Tuesday June 23, 1998 Part 1 20 Messages ======================================== Date sent: Tue, 23 Jun 1998 11:18:23 -0400 (EDT) From: Charles Klaus To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Nikita Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net My Nikita is not eating at all except what I can give him with a dropper. His mental alertness and his eyes seem brighter If he would only eat something! He has been on the interferon for 5 days now I did read that the side effects of this treatment are flu like symptoms. I know that when I had the flu I did'nt eat either I had no desire for food. I cant be sure if it is his treatment or the progression of the fel v. probably both. Do I continue the treatment for 2 more days for a total of 7 and then off it. or take him off it now for 5 days and then back on after 3-5 days Would like to hear other ideas. I have become very emotional and protective of him I have been thru this so many times in the past with other pets but it never gets any easier charlie ---------------------------------------- From: meowmama@bellsouth.net Date sent: Tue, 23 Jun 1998 13:05:04 -0400 To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: Nikita Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Charlie, My only suggestion to get Nikita eating would be to try opening a can of people tuna in water and squeezing the water out and seeing if he would lap that. Often times if you can just get them to lap up *something* it will get them back to eating again. It worked for me and hope it might work for you! Good luck! Kathy G and the 3 furries in Daytona Beach =^.^= Rusty =^.^= Smokey =^.^= Money see us at: http://cgi.gambitsys.com/homey/webdoc5.htm The Cat: Mother Nature's Masterpiece ---------------------------------------- From: "Moermond, Barbara" To: "'felvtalk@MailingList.net'" Subject: RE: Nikita Date sent: Tue, 23 Jun 1998 10:30:28 -0500 Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Well, I haven't seen any side-effects from the interferon w/my Ninja. The protocol is 7 days on, 7 days off. I have also seen once every three days (1 day on, 2 days off). There should be some information on different protocols in the archives. Is Nikita on any other medication? I don't know what you are managing to feed Nikita w/the dropper, but you might want to try baby food in his favorite flavor. That would get him good nutrition; there are also different ideas and recipes in the archives for liquified food. It is definitely good news about the improved attitude! Is he grooming at all? That is also a good sign as to how he is feeling. Take care and keep us posted!! Barb+Ninja ---------------------------------------- From: GinaTex@aol.com Date sent: Tue, 23 Jun 1998 15:45:55 EDT To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: Nikita Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Charlie When our Rubin was not eating well we tryed foods that had a very fishy smell to it he seemed to go for those, such as tuna fish, or 9 lives Tuna in sauce. There where times too that he prefered the more bland foods such as baby food or fancy feast sliced foods. We tryed everything it was a trial and error thing to get him to eat Good Luck Gina ---------------------------------------- From: "Jean Wells" To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: Nikita Date sent: Tue, 23 Jun 1998 10:46:05 PDT Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Another thing to try...it worked for me this spring when Arnie quit eating...is canned mackeral. A friend who had worked for a local vet suggested it, and it really did turn his appetite around. She said the stinkier the better. It isn't something they should live on, but if they won't eat anything else it's worth a try. good luck! jean ---------------------------------------- Date sent: Tue, 23 Jun 1998 12:00:09 +0100 To: felvtalk@MailingList.net From: BILL BEAMISH Subject: Re: Nikita Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net I just now got a chance to welcome you to the list. We all know how emotional and protective we get with the positives and it doesn't get any easier, believe me! I just do what I can and hope for the best. Eventually the virus wins out in the end and for now all I can hope for is some extra, quality time with them. Someday, though, and God, I hope its soon, we'll all be celebrating a cure for Felv with a big party at Larry's house! With cheescake! As for the Interferon, I've had my cats on the week on, week off protocol for 2 years now and I have to tell you I've never had a cat have side effects from Interferon. I don't know why. In fact, the week that they are on Interferon, they all are much better, more active and playful. I don't know about taking Nikita off Interferon now instead of giving him the full 7 days. Maybe someone else can write in with more experience with Interferon. I just read that some vets are using Interferon to boost a negative cat's immune system to fight off chronic upper respiratory infection. I have been doing that on my own with one of my negative cats who has had an URI for about 6 months now, on and off, and he is doing remarkably well. He is older and all he did was lie around wheezing and snuffling. Now, after 2 months with the