Thursday May 28, 1998 28 Messages ====================================== From: AskforArt@aol.com Date sent: Thu, 28 May 1998 01:23:29 EDT To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Smail mail Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Angela, Greg, Lynn, and Cheri -- I mailed your packages on Tuesday via Priority mail. James and Saliha I mailed your packages Wednesday via Priority mail. Kat and Steve, yours will go out tomorrow. Linda P -------------------------------------- Date sent: Wed, 27 May 1998 22:07:59 -0700 From: Robert Frank Organization: A.R.F., Inc. To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: stuff Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Dear Larry: A lot of wisdom in what you say. I've benefited personally from clinical cancer trials. That's why I'm here today and able to hold my Howling Kitty in my lap and talk to all you wonderful people! If not for trial and error part of medicine, I would have been dead at age 39 from advanced breast cancer. I thank God for giving me an iron will, a hard head, a wonderful family, and great kitties!!! Sometimes, sticking our necks out is the only way to find a cure. Keep up the good work. Arlene and Howling Kitty -------------------------------------- From: "zimmerman" To: Subject: Angela Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 01:39:13 -0400 Reply-to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Angela, I thank God I found the treatments, too. I read in a newspaper artical that it's difficult to find good medical advice on the Internet because the Web sites are "about 90% 'Jerry Springer' & 10% 'Masterpiece Theater' " & there's no TV Guide to tell you which one it is. It was about human health advice , but probably applies to pet health too. Aren't we grateful we quickly found "James Wilson's Masterpiece Theater"?:) Beth -------------------------------------- From: Paula Lazo To: "'Felv Talk List'" Subject: Food price Date sent: Thu, 28 May 1998 11:57:13 -0400 Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Just out of curiosity, how much does cat food cost in the US. Here the Iams bag I bought Lucky is around U$25 the 6 lbs bag (3 kilos). I've been in the US several times but only one as a cat caretaker, and I was amazed at the price of litter sand, here's U$20 (average). PL -------------------------------------- Date sent: Thu, 28 May 1998 13:28:02 +0100 To: felvtalk@MailingList.net From: BILL BEAMISH Subject: Re: Food price Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Paula, Because we use so much dry food and litter, we have it delivered to our house from a pet food distributor. I pay 24.43 for a 20 lb. bag of Iams Lamb & Rice dry food and 3.29 for a 25 lb. bag of regular clay cat litter. But we get a cheaper price than retail pet stores in the area because we get such a large order - we usually get 1,500 lb. of litter and 160 - 200 lb. of food delivered once a month. It does seem like you a paying a LOT more than in the U.S. though! Judy -------------------------------------- Date sent: Thu, 28 May 1998 15:10:04 +0100 To: felvtalk@MailingList.net From: BILL BEAMISH Subject: FIV Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Nancy, Please don't say you're sorry you put me through all the trouble! It was no trouble - I love researching things on the computer! In fact, that's where you'll find me, when I'm not caring for the cats or taking my kids somewhere! It really is strange that I've never had a FIV positive cat "catch" leukemia from one of my Felv positive cats. You would think they would be more likely to get it, considering their already weak immune systems. I do retest periodically so I know the status of my cats and if one gets sick and has to go in to the vet, I routinely retest then so we know if we're dealing with a combination disease. So far, I've been very lucky, I guess. Neither disease has been passed from one to the other. Actually, in all the years of caring for these cats, I've never had a FIV positive cat give FIV to a Felv positive cat and that's even more strange, considering there is no vaccine for FIV to protect the Felv cats! From that, I'd have to deduct that FIV is not that contagious, even in close contact. Anyway, good luck with Jake. Overall, my FIV positive cats do better than my Felv positive cats. The main problem I have with them are gum infections and that can be very serious. I try to keep a step ahead and get their teeth cleaned a couple times a year to try to prevent problems. Judy -------------------------------------- Date sent: Thu, 28 May 1998 09:11:02 -0500 (CDT) From: "Nancy A. Schmall" To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: stuff Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Amen! I agree with Barb. nancy -------------------------------------- Date