Saturday August 22, 1998 26 Messages ======================================== From: "James G. Wilson" To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Date sent: Sat, 22 Aug 1998 00:51:23 +0000 Subject: List REconfiguration Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Hey all, Since I've received so many requests (private & public), I've changed the "reply-to" policy back to its previous status. All I ask is that folks be careful about their replies- double check exactly to whom it is that you are sending your responses. Thanks- and, sorry for the confusion. Take care, and best wishes to all. In loving memory of Vyvyan: March 20, 1988 - August 15, 1997 James G. Wilson- phaedrus@npwt.net http://www.angelfire.com/il/felv/ http://www.geocities.com/HotSprings/Spa/8025/ http://thor.prohosting.com/felvinfo/ http://www.fortunecity.com//skyscraper/sterling/20/niu.html ---------------------------------------- From: GinaTex@aol.com Date sent: Sat, 22 Aug 1998 12:02:09 EDT To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Debby Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Hi Debby, I am still catching up on my email. I did not realize that you had asked before, I live in Bristol, RI now (right on the parade route) . Before that we live in West Warwick. I only lived in RI since 1986, I grew up in Southeast Texas (my family are all still there in Texas). How long ago did you move away? and where do you live now? Gina ---------------------------------------- From: GinaTex@aol.com Date sent: Sat, 22 Aug 1998 12:09:50 EDT To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: Re: Hershey's reunion Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Debby I justread your post on letting Hershey out. How are they all doing now? Cats are certainly funny, it reminds me of the day I made the bed with Sophia "stuck" in it. She got caught up in the blanket and was hanging off the side of the bed meowing very softly with all the other cats walking all around the bedroom like nothing was wrong. She was like that 2 hours, I felt so bad. Gina ---------------------------------------- Date sent: Sat, 22 Aug 1998 12:51:28 -0400 To: felvtalk@MailingList.net From: three ring circuits Subject: Re: Debby Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Gina- I was born in Cranston and lived there till I was 13 . Then we moved to Providence ( on the East side ) near Brown U. I've got family still up there and they in fact have a summerhome in Touisset - right near you! To answer your question... when I went to college ( okay... here I'm showing my age..... back in 1968 (gulp!) I moved away but as I said, STILL consider myself a New Englander. We live in the suburbs of Washington, D.C. now and any chance I get, I try to go back up for "clam cakes" and "lobster rolls" and "Dell's lemonade" LOL! thanks for writing :-) Debby, & the HBG (the HairballGang) ---------------------------------------- From: GinaTex@aol.com Date sent: Sat, 22 Aug 1998 12:58:39 EDT To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: Re: Debby Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Debby Hi, now that I am living here I too consider myself a New Englander, I love it here. And dont worry about the age, it means nothing, it was is in the heart that counts. Gotta have the Dells esp in summer Gina ---------------------------------------- Date sent: Sat, 22 Aug 1998 12:54:21 -0400 To: felvtalk@MailingList.net From: three ring circuits Subject: Re: Re: Hershey's reunion Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Gina- Oh.. that's TOOOO funny about Sophia getting caught up in the blanket when you made the bed! I can see ANY of my cats doing this - especially my Ragdolls who aren't terribly bright but VERY sweet! ( oops... didn't mean to imply that your Sophia wasn't bright...but here in our house, IF that happened, this would be the reason. It took Hershey almost a week to realize he really could venture out of this room if he wanted..... now I find him going out from time to time, but also STILL spending most of his time in here. I think he likes the idea of this being his very own "special apt." LOL! Debby, & the HBG (the HairballGang) ---------------------------------------- From: GinaTex@aol.com Date sent: Sat, 22 Aug 1998 13:19:33 EDT To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: Re: Re: Hershey's reunion Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Debby It sounds like he is enjoying his special "apartment". He must feel special in there. I know that you are not implying she is not too smart, but she was under the sheets with Patrick and Elizabeth too and theose two made it out. When she was a kitten she got herself into a few potentialy bad situtations, she got locked into the refriderator for about a half an hour, She is all black and is fast. We felt so bad, she got hugs all night long making up for it. And just a few weeks later she found her way into the crawl space of the basement and into an old dry well that was 6 feet deep and to the very back of the basement that we jsut found out was there when we had work done. Anyways I was looking for her everywhere could not find her and said I hope she is not there, so I crawled in this space and sure enough I heard the faint cry, and she was stuck too high to jump ( she was just 7 months old). I could just about get her, I practicaly hung down in there and she jumped up on my arm and snuggled next to me. Afeter that I made sure no other cat could get in there. We no longer livve there. Gina ---------------------------------------- Date sent: Sat, 22 Aug 1998 20:37:16 +0200 From: Christina Marie Hayton To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Mail about Nan and Tut Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Hi list