Interferon, he is up and playing again and except for an occasional sneeze, he doesn't act sick at all. He's having no side effects. I don't know if the Interferon would be causing Nikita not to eat. I'd think it's the progression of the Felv. Did you try baby food meat? The chicken broth recipe from Ann? Different types of canned cat food? I'm sure other people from the list will write in with other suggestions I'm forgetting. Again, welcome to the list. I hope you can get some help from us for Nikita. Judy ---------------------------------------- Date sent: Tue, 23 Jun 1998 08:27:11 -0700 (PDT) From: diana@wetware.com (CatWoman ) To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: FeLV+ and FeLV- together (long) Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net This was probably from me. What I had said was that I would wait 3 months before having all of my currently (supposedly) negative cats re-tested after Princess leaves the house (hopefully to a new home - there's a possibility - keep your fingers crossed, folks!). It's not the virus in the atmosphere - in fact, where she is, in the bathroom, I'd probably just wash down the surfaces as soon as she is gone and consider it safe (Damn - I hope so! She strops around my ankles, and I have only the ability to wash them with water before the others are stropping in the same place). However, the *incubation* of the virus is still not fully known - but my vet says that the current idea is that if the cat has been out of contact with a known positive for 3 months, and is still negative, then she is fairly confident the cat did not pick up the virus. She's also recommending another testing 3 months later, btw - so it's still not a sure thing. Diana ---------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 23 Jun 1998 11:09:18 -0400 To: felvtalk@MailingList.net From: three ring circuits Subject: RE: Introducing myself, my kitties, and why I'm here ! Reply-To: felvtalk@MailingList.net I figured no time is as good as the present... so I wanted to introduce myself and a big thank you to Kathy G. for telling me about this list! I'm currently owned by 4 cats - 2 -11yr. old Birmans ( brother and sister ) and 2 -2 1/2yr. old Ragdolls ( sisters ). What's brought me to this list is as follows: Last Sept. I adopted from our local shelter an adorable 4 mos old.red &white longhaired male kitty who very quickly settled in as if he'd always been here and became the love of everyone here - hoomins that is! To be honest, NONE of my other cats ever accepted him! All was going along smoothly and at 6 mos. old he was neutered. Then... about 6 wks. later I noticed a change... he was suddenly MUCH less playful, ate MUCH less( really just picked at his food ) and spent most of the day in one spot sleeping. At first I brushed it off, thinking it was just due to him maturing and recently being neutered but my nerves got the best of me and I took him into our vet's "just to be sure" -never really dreaming there was anything seriously wrong with him. Well, he had a temp. of 104 and his tummy was FILLED with fluid. Many tests later and a liver biopsy as well, it was determined he had FIP and we helped him tearfully to the Bridge in early Feb. I then got to work scrubbing out all the litterboxes with boiling hot water and clorox, threw out his scratching post and toys and locked up the room he'd been isolated in the last few weeks after scrubbing it too with disinfectant and washing the carpeting twice with clorox as well.This room was off limits to all other cats for a full 3 mos. Five months have passed and all my other four remaining kitties appear fine and so I decided it was time to get another kitten. However, my vet suggested I have the new FIP Elisa test done JUST TO MAKE SURE that everyone here was in fact negative. We just got the results back and much to my SHOCK..... one of my cats ( the male Birman ) tested positive whereas everyone else was negative! Hershey is now isolated and I have to wait another month and then re-test him and all the others. If the others are still negative, I've been told I can assume they're fine. Of course, I'm hoping Hershey's numbers will have come down by then or at best, he'll be negative as well. I'm still in shock and wondering if anyone else out there has run into a similar situation having just had their cats tested with this new FIP Elisa test. Also....... I'm wondering how accurate the test it... does this really mean I should hold off getting another cat until hopefully ALL test negative , etc. I've been told that JUST because Hershey tested positive ( and his test was on the low side at 1:80 ) it doesnt' mean he'll ever get sick or develop FIP... but... I'm still a nervous wreck. Thanks to anyone who can give me some advice and I'm sorry for making this such a l-o-n-g introduction! :-) Debby, & the HBG (the HairballGang) ---------------------------------------- From: katseven@pcsia.com Date sent: Tue, 23 Jun 1998 12:00:32 -0600 Subject: RE: Introducing myself, my kitties, and why I'm h To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Hi Debby, Welcome to the group. Your vet gave Hershey the brand new (Feb.'98) FIP test which is specific for the FIP coronavirus? (The old test just showed whether or