Sunday May 24, 1998 16 Messages ====================================== From: WORKPARK Date sent: Sun, 24 May 1998 03:20:56 EDT To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: Stinker attacks again!......... Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Lynn, It might be worthwhile for you to talk to an animal behaviorist. Is there one in your area? I know my vet here knows of some locally, maybe yours will there. Good luck. Pam -------------------------------------- From: Newtanator Date sent: Sun, 24 May 1998 10:53:27 EDT To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: Angela..........Stinker Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Lynn, I forgot to mention the time delay with antidepressants. In humans, they take, generally, 2-3 wks to see results. How they work in cats, I have no idea. Acute depression is usually caused by a chemical imbalance. Someone acutely depressed is not usually agressive, they don't even have the energy to do themselves harm. It's when the med kicks in you have to worry. So it may take a while for you to see any results from the Elavil. I saw a show on tv where they did a report on Prozac in animals. It seemed to work fairly well, but it was used on extreme cases where dogs would chew holes in themselves or carry sticks around to the point they didn't put it down to eat. Stinker just seems to have rare, momentary flashes. very puzzling. barb -------------------------------------- From: AskforArt Date sent: Sun, 24 May 1998 11:16:59 EDT To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: Angela..........Stinker Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Lynn--a few years ago I read about a new product for cats...soft covers that are glued on to their nails to prevent them from clawing furniture. They stay on the cat's nails until the nail is shed. I think pet groomers apply them. Might be worth checking out. Linda P -------------------------------------- Date sent: Sun, 24 May 1998 09:31:32 -0500 To: felvtalk@MailingList.net From: Melanie Moore Subject: Re: Angela..........Stinker Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net I believe you mentioned in another post that the antidepressant you're giving Stinker is Elavil. My aggressive cat, Callie, is on it, and has been for just over a month now. It's taken this long to see much effect, and it's not a huge improvement. On the other hand, I know someone who has her cat on it because he's stressed and developing bladder infections, and it mellowed him out very quickly. Just wanted you to know there may be some quick response and there may not. I certainly hope it helps and quickly. Another thing you might consider with his nails is those softpaw things you apply to the nails (or your vet's office might apply for you, or they may clip his nails if you don't feel you can - a friend of mine takes one of hers for that). Melanie -------------------------------------- From: "Claude Horstmann" To: Subject: elavil Date: Sun, 24 May 1998 11:44:01 -0400 Reply-to: felvtalk@MailingList.net barb and lynn-- consider the possibility that the Elavil is also being used to eliminate pain, which may be the under lying cause for Stinker's behavior. I know a dose at hour sleep is therapy for chronic pain. His inability to respond to soft talk and gentle touch may be symptomatic of something else pushing his behavioral buttons. It's worth mentioning here. .marilyn. -------------------------------------- From: Newtanator Date sent: Sun, 24 May 1998 13:21:45 EDT To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: elavil Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Marilyn, Hadn't heard of Elavil being used for pain, but then, they use these drugs for something new all the time. I'll have to remember that for my home care patients who are usually depressed because of chronic pain! Thanks, barb -------------------------------------- From: "Steve Lackow" To: Subject: Re: elavil Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 13:01:13 -0700 Reply-to: felvtalk@MailingList.net When we were still fighting the fight with Selena and Chloe, a light bulb went off when I saw you mention depression frequently to describe Selena. Certainly, Chloe had anorexia, and wouldn't eat and would get more anemic, and depressed. But it never occurred to me for some odd reason to treat these conditions as you would in people. It has now. Like AIDS patients, and those with other terminal illness and with wasting syndromes like anorexia , our cats can become depressed and it worsens their physical condition. Many of the same drugs used for such human patients may help our cats, too. I have seen on MEDLINE that not only elavil and valium, but prozac and medical marijuana have been approved by the FDA for use in people with AIDS and anorexia and that there is clinical success with all of these drugs. So why not use them in cat-adjusted dosages to combat FeLV, if there isn't anything in their structure that makes them toxic to cats? Duh. -- Steve -------------------------------------- From: "Steve Lackow" To: "FeLV Talk" Subject: LONG: Taking A Shot With Immunoregulin Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 14:19:26 -0700 Reply-to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Since I usually defer to Jim and Barb on issues pertaining to immunoregulin usage, I want to make it clear that this is because I have no personal experience with the drug, however I do indeed have reservations about it. There is good anecdotal evidence, not the least of which comes from Barb and others on the list and from other sources other than its manufacturer, that immunoregulin helps in FeLV cases by stimulating the immune system to defeat the acne bacterium that is "immunoregulin", . There was also a piece in Semin Vet Med Surg (Small Anim) 1997 Aug;12(3):186-92 NLM CIT. ID: 97428858 that documents its extra-label use in cats, and there are many mentions of this bacterium with reference to immunology in the medical literature, which by the way anyone can now access online through Inernet Grateful Med at http://igm-01.nlm.nih.gov/index.html My own vets did not recommend immunoregulin, nor does Dr. Mike Richards who developed the Cat Info website at http://www.vetinfo.com/catindex.html . They all say that immunoregulin bombed in clinical stuides, though I can't find support for that, and my new vet says it has bombed in his own practice. Two of the three vets I've used over the past year did prescribe interferon, as does Mike Richards -- one enthusiastically, one not, and the new vet does not believe interferon works.. (There has been very little clinical success with low dose oral