I'm new to the list, and have only seen a reply to a mail titled "Nan and Tut". Could someone post the original mail to me so I can read it? Thanks Christina Hayton Apelia's Birmans (Norway) http://www.hayton.no/apelia ---------------------------------------- From: "James G. Wilson" To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Date sent: Sat, 22 Aug 1998 13:50:16 +0000 Subject: Re: Mail about Nan and Tut Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Hi Christina, Welcome to the list. We have an archive of all the mail from this list, and you can find it at: http://www.geocities.com/HotSprings/Spa/8025/ along with a whole host of great information about feline leukemia. I'd also like to take this opportunity to announce to the list that Beth Zimmerman has contributed a wonderful piece on feline oral health for the FeLV information sheet. I highly recommend folks give it a read. Christina, if you have any questions or comments about any of these FeLV projects, please let us know- there are alot of great people here to help you. Take care, and best wishes to all. In loving memory of Vyvyan: March 20, 1988 - August 15, 1997 James G. Wilson- phaedrus@npwt.net http://www.angelfire.com/il/felv/ http://www.geocities.com/HotSprings/Spa/8025/ http://thor.prohosting.com/felvinfo/ http://www.fortunecity.com//skyscraper/sterling/20/niu.html ---------------------------------------- Date sent: Sat, 22 Aug 1998 12:26:13 -0500 From: Gabriela Mendez Perez Organization: Southwestern Bell Internet Services To: "felvtalk@MailingList.net" Subject: Re: Nan and Tut Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Nan-- I wish there was some way to make this time easier for you and Tut. I think maybe the best thing you can do is tell Tut how much you love him, and how much you don't want him to hurt. That it's okay for him to leave this world and move on to whatever the next one holds for him, a release from pain, a chance for his spirit to glow with health and happiness once more. I know he will understand what you are trying to communicate to him, and he will feel how much you care about him. I will be lighting velitas for you and Tut and hoping that whatever happens, you have the strength to go through it together, and that you will be blessed with the knowledge that you provided each other with unconditional love and understanding. We can never ask for more than that in this life, I don't think. Abrazitos (little hugs), Gabby and los gatos fregados ---------------------------------------- Date sent: Sat, 22 Aug 1998 13:55:06 -0500 (CDT) From: "Nancy A. Schmall" To: George & Nancy Copies to: Felv Subject: Re: Tut Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Nan, I'm so sorry about Tut. I know how awful it feels. Please know that you did what you could for Tut and that he knows that and loves you for it. Just be there for him--give him love and comfort. You are in my thoughts. Nancy ---------------------------------------- Date sent: Sat, 22 Aug 1998 15:02:05 -0400 To: felvtalk@MailingList.net From: three ring circuits Subject: Re: Re: Debby Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Gina....... if only you could email me some Dells....... ( sigh......) :-))) and thanks for telling me not to worry about my age.. it's true.. in my HEAD I still feel 20 yrs. old! Debby, & the HBG (the HairballGang) ---------------------------------------- Date sent: Sat, 22 Aug 1998 15:04:20 -0400 To: felvtalk@MailingList.net From: three ring circuits Subject: Re: Re: Re: Hershey's reunion Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Gina- Sounds like quite a hoodini kitty you have and now I can understand better what you were referring to! WOW! Good thing you moved from that house - sounds like too many places for her to hide and dangerous ones at that! thanks for the explanation. Debby, & the HBG (the HairballGang) ---------------------------------------- From: GinaTex@aol.com Date sent: Sat, 22 Aug 1998 20:07:14 EDT To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: Re: Re: Re: Hershey's reunion Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Debby She is definetly our sweetheart though, they all each have their own little personalties. Everyday I do that cat search though, every few hours, I even came home from work one day because I remembered that I did not see Rubin. I freaked right out, I live 2 miles from work and got home as fast as I could. He was just fine. Here it is all one floor, upstairs apartment and no acces to basement or attic for the animals. Gina ---------------------------------------- Date sent: Sun, 23 Aug 1998 00:14:49 +0200 From: Christina Marie Hayton To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Introduction Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net I thought I'd introduce myself to the list My name is Christina Hayton, and my husband and I have a very small Birman cattery here in Norway. Even though we're not hit by the FELV virus, we have had trouble with FIP. We had a kitten from our cattery die from FIP, and that's when we started testing, testing and more testing. The cats we have now here are fine with low titers, but we've gone through a few hellish months, and had to place two of our Birmans a few months ago because of their corona-titer being high. I got a phone call today that one of the girls we placed is now dead, from FIP. She was our first Birman, and a real Mommy's girl, and even though she wasn't living with us the last few months, I'm just devestated! I thought I could handle it, because I cried so much when she left us that I didn't think I had more tears left, but I just keep seeing her in my mind, and the tears keep coming. I feel so angry, because we've always tried to do everything possible for them, and it's