not your cat had been exposed to any coronavirus--most of which are not fatal.) My understanding is that the only research done on this new test is either very preliminary or else it's just been done by the company marketing the test (I have the company write up on the test; it's attached). Even if Hershey has been exposed to FIP, that doesn't mean he'll come down w/ it. Just a month or so ago, a woman on another list I'm on had this new FIP test done on her cat. The cat also had low titer-positive for FIP. She just had her cat tested again and now he's negative. The trouble w/ getting a kitten if you have an FIP carrier is that his/her immune system is weaker than an adult's. I believe that's why kittens are frequently the victims of this disease. If it were me, I'd wait for a while, have Hershey tested again, and go from there. For Hershey, I'd get him on some quality food (if he's not already) and supplement his diet. I've heard that Vit. C crystals and (I've been told) Echinacea (as a liquid med--have to use a syringe because it tastes nasty) are good immune builders. Other folks can give you other ideas. Some have found Ambrotose to be useful. Since I believe fatal FIP is a relatively rare disease, I'm betting Hershey will be fine. I'm so sorry to hear about your loss; it sounds like you gave that kitty a good home Susan ---------------------------------------- Date sent: Tue, 23 Jun 1998 12:45:32 -0400 To: felvtalk@MailingList.net From: three ring circuits Subject: RE: Introducing myself, my kitties, and why I'm h Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Susan- First of all, thank you SO much for welcoming me to the list ( I wasn't really sure we *belonged * here as our problem is FIP not FIV! ) Also... many many thanks for the attachment which I'd never seen before! I've printed it out to read again and digest better. yes... this is the test that Hershey had - the Elisa one... and yes... I intend to have it repeated in a month - hopefully to find that his numbers have come down. As I may have told you. he tested at 1:80 this past time. I too had heard about giving Echinachea to boost the immune system but don't know WHERE to find the liquid variety ( I only found capsules ) or HOW MUCH to give. If anyone has this info. I'd greatly appreciate it! Thanks again for your help !! :-) Debby, & the HBG (the HairballGang) ---------------------------------------- From: meowmama@bellsouth.net Date sent: Tue, 23 Jun 1998 12:55:50 -0400 To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: Introducing myself, my kitties, and why I'm here ! Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Hi Debby and welcome!!! Judy? Jim? and anyone else with FIP experience, can you jump in here and help Debby? Thanks. -- Kathy G and the 3 furries in Daytona Beach =^.^= Rusty =^.^= Smokey =^.^= Money see us at: http://cgi.gambitsys.com/homey/webdoc5.htm The Cat: Mother Nature's Masterpiece ---------------------------------------- From: GinaTex@aol.com Date sent: Tue, 23 Jun 1998 17:12:50 EDT To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: From Chile Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Hi Paula Glad to hear that Benito is doing great. Yes kittens are like tornados, our 2 was running wild this am they are still young 14 months old. With the amount of energy that Benito has I would feed him a bit more than that he is probaly burning off all that he eats. All of our cats eat their dry food ad-lib. If they are taught young, they will only eat the amount that their body needs and not eat it all in one sitting. They tend to eat less in the heat and more in the cold. Well Good Luck Gina ---------------------------------------- From: "James G. Wilson" To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Date sent: Tue, 23 Jun 1998 17:15:27 +0000 Subject: Updated archives Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Hey all, Well, thanks to Barb M., I have converted and restored the archives for this month. They are now all there except for June 4th. I even corrected a link problem with many of the archives in that directory- it had made most of them inaccessible. Does anyone have any ideas on making the chat room better and easier to use? I've checked in a few times, and it seems that there's too much confusion about it. I think the best way to take advantage of it is to set up regular meeting times for groups of folks to meet and talk. Let me know what y'all think, and we'll try to coordinate things. Take care, and best wishes to all. In loving memory of Vyvyan: March 20, 1988 - August 15, 1997 James G. Wilson- phaedrus@npwt.net http://www.angelfire.com/il/felv/ http://www.geocities.com/HotSprings/Spa/8025/ http://www.fortunecity.com//skyscraper/sterling/20/niu.html ---------------------------------------- From: Newtanator@aol.com Date sent: Tue, 23 Jun 1998 17:19:46 EDT To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: Introducing myself, my kitties, and why I'm here ! Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Debbie, Welcome to the group. First, don't panic. We, who have been thru this with FeLV have learned all that does is age you, really, really fast. I think we need to do some research on this new FIP test. My vet has heard about it, doesn't think much of it and the ELISA that has been out for years for the FeLV and FIV virus is wrong 30% of the time. I personally will withhold judgement on it, but I wouldn't be that concerned,esp if he is on the high side of normal. (I'm not sure what the standard norms are for this test.) The problem is, FIP is caused by the coronavirus. There are about a dozen or more of them and only ONE causes FIP. So, is the test picking up antibodies for the other 11 or so? I just don't know. A vet scared my son half to death telling him his kitten had it based on some test, (I don't know for sure which one, but I think he was looking at serum protein) then called him back a few hours later and said, nevermind, she doesn't have it. So, let's all find out what we can about this test and how reliable it is, and what exactly it is looking for in the test. Will get back to you, barb ---------------------------------------- From: Newtanator@aol.com Date sent: Tue, 23 Jun 1998 17:24:22 EDT To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: Introducing myself, my kitties, and why I'm h Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Deb, Me again. Will read with great interest the info on the new test. Also will check with Cornell to see what they think of it. AND, we welcome all cat lovers to the list. Even those with healthy cats. My own brother, the lurker, has 13 healthy ones. And all of mine are healthy, but I do have 2 that are FeLV positive. take care barb ---------------------------------------- From: Newtanator@aol.com Date sent: Tue, 23 Jun 1998 17:29:12 EDT To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: From Chile Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Paula, Welcome back. And great news about Benito. We LOVE good news, keep it coming. barb ---------------------------------------- From: Newtanator@aol.com Date sent: Tue, 23 Jun 1998 17:36:48 EDT To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Cornell on FIP Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net All, just cruised the Cornell site on FIP. They do mention the two new tests, but didn't seem to excited about them, but that they show promise. It is easier to give you the site then to try and remember everything they said. http://web.vet.cornell.edu/Public/FHC/fip.htm barb ---------------------------------------- From: "Moermond, Barbara" To: "'felvtalk@MailingList.net'" Subject: RE: Introducing myself, my kitties, and why I'm h Date sent: Tue, 23 Jun 1998 12:59:10 -0500 Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Hi there Debby! You should be able to get liquid echinacea at a pharmacy that also has holistic medicines or at a health food store. There are 2 kinds generally: one which is alcohol based (extremely nasty tasting) and one which is glycerin based (nasty, but nothing like the other). I would try to find the glycerin based one! As for dosage, I recently read on the list that w/holistic remedies, the dosage should be about one tenth of the human dosage (going by average body weight). There is also a holistic vet med page; http://www.altvetmed.com There is a lot of information there as well. Good luck! Barb+Ninja ---------------------------------------- From: "zimmerman" To: Subject: Re: Nikita Date sent: Tue, 23 Jun 1998 14:07:11 -0400 Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Charlie, Make sure the baby food you give him has NO onion powder. Warming the food a little (mouse temp.) might make him eat, & as said before , the smellier the better. Maybe your vet can give him some Vit. B-12 to stimulate his appetite. There's also high calorie liquids or pastes you can get from your vet or a pet store. The paste you can put on his front arm & hopefully he'll lick it off. Beth ---------------------------------------- Date sent: Tue, 23 Jun 1998 14:12:15 -0400 To: felvtalk@MailingList.net From: Angela Holderby Subject: Re: Nikita Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net I agree. Lefty is very picky...only wants crunchy dry food. When he stopped eating he would lick the gravy off the canned cat dinners and that was all. I spent a whole day making the super duper chicken broth and he looked at me like "yeah, right..." and walked away. My dogs loved it. I bought chicken livers--tried raw and cooked. Dogs loved it. I tried every variation of chicken, turkey and tuna imaginable...dogs ate well that week. Finally, just because it was the only can I hadn't opened, I tried a can of white chunk chicken that I had bought for chicken salad and thought it smelled nasty. Lefty loved it. He ate about half of it, then ended up throwing it up in the car on the way to the vet--unexpected trip. But, he did eat it. Bottom line is...nothing works for every cat. You are just going to have to do the trial and error thing. This list is great for supplying different options though so if you haven't offered canned chicken...maybe it will work. I wish you luck. I was so frustrated when Lefty was losing weight (he is beginning to again). I also found that he was more accepting of things I was eating and things that were hand fed..but then I have very spoiled babies!!!!!! (No apologies there!!!) Luck to you and Nikita. Angela. (and Poncho & Lefty) ---------------------------------------- END