Sunday February 1, 1998 Part 1 20 Messages ====================================== From: DLMLLM@aol.com Date sent: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 01:24:24 EST To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: My Russian Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net In 1992 my female cat was diagnosed with feline leukemia. She was considered a carrier. We had lost one cat unexpectedly to the disease and had them all tested. At the time we had 7. Only Russian had it so the others were put on yearly shots. Russian was a rescued from a creek by my children after a man thru in a whole bag of kittens. She was the only one to survive. She did not have her eyes open but she managed to get to shore. I bottle fed her and she was sick alot with pneumonia and various illness the first two years. Russian did fairly well for quite a number of years. She had allergy problems in summer and leaded a normal and full life. She was small and we had her fixed and she gained weight and was a treasure. Her problems started as colds like a running nose with discharge and watery eyes. Not often but maybe once of twice a year after she reached 9 or so. Her real illnesses have been getting worse since this Fall. Her allergies were treated with Obaban. And she took these regular. Lately the vet has been having to give her shots and antibiotics he says to help keep the disease more in check. The antibiotics do help to pull her back faster. A few weeks back she was bad and we thought she was going to die, within a few days she was acting like a kitten and eating good. But the visits and sickness are getting to be every two weeks now. She is again on an antibiotic but not responding as before. Her gums are too white so I know she is anemic, her hair will loose it's shine and she will be listless and sleep more. The vet says the disease has probably ruined most of her systems by now and I try to understand this disease. Her immunity system is loosing. This last time has weakened her more, her eating almost stopped, she has withdrawn. The vet seems to think she has done good to make it this far. I would like to help her make it farther. I have taken the name of some of the drugs to try off the web pages ImmunoRegulin and others. I don't know if she is a lost cause because of her age and the time she has delt with this but I can't give up yet. Right now if she can hold out till Monday I will again talk to the vet, he is old and thinks it is useless. Any help offered from anyone will be most appreciated. Sorry this is so long. -------------------------------------- Date sent: Sun, 01 Feb 1998 00:44:27 -0500 From: Tookie Myers To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: Any help for Buddy? Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Need a little more data on his condition and how he has been treated so far. Have you used interferon, immunoregulin, dimethlyglycine? He needs a high plane of nutrition to keep up his strength and help him build immunity as well. You may e-mail me with more information and I should be able to help. M. W. Myers, D.V.M. -------------------------------------- From: DLMLLM@aol.com Date sent: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 13:11:24 EST To: Felvtalk@mailinglist.net Subject: Sick Cat Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net I would like to direct this to Dr. Myers. I have been trying to find out if these treatments of ImmunoRegulin and the others could benefit a 13 year old with this leukemia. My Russian has gone almost completely immobile now. She has been really ill the last three days. The only medicine we've used has been antibiotics. Mainly to treat the illnesses she had, not the leukemia. I did not have knowledge of alternative treatments before. Could they benefit her at this late stage? We have all but decided to have her put down tomorrow if there is no other way. I can't bear to see her suffer anymore. Our vet has stated before that he believes her kidneys and liver could be damaged. She also is anemic, her gums are white. She will only take can milk to drink now. Is it too much too hope something radical could change her now for the better? There are not too many vets in Northern Ohio who are familiar with these treatments. Thank you. -------------------------------------- Date sent: Sun, 01 Feb 1998 13:28:01 -0500 From: Tookie Myers To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: Sick Cat Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net If your cat is immobile, I would not be too optimistic for the outcome. Why do you "think" the kidneys are failing? Have any tests been run to ascertain the extent of the damage? This may answer your dilemma quickly. M. W. Myers, D.V.M. -------------------------------------- From: DLMLLM@aol.com Date sent: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 13:35:39 EST To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: Sick Cat Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Dr Myers, No tests have been done on her. The vet just said that usually with this disease and the time she has had it that is what happens. She does have the anemia tho. We suggested trying a blood transfusion but he says it would cost a lot and maybe help her for