so unfair!!! Breeders here in Scandinavia - especially here in Norway - are so afraid to talk about diseases - it's like you have the plague if one of your cats gets sick. We have decided to get as much information together about the most common diseases, to help new breeders and cat owners who don't know anything about them. It's like people don't want to take their heads out of the sand, and are afraid of their reputations...instead of being most concerned with the health of their cats. As you probably tell, this has been a very sad day for us, and I almost feel like I can't take the heartbreak of planning future litters. I know there is a future - we BELIEVE that we have something to give our precious ones, but it's so hard to see anything right now...it's all just sadness. Anyways, I was so glad today to find this list where I wouldn't feel afraid to say how sad I am, and not feel like we've done something wrong...and where people would understand. Thank you for being there! Christina Hayton Apelia's Birmans (Norway) http://www.hayton.no/apelia ---------------------------------------- From: GinaTex@aol.com Date sent: Sat, 22 Aug 1998 20:13:30 EDT To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: Introduction Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Hi Christina Welcome to the list. I loved your web site. You will find this list is full of information as well as very supportive people. Gina ---------------------------------------- Date sent: Sat, 22 Aug 1998 22:03:15 +0100 From: "Sonja Lnders" To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: Mail about Nan and Tut Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Hello Christina, Welcome! I saw and loved your website, all those lovely Birmans, and especially I liked the effect of the moving water! I am glad that all yours have tested negative and hope this is so still! You realize, of course, that most of us on this list have kitties that are FeLV + and in various stages of this dreadful condition. We are doing what we can for our little loves, but sometimes it is heartbreaking to read the mail. I too am in Europe, in Portugal to be exact, but I am from Vienna, Austria, and I have 11 cats around me! Sonja ---------------------------------------- Date sent: Sun, 23 Aug 1998 00:06:02 +0200 From: Christina Marie Hayton To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: Mail about Nan and Tut Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Hi Sonja! Thanks for your mail. Even though we're not hit by the FELV virus, we have had trouble with FIP. Yes, the cats we have now here are fine, but we've gone through a few hellish months, and had to place two of our Birmans a few months ago because of their corona-titer being high (our other cats here have OK titer levels). I got a phone call today that one of the girls we placed is now dead, from FIP. She was our first Birman, and a real Mommy's girl, and even though she wasn't living with us the last few months, I'm just devestated! I thought I could handle it, because I cried so much when she left us that I didn't think I had more tears left, but I just keep seeing her in my mind, and the tears keep coming. Breeders here in Scandinavia are so afraid to talk about diseases - it's like you have the plague if one of your cats gets sick. We have decided to get as much information together about the most common diseases, to help new breeders who don't know anything about them. It's like people don't want to take their heads out of the sand, and are afraid of their reputations...instead of being most concerned with the health of their cats. As you probably tell, this has been a very sad day for us, and I almost feel like I can't take the heartbreak of planning future litters. I know there is a future - we BELIEVE that we have something to give our precious ones, but it's so hard to see anything right now...it's all just sadness. Christina Hayton ---------------------------------------- From: "George & Nancy" To: "Felv" Subject: Tut Date sent: Sat, 22 Aug 1998 17:28:15 -0400 Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net All, Thank you for all of your advice and support! It REALLY means alot to me. Everybody doesn't understand how we feel about our babies. Some of you have suggested a blood transfussion. I have decided against it. I know it would buy us maybe a few more months but then we'd go through this all over again. I am not saying that blood transfussions are wrong or that anybody that had one was wrong. You all knew in your hearts what to do, as I know what I have to do for Tut. Tut hasn't eaten at all today. He is sleeping and laying around. I hear the clock ticking away. nan ---------------------------------------- Date sent: Sat, 22 Aug 1998 17:51:00 -0400 To: felvtalk@MailingList.net From: Angela Holderby Subject: Re: Tut Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Yes, we all reach that point. If Tut lets you know it is time, then it is. Just know that we really truly do understand the pain you are going through. In my thoughts and prayers... Angela (and Poncho & Jodi) ---------------------------------------- Date sent: Sun, 23 Aug 1998 00:02:02 +0100 From: "Sonja Lnders" To: Felvtalk Subject: Duphamun = Baypamun!!! Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Hi, all!! My German vet here to-day gave me a bottle of DUPHAMUN, saying it was exactly the same as BAYPAMUN, only from a different company and much cheaper! It is made by SOLVAY DUPHAR BV, of Weesp, Holland. I paid about USD 40/- for a bottle of 20ml, i.e.for 40 injections!! Now, maybe this is obtainable in the states, I would so wish it for you and your kitties!!!! Love, Sonja ---------------------------------------- From: "Claude Horstmann" To: Subject: Welcome Christina, Date sent: Sat, 22 Aug 1998 19:55:13 -0400 Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net I echo Sonja's thoughts on the beauty of your website.. and I also echo your sadness on the loss of a cherished pet to FIP. *there's nothing so moving not even acts of love and hate as the discovery that one is not alone* Audrey peace & light, ...marilyn... ---------------------------------------- Date sent: Sat, 22 Aug 1998 20:27:38 -0400 To: felvtalk@MailingList.net From: Angela Holderby Subject: Re: Duphamun = Baypamun!!! Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net I wasn't paying attention before. What are the laws concerning shipping this stuff??? I have a friend who lives in Holland and he may be able to get it to me. Is it legal to ship it to me from there????? Angela. ---------------------------------------- From: "Hope" To: Subject: Is euthanizing these kittens the only solution? Date sent: Sat, 22 Aug 1998 21:42:57 -0400 Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Hello all. I am somewhat new to the list. I joined because my mother is one of the founders of the Angel Animal Rescue group in Middletown, Ohio. Middletown is halfway between Dayton and Cincinnati. For the past 2 weeks she has been caring for 5 kittens that someone gave to the group. They are up to date on their shots and are very playful. She says these are the sweetest kittens she’s ever had (and that is quite a few!!) – they like to be held on their backs like babies and they give little kitty-kiss-licks on your cheeks. Two that were the most ready for adoption were taken to the vet to be tested for leukemia just so that she could tell prospective owners that they were OK. Unfortunately they both came back positive. The vet recommends putting all of them that test positive to sleep. They have never had any test positive before. My mom has heard stories of cats who are just carriers of leukemia and never get sick. She has also heard of some rescue groups and kind hearted souls who only take cats with leukemia. Are any of you out there? Can any of you point me toward one of these places? If these kitties are going to be kept alive they are going to need special, loving homes but unfortunately she doesn't have space to keep these isolated from others who are coming and going (especially since they are getting bigger and needing more room to romp). She doesn’t have computer access and thus doesn’t quite get the internet, but called me so I could ‘ask people on the internet’. I told her I would do my best. I guess the vet scheduled the first two to be put down on Tuesday (8/25) when the other 3 are going to be tested. Even if you can not help, can anyone tell me any more about leukemia, such as how to tell if a cat will only be a carrier or if it will get ill? Any knowledge I could pass along to her might make her decision a little less painful and a little more informed. I have perused the internet and thus have learned quite a bit. I saw something about maybe they should be re-tested when they are older, but she doesn't really have anywhere to keep them until then. (I believe they are currently in a cage in her foyer.) Descriptions: 1 black, 1 tuxedo, 1 gray tiger, 1 gray with an orange spot on its forehead, 1 lighter gray The tuxedo and the lighter gray one are the two that have been tested positive so far. All are ~10 weeks old except for the lighter gray one, which is likely around 5 months. (They were brought in as supposedly the same litter!) I thank you for taking the time to read this. Hope McGonigle mcgonigle.3@osu.edu You may email me and I will have her call you to set up arrangements. Please, only serious and responsible owners and organizations. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Hope McGonigle mcgonigle.3@osu.edu OSU School of Public Health http://www.geocities.com/HotSprings/Spa/2466 ---------------------------------------- From: Newtanator@aol.com Date sent: Sat, 22 Aug 1998 22:48:33 EDT To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: Is euthanizing these kittens the only solution? Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Hope, We have sent the message out to those we know in Ohio and have at least one present member in Ohio now. I am in Michigan and just took in a little boy from Lansing. I am pretty well maxed out at 19. As to testing positive. Any kitten under 12 or 13 wks can give you a false positive. They are just to young at 10 wks to be tested. Also, the ELISA is notorious for being wrong. I would urge you to have her have an IFA test done on them. And there are treatments out there that can help them live long and healthy lives. Please don't let her do anything rash until we have time to search. Unfortuately, there are many vets who just say put them down and that is not necessary. Also, many cats, given time, can beat the virus themselves. But they need time. Hang in there and tell her to give US time. barb ---------------------------------------- From: "Cheri Gardiner" To: Subject: Re: Is euthanizing these kittens the only solution? Date sent: Sat, 22 Aug 1998 20:54:59 -0600 Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Where are you at? Putting them to sleep is NOT the answer. It's just most vets know nothing about FeLV. Everyone on the list can help you. Try to get more time. Maybe if we all work together, we can find these kittens a home. I just recently took in a kitten to add to my group of three. He is FeLV and I would NEVER put him to death. He'll get some medicine and become and active an loved member of the family. Don't mean to come on so strong. It's just I lost a FeLV cat after having her for three marvelous years. I would never give up those years. Cheri G. and the four fur balls ---------------------------------------- END