sent: Thu, 28 May 1998 09:21:52 -0500 (CDT) From: "Nancy A. Schmall" To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: Felv vaccine for FIV cats Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Judy, I'm so sorry you spent so much time looking for the information--I didn't mean to put you through that. I agree with what you're saying. Neither Jake nor Panther tested positive for FELV even though exposed over time to 3 of my cats who were positive. It's almost hard for me to believe, but I really think the vaccine protected them even though their immune systems were compromised by the FIV (unless, of course, the FELV is in their bone marrow). I appreciate the time you've given this, Judy, and your opinion on the subject. Thanks, Nancy -------------------------------------- Date sent: Thu, 28 May 1998 09:33:32 -0500 (CDT) From: "Nancy A. Schmall" To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: stuff Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net You go, James, and Barb, and Larry! I agree; hopefully, we caretakers can gauge for ourselves what seems to be working and what doesn't. Jake hated going to the vet, but in my heart I knew that Immunoregulin had worked before for one of my FELV+ cats and when discontinued (because of the advice of a former vet) she developed lymposarcoma. I told Jake I needed to try and help him and eventually if I noticed the trip was too stressful, I would discontinue it. I also added, that trips would eventually be down to once monthly. After a few times, he settled down (I helped by cushioning his carrier in a thick blanket to make the ride smoother and bought him a purr pad). In my heart, he's accepted the trips and he knows he feels a lot better because of my efforts. If I would have known then what I know now about my sweet Panther, I would have started him on the Immunoregulin also even though he hated going to the vet. I truly believe in my heart of hearts, he would have accepted the trips in time also. Sometimes I think, we as cat caretakers, transfer our vibes to our companions and if we are firm in our convictions or beliefs, our non-human friends pick this up also. Just my 2 cents worth . . . Nancy -------------------------------------- Date sent: Thu, 28 May 1998 09:35:11 -0500 (CDT) From: "Nancy A. Schmall" To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: stuff Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Angela, you go girl! Nancy -------------------------------------- From: Paula Lazo To: "'Felv Talk List'" Subject: Lucky's food Date sent: Thu, 28 May 1998 11:53:12 -0400 Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Thank you guys, I'm not running the risk of infecting Garrita with the virus. I'll get her a new bag, although as some of you told me the virus doesn't live for long outside the cat's body. Does anyone know about the FIP virus?, because Garrita was exposed to that one too, we didn't know Mancha had it and by that time they shared the same food, it was the same plastic container with 2 plates but sometimes they'd switch. I'm so terrified now, as I told you here in Chile information about these viruses is hard to find, usually vets tell you that your cat might be infected but since there are no vaccines nor treatments the only thing you can do is cross your fingers your cat won't get sick. I don't mean to sound too repetitive but the more I read about these viruses and what you people can and are doing for your kitties the more frustrated I get. I really hope things improve here, I don't know if I told you but the Felv vaccine is in Chile but it's been kept in the Institute of Public Health for 6 months now waiting to be approved, in the meantime more kitties are getting the virus. PL -------------------------------------- Date sent: Thu, 28 May 1998 12:30:43 -0400 To: felvtalk@MailingList.net From: Angela Holderby Subject: Re: Food price Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net I just purchased a bag of Iams Lamb & Rice formula. I think it was about a 6 or 8 lb. bag (not sure) but it was $13.00. At the vet, I bought an 8 lb. bag of Science Diet that was $16.00, but at the pet stores and larger vet clinics, it is a lot more. Angela. -------------------------------------- From: katseven@pcsia.com Date sent: Thu, 28 May 1998 11:52:26 -0600 Subject: RE: Food, litter and FIP To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Hi, Paula, I just saw your messages. I'm sure you'll get lots of responses but I wanted to give you a little feedback. For both food and litter, it seems like you are paying close to two times the cost in the larger US cities --I wonder if it would be cheaper to direct order from the company. (I don't even know if that's possible outside the country.) I pay about $25 for a 20 pound bag of premium cat food (like Iams but a different brand--Nutro MaxCat). I pay $16 for a 50 pound bag of high quality, clumping litter. Of course, the smaller the quantity you buy, the more cost per unit. As for FIP, I am terrified of the disease, too, and have been doing some research on it since even though it is very rare for an adult cat to come down w/ FIP, it is more common in multicat households and just recently some of my nine cats have started sneezing and showing their nictating eyelids. Here are some good sites: http://web.vet.cornell.edu/public/fhc/felinehealth.html http://www.vetinfo.com/cfip.html http://www.tezcat.com/~ermiller/FIP.shtml I think it is disgraceful that you don't even have vaccines available. I hope you are doing well, Paula. Susan -------------------------------------- From: "Moermond, Barbara" To: "'felvtalk@MailingList.net'" Subject: RE: Ninja's weekend Date sent: Thu, 28 May 1998 14:06:29 -0500 Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Barb, I have discussed this with my vet and with the neurologist at the UW-Vet School and because we don't know for sure that it is a meningioma (I can't afford the MRI) even though she's responding to the pred., and her heart murmur (I also can't afford an ultrasound to check the condition of her heart other than the murmur), we think that something like phenobarb wouldn't necessarily help her because of the danger of seizures with missed or late doses (Ninja doesn't always cooperate with the pill shooter and eats around pills in tuna). She has been fine since Sunday morning, not even a hint at a seizure or feeling sick. Of course, we had a bad thunderstorm early this morning and she got scared, but she just came back to bed and sat with me. I am going to talk to my vet again tomorrow (today's her day off) so I'll ask her about some other options, even if it's just going to prednisolone instead of the prednisone. Thanks for the input!! Barb+Ninja -------------------------------------- From: "Moermond, Barbara" To: "'felvtalk@MailingList.net'" Subject: RE: Ninja's weekend Date sent: Thu, 28 May 1998 14:23:37 -0500 Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Hi Kelly! I know it could be serious, but I think that she pees in these other places because she can smell that she's peed there before. It's always on blankets or quilts or throws that I use in the living room. She had a bladder infection last summer and even though I have washed everything with lots of baking soda and kitty urine deodorizer (Nature's Miracle - w/ enzymes to neutralize the stink and citrus so she won't pee there again) and *I* can't smell anything, I'm sure that she probably can. I've washed everything again and I just haven't left those things where she'll pee on them. I was worried on Tuesday though, because she had peed on her chair and was curled up sleeping there. I had a wool blanket folded up and a folded sheet on top of that in the chair and she would sleep there and when I came home, I could smell that she'd gone in the living room and when I saw where, I was amazed that she was curled up right next to it. I am going to talk to the vet about it ( and a few other things) tomorrow because that doesn't seem normal to me. (When I spoke with her on Tuesday, she said it could be another infection even though she doesn't have the classic symptoms.) We all know how fastidious our little babies are and that it isn't a good sign when they don't bathe. Ninja came out on the balcony yesterday and helped me re-pot some plants. I am so much more relaxed out there with her since I put the netting up and I am sure that she can sense that. This morning there was a bad thunderstorm and she was sitting by her food and when I said her name she just mewed like she was asking if I was OK and if it was OK if she came back to bed because she was scared. Of course I told her it was fine and asked her to come back and she just came running! Then she wanted some of my blueberry muffin, but she wouldn't eat any of it when offered. I'll let the list know what the vet says tomorrow on this and other topics. Thanks for the input!! Barb+Ninja -------------------------------------- From: Newtanator@aol.com Date sent: Thu, 28 May 1998 20:29:52 EDT To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: stuff Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Arlene, Howling Kitty and I are both very glad you are still here. barb -------------------------------------- From: Newtanator@aol.com Date sent: Thu, 28 May 1998 20:41:37 EDT To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: stuff Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Angela, This is the place to put your mind at ease. We all have had to come to grips with the fact that we do the best we can and that is all we can do. The bond that holds us together is our