interferon, either, but there has been some and a lot of word of mouth among vets and cat people.) Dr. Karen Thomas, whose experience you can access from Jim's website, says that imunoregulin has helped hundreds of her dog (immunoregulin is still "officially" for horses and dogs) and cat patients. My only concern with immunoregulin, and it is a serious one, has to do with its protocol. For this and other reasons, I wish that more caregivers to cats would educate themselves on how to give injections so that it does not seem so threatening. We also need to talk about it as if it were not so scary, because so many cats are put to sleep when their caregivers hear that kitty will need IV injections or even sub-cus. It's really no big whup, ask your vet or have someone who asked their vet (or a FRIENDLY nurse) show you how . At any rate, the immunoregulin IV injections are needed frequently initially and then taper off. If you don't learn how to do the injections at home, you're looking at a not-insignificant expense, and more significant stress -- for you and the cat. This kind of stress an FeLV kitty does not need. Nor the already-stressed owner. So, if you want to give immunoregulin a shot, learn how to give a shot, period. That's my take. I'm sorry if anyone thought I was putting down this therapy out-of-hand. Whether it's right for your cat is up to to the cat, you and your vet. -------------------------------------- From: Newtanator Date sent: Sun, 24 May 1998 17:00:50 EDT To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: elavil Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net I don't know if any actual research as to the effects of some of these anti- depressant or anti-anxiety drugs has been done on cats. I know my Sagan got Valium, once, and he nearly died from it. I had them put in red letters on his record he was to never get it again. But I know they use it often. With the tranquilzer type of drugs, if there is going to be a problem, you will prob see it almost right away, as I did with Sagan. Fortunately, we were still at the vets and he got immed attention. But they can be powerful drugs and as with any new medication, they need to be watched for a while for any adverse reactions. barb -------------------------------------- From: "Claude Horstmann" To: Subject: Re: Elavil Date: Sun, 24 May 1998 14:07:47 -0400 Reply-to: felvtalk@MailingList.net barb, Elavil, classified as a tricyclic antidepressant, but also listed for Unlabeled Use: Chronic pain syndromes. I have seen it used with good effect in the geriatric population, but didn't realize until now that it is used in the feline population..... MEOUCH !!!!!! ..marilyn.. -------------------------------------- Date sent: Sun, 24 May 1998 13:20:42 -0500 To: felvtalk@MailingList.net From: Melanie Moore Subject: Re: Elavil Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net In doing a bit of research to find something to help calm my aggressive cat, my vet loaned me a book of his on behavior problems in cats. The book included a section on medication therapy. Several of the antidepressants, including Elavil, are utilized for aggression in felines, as well as for management of inappropriate urination problems, and other behavior problems. Melanie -------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 24 May 1998 23:07:09 From: Jennifer Pelland To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: [LONG: Taking A Shot With Immunoregulin] Reply-to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Our vet indicated that if we put our remaining cat on interferon, the dosage would be rubbed into her gums, not injected or in pill form. She's used to pills, but has tried to take a chunk out of the vet when she gets vaccinated, so while I would learn how to give her an injection, I'm glad that doesn't seem to be necessary right now. Since she's a challenge to professionals, she'd probably be even more of a challenge to a rank amateur like me. -Jennifer -------------------------------------- Date sent: Sun, 24 May 1998 21:06:56 -0700 From: Robert Frank Organization: A.R.F., Inc. To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: Memorial Day Thank You Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Dear Larry: I also have more respect for the little ones than I do some of the people I've met! Thanks for the job that you and all the Veterans have done to keep us free and enjoying the lives that we are allowed to live. There are many times when I hear people complaining about the U.S., that I think they should visit other countries in the world so that they can see how truly lucky we are here! Arlene and Howling Kitty -------------------------------------- Date sent: Sun, 24 May 1998 21:44:31 -0700 From: Dana Crow Organization: Magical Moments Preschool To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: Lucky crossed the bridge Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Dear Paula, Just catching up on all my mail & sadly read about Lucky. I am so sorry to hear that he has gone to the bridge but happy that he is now at peace & in pain no longer. He was indeed a lucky to cat to have such a loving, caring Mom. Dana -------------------------------------- Date sent: Sun, 24 May 1998 21:48:55 -0700 From: Dana Crow Organization: Magical Moments Preschool To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: Paige Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Dear Kelly, I am sorry to read of Paige's sudden passing. This is I'm sure all our worst nightmare. I can't imagine the shock of losing a furry loved one so quickly. I experienced a very sick kitty myself a few months ago but he was fortunate to pull thru. (NOt FelV related) Cat's are very good at keeping their illness to them selves I've learned. Again many sympathies on your fur baby's trek to the bridge. Dana -------------------------------------- Date sent: Sun, 24 May 1998 21:53:31 -0700 From: Dana Crow Organization: Magical Moments Preschool To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: What's going on? Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Hi all, Ive been trying to clear up the back log of mail that I've been hoarding for months But, it seems that the body of many of the pieces is now gone leaving me with only the Header. It doesn't seem to be all the mail but certain peoples more than others (ie Steve & Lynn's in particular.) Any one got any reason for this. I was trying to print out a bunch of info sheets for my vet. These messages were from Feb. & March. Is there a time limit on saving them?? Dana (Oh to be computer literate; these things frustrate me!!!) -------------------------------------- END