about two weeks. Then we would need to do it again. My husband does not want her to have undo suffering, neither do I. But I'm searching for answers. -------------------------------------- Date sent: Sun, 01 Feb 1998 08:31:37 -0600 From: Cheryl and Michael To: "felvtalk@MailingList.net" Subject: Variation of Immunoregulin treatment Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net I have been extremely curious at how ImmunoRegulin is used frequently in the beginning of treatment and then slowed down after time. For example, I have read of several cases where treatment begins with two shots a week and then is slowed to one shot a month. Copley began treatment at the end of October with one shot a week and remains on one shot a week. Does anyone know the guidelines suggesting changes of treatment? Although Copley is holding his own at the moment, and the ImmunoRegulin has no doubt had a positive effect, I could not imagine the shots being reduced to once a month. Is this because the other cats are fortunately doing so much better? A quick update...Copley is doing better than three weeks ago when he really had me scared. He became so inactive. We are slowly but steadily getting the fungus under control. His various hair styles are the envy of the neighborhood. His activity level has picked up enough for my concerns to wane for the moment. I have enlisted the help of a second vet involved in herbs and acupuncture. Although we are passing on the acupuncture we now have herbs that are specific to Copley's symptoms. -------------------------------------- Date sent: Sun, 01 Feb 1998 10:16:11 -0500 From: albobo To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: Variation of Immunoregulin treatment Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Cheryl and Michael wrote: I'm sure others can help you with the treatments but I am curious about the "herbs that are specific to Copley's symptoms". Would you elaborate? > > Thanks. Give Copley a hug from me! -- Kathy G and the 3 Furries in Daytona Beach =^.^= - Rusty =^.^= - Smokey =^.^= - Money See us at: http://cgi.gambitsys.com/homey/webdoc5.htm The Cat: Mother Nature's Masterpiece! -------------------------------------- Date sent: Sun, 01 Feb 1998 12:21:19 -0500 From: Tookie Myers To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: Variation of Immunoregulin treatment Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Our understanding of all of the immune systems in the cat (and any other animals including humans) is very sketchy at this time. Immunoregulin is but one item in our arsenal to combat a variety of immune related problems. Doseage regimens are empirical and adjusted to the animal's response. If your cat is doing well on this regimen my advice is "don't fix it if it ain't broke" translating to if it works don't change it. M. W. Myers, D.V.M. -------------------------------------- Date sent: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 11:48:50 -0700 (MST) To: felvtalk@MailingList.net From: lizgold@mail.utexas.edu (Liz Gold) Subject: Update on making last days more comfortable for Muffin Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Thanks so much to every one who has written back in response to my question about how to help Muffin in her last days--especially Jenn, James ("Phaedrus"), and Brad, I really needed the emotional support as much as the information. Muffin is now on prednisone. It seems to be helping her be able to eat and keep food down, and generally making her more comfortable--which is what I want. If she starts really being in pain, we will definitely put her to sleep (thanks, Brad, for the support for that option). Unfortunately, I don't have the resources right now to fight the FELV more aggressively. We spent $1000 last fall keeping my dog alive--our vet said he was dying of kidney failure, but thanks to some Web sites I found, I was able to diagnose him correctly with leptospirosis (caught from swimming in our town's lake), which he was treated for, and is now quite healthy--except that he got attacked by three dogs on Christmas day, and has needed another $500 of care to heal his broken leg. My funds are exhausted, and so am I (my partner also had major surgery, so I've had to be nurse all month--and I have a chronic illness myself, which keeps me in constant pain). I feel like what I need to do right now is just give Muffin all the love and care I can, and try to ease her transition out of this world. I know that these decisions are hard on all of us--when to martial all our resources and fight, when to let go. We all have to follow our hearts (and occasionally our heads). Hugs to all of you, Liz -------------------------------------- Date sent: Sun, 01 Feb 1998 14:19:41 -0500 From: Tookie Myers To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: Sick Cat Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net I would do the kidney test and if the results are beyond help you have your answer. M. W. Myers, D.V.M. -------------------------------------- From: DLMLLM@aol.com Date sent: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 14:22:17 EST To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: Sick Cat Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Thank You Dr. Myers. -