love of our cats and our desire to make them as happy and healthy for as long as we can. Your Lefty and Lynn's Stinker are two perfect examples of cats that were in bad shape and this list has helped extend their lives and time with you. I remember one where her only hope we to keep her cat with her until after Christmas. And she did and then some. Sadly, her cat lost the battle in the end but she cherished the time extra she had and that is what we are about. barb -------------------------------------- From: Newtanator@aol.com Date sent: Thu, 28 May 1998 21:00:44 EDT To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: stuff Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Nancy, My Ariel never was crazy about the ride there, but she loved it once there! She purred and cood at the office girls and they loved to see her. She demanded to let out of the carrier so she could visit with all them. She would walk up and down the counter saying hello to all of them until it was her turn. Tho she may not be the norm, the visits didn't seem to stess her at all. barb ps. she is still as sweet as the day is long and fat and sassy and LOVES kids after..going on two years now. -------------------------------------- Date sent: Thu, 28 May 1998 22:06:59 +0100 To: felvtalk@MailingList.net From: BILL BEAMISH Subject: Anesthesia Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Nancy, My vet uses Iso Florane anesthetic on my cats. Apparently that type of anesthetic doesn't take as much out of them as other types, at least that's what I was told. It only knocks them out for as long as the surgery takes and he wakes them up immediately after and within a very short time they look and act normal - not groggy or sleepy at all. I've had only one incident with this anesthetic and that involved one of the only 2 female cats I ever had who tested positive for FIV. Carmel had problems from the moment I got her. Her gums were inflamed and infected constantly. Just cleaning her teeth wasn't helping for long so my vet suggested scraping her gums. I really had no choice. She couldn't even eat - her gums hurt so bad. When they gave her the anesthetic and began the surgery, she had a reaction to the anesthetic. Her throat swelled shut and her heart stopped. They revived her but she never was the same. Two months after this incident, I found she had died in her sleep one night. I believe her heart was damaged when they revived her and it just stopped again a few months later. I worry every time any of my cats has to have anesthetic, even the negative ones, thinking this could happen to any one of them. But I know how life threatening gum disease can be for FIV positive cats so I HAVE to get their teeth cleaned often. Does your vet think the stress of the anesthetic put Panther over the edge? I guess that could happen. I'm so sorry it happened with Panther. You know, I was following his progress all that weekend he was sick and I'm an optimist (I HAVE to be to do what I'm doing!) so I really thought he'd pull through. When I read your post that he didn't make it, my heart just fell to my feet. I felt so bad for you and him. Being an optimist also sets you up for big falls! Anyway, that's how I view anesthesia - it's a necessary evil. Judy -------------------------------------- From: Newtanator@aol.com Date sent: Thu, 28 May 1998 21:10:41 EDT To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: Ninja's weekend Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Barb, Keep us informed on how Ninja is doing. The murmer may just be that and nothing to worry about. A murmur is often just caused by a valve in the heart that doesn't close shut as it should and some blood flows back into the chamber it was leaving. It makes a whooshing sound. There are only two other things I can think of that might cause that. An enlarged heart, which would show up on an xray and heartworm. While heartworm is becoming more common in cats, it's usually the outside cats that are exposed to mosquitoes. As to the MRI, I was faced with the same problem with my Merlin, but for different reasons. He was just to sick to be sedated for it and they have to be. They have to be still. So I did not have any tests done. Even if a brain tumor had been found, what could have done about it? Prob nothing. So I let the chips fall where they may. As I said, there are no easy choices for us. If the Pred is working, then you may have to leave him on it. One problem is just as bad the other, FeLV or constant seizures. The important thing is make him comfortable and happy. barb -------------------------------------- From: GinaTex@aol.com Date sent: Thu, 28 May 1998 22:16:19 EDT To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: Ninja's weekend Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Barb How is