the two
<Itzeo> I'm not comfortable, either, Wu.... there's no such
   thing as a shortcut to awakening
<wu> I got stuck with the bottom chakra..... and am still
   there... I love analysis
<Itzeo> only a figment of imagination that there is
* Itzeo thinks her throat chakra connected to her fingers for
  irc purposes ;)
<Wu_Ming> wu, I recently did a chakra tarot spread.
<Wu_Ming> I had the devil card right at the gateway to my higher
  self
<wu> hmmmmmm ..... never was aware of the connection there either
<Itzeo> that actually makes sense, Wu_
<Itzeo> that card symbolizes great changes about to occur, true?
<Wu_Ming> No, that is the death card
<Itzeo> well, my deck doesn't have a 'devil' card
<Wu_Ming> The devil card represents illusionary bondage
<wu> but to get to the higher self... death is necessary
<Itzeo> hmmmmmmm...grabbing them.. one sec
<Itzeo> I don't think it is necessary, wu
<Wu_Ming> hehe - Itzeo there are so many various tarot decks
<Wu_Ming> wu - yes, death - change
<wu> I consider disidentification with the ego... a death
* Wu_Ming nods
<Wu_Ming> Of course, the ego is part of the whole - and nothing
  ever really dies
<Itzeo> I take that definition of that card back.....
<wu> no... just disidentified with
* Wu_Ming nodsnodsnods
<wu> but we fear it like we do death
<Itzeo> it can be interpreted as an acceptance of that which
   cannot be proved, or the learning of the existence of that
   which cannot be proved... an awakening of faith
<Itzeo> also, that such experiences can be painful, but the
   results are eventually seen to be worth the pain
<Itzeo> that doesn't necessarily include death, to me
<wu> you speak of acceptance and faith....itz
<Itzeo> yes
<wu> are these not in the realm of concepts... dualitic
   knowledge?
<Itzeo> physical words attached to concepts
<wu> the map... but not the territory?
<wu> can we get there by dualistic knowledge?
* Wu_Ming smiles
<Itzeo> our human understanding is so limited by our human form,
   that is our biggest problem, as I see it
<Itzeo> and the reason, perhaps, so many seek information
   astrally thru projection
<wu> what do you think, Wu
<Wu_Ming> Let's see, I've pulled up my saved copy of that spread
  I did..
<wu> I seek information in order to resist being there
<Itzeo> being where?
<Wu_Ming> The devil card well on my third eye chakra.
<Itzeo> Wu?? are you a seer?
<wu> in a state of knowing ... in nondual reality
<Itzeo> clairvoyant?
<Wu_Ming> This is a bit of what the it says about the third eye
  chakra
<wu> no.... a few experiences... but no
<Wu_Ming> The sixth Chakra is the realm of spiritual
  realization, intuition, psychic abilities, and awareness of
  the Divine.  It is not yet the complete union with the
  all-encompassing energy of the Universe, but is a highly
  evolved spiritual level where the individual is aware of him
  or herself as a separate entity who perceives the glory of the
  One.  Thus, the 'Third Eye,' centered between the brows, which
  is able to perceive that which was previously unseen.
<Wu_Ming> Now
<Itzeo> Wu_, I meant, sorry... one of you should switch nicks or
   something!!! lol
<Wu_Ming> This is what I have down about the devil card.. sorry
  for taking up space.
<wu> sometimes called the causal level
<Itzeo> np
*** Wu_Ming is now known as GrayMind
-H- User [52] Wu_Ming is auto-updated to GrayMind.
<Itzeo> ok... Gray?? are you a seer?? clairvoyant?
<GrayMind> This will take up space - I'll answer that question
  Itzeo in just a sec..
<GrayMind> The card of the Devil represents those hidden forces
  of negativity that constrain us and deceive us into thinking
  we are imprisoned by external forces. The Devil is an inner
  force within each of us, he is an embodiment of our fears,
  addictions, and other harmful impulses. The people chained at
  his feet are entranced with the paralyzing fear of his
  illusory power and therefore stand still with hopelessness and
  a numb appearance. However, the chains hang loosely around
  their necks, an indication that freedom is within their grasp
  if they can only break free of the hypnotic attachment to the
  te
<GrayMind> Yes, Itzeo - I am
<wu> gray... you consider yourself a "realized" being?
<GrayMind> No
<Itzeo> ok.... has your third eye been closed much lately, to
   block out clairvoyant info??
<GrayMind> I can hear the voice of my spirit, but I can not
  always bring it to words.
<Itzeo> are you visual or audio?
<wu> spirit is nondual... words are dual
<Itzeo> my guess audio, using words
* GrayMind nods
<GrayMind> Well- I have feelings
<GrayMind> I feel what is comming - I neither see it, nor put it
  into words
<Itzeo> gray... do you get frontal headaches every now and then??
<wu> feelings are the kinesthetic
<Itzeo> ok... clairvoyant
<GrayMind> Not very useful in that way, whuch is why I use tarot
<GrayMind> hmm headaches
<GrayMind> I get sinus headaches all the time
<Itzeo> more empathic, probably...yes.. do you get headaches??
   frontal ones
<wu> {plan to bring you cards, too, gray)
<GrayMind> I will wu
<Itzeo> ok... you could perceive what I'm trying to get at as
   sinus headaches
<Itzeo> see... I used to get migraines horridly until I realized
   I was slamming shut my third eye chakra
<GrayMind> Yes, empathic is the word that would fit me
<Itzeo> once I learned to accept the info, and keep the eye
   open, the headaches ceased
<GrayMind> That is what I am working on
<wu> darn... have to go...  hope to join you tomorrow.... bye all
<GrayMind> Take care wu
<GrayMind> 4o_ª_++_ª_o2o_ª_++_ª_o3 wu 2o_ª_++_ª_o4o_ª_++_ª_o
<wu> enjoyed the chat..... profound
*** wu (bobt@d6m09.e-tex.com) has left #THEWIZARDSWAY
<Itzeo> it helps to create a buffer zone for the information,,,
   kinda like a shield to protect you... or consider it as 'save
   as....'
-> *wu* GrayMind@mail.utexas.edu
-> *wu* Let's keep in touch and plan this retreat
<Itzeo> like a folder in your computer... allow the info to go
   there, then access it when you feel capable of dealing with
   it all
<GrayMind> I like that image
<Itzeo> but endeavor to keep that chakra open and functioning!!
<Itzeo> don't shut it because of the overflow you receive!
<Itzeo> you WILL get headaches!
* GrayMind nods.
<Itzeo> you already know that chakras being closed can create
   dis-ease, right?
<GrayMind> True
<GrayMind> For me, I need to work on allowing myself the
  expression
<GrayMind> It is why I have been writing more lately.
<GrayMind> And chatting here
<Itzeo> :)
<GrayMind> Still, the devil is with me.  The illusion of bondage
<GrayMind> It is difficult to believe I am capable of more than
  this physical world
<Itzeo> I'm going to have to open back to that hypothesis via
   meditation and see if more insights on it come
<GrayMind> I know it intellectually, but the shackles are still
  there
<Itzeo> I feel I'm close to something important, for some reason
<Itzeo> please do me a favor??
<GrayMind> Absolutely!
-> *H* SAY #thewizardsway You need but ask.
<Itzeo> feel free to discuss the theory with others, and gain
   their feedback, thoughts?
  there
<GrayMind> I will discuss this concept.
Session Close: Thu Oct 02 17:25:33 1997
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