Ninja doing now? Hope she is better Our thoughts are with you Gina and JoAnn and the four characters Sophia, Zachary, Patrick, and Elizabeth -------------------------------------- From: GinaTex@aol.com Date sent: Thu, 28 May 1998 22:29:38 EDT To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: Scanner Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Hi Susan I need help in knowing how to post a picture in the web i am totally lost. I have a scanner and would very much like to post Rubins Picture If you or someone could e-mail me privately on what to do it would be greatly appreciated I do not know if it matters but my computer is a powermac Thanks Gina and JoAnn -------------------------------------- From: GinaTex@aol.com Date sent: Thu, 28 May 1998 22:46:28 EDT To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Our loved ones Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Thankyou all for your letters of support. The last few days have been rough on us here, but we are taking comfort in knowing that Rubin is no longer suffering and that he is joined by many friends there at the Rainbow Bridge. Esp. his best dog pal Sheekela who passed there 3 1/2 years ago. Our best goes out to Panther, Lucky, Paige, and Kettainya who has joined Rubin, we know that they are all there playing together. Our other cats are doing well, the only one that seems to be affected by Rubins passing is Zachary he has been looking for him and is getting a little depressed. We are having Rubin cremated so they other ones did not get to see him after but we feel they know anyways. Again thanks Gina and JoAnn plus Sophia, Zachary, Patrick, and Elizabeth and the dogs Caroline & Lilian -------------------------------------- Date sent: Thu, 28 May 1998 17:59:09 -0500 (CDT) From: "Nancy A. Schmall" To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: FIV Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Judy, I too love to research on the net. Another question I have: you mentioned you get the FIV cats' teeth cleaned regularly. That interested me because of the anesthesia used. My vet believes we shoved Panther over the edge because of the anesthesia used in removing the suspicious lymph node. After I learned that, I thought "no more anesthesia." I just wanted to learn you opinion regarding anesthesia. Nancy -------------------------------------- From: Paula Lazo To: "'Felv Talk List'" Subject: Food and litter Date sent: Thu, 28 May 1998 19:19:45 -0400 Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net I knew it, Chile is an expensive country regarding pet care, though I think vets might be cheaper ($20 a visit). I almost died when I saw the regular price you people pay, especially cat litter, because I mean it's litter!! In my last trip to the US I bought Lucky canned food and toys and treats I wanted to take the litter but on my dad's advice I was "too crazy". Hopefully the market here is expanding and we're getting the same products you have (though not the price) at least people that can afford it are feeding their pets with premium food. Thanks for the info Cat people are my people Paula -------------------------------------- Date sent: Thu, 28 May 1998 20:37:57 -0500 (CDT) From: "Nancy A. Schmall" To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: stuff Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Barb, That's great to hear about Ariel! nancy -------------------------------------- Date sent: Thu, 28 May 1998 22:40:03 -0700 From: Robert Frank Organization: A.R.F., Inc. To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: stuff Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Dear Angela: You don't post too much! What a wonderful lady and kitty mom you are. Love to you! Arlene and Howling Kitty -------------------------------------- From: katseven@pcsia.com Date sent: Thu, 28 May 1998 22:29:48 -0600 Subject: Re: Rubin's photo To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Hi, Gina (& JoAnn), To get Rubin's photo on the tribute page at http://www.corax.com/feline/remember.html just send the photo file as an attachment to your message to RDC. (This is how I did it, anyway.) RDC is the one who actually puts the photo on the website as I understand it. Her current e-mail address is at the site; just scroll down past the memorials. I wouldn't know how to send a message w/ an attachment on someone else's computer, but others might be able to tell you. I wish I could be of more help. I know you've had a rough week. As you said, I think the other animals do sense when one of them passes away, too, or they at least seem to understand when we grieve so deeply. The surviving animals were for me the greatest comfort. Their simple presence and desire to be with me helped the most. Best, Susan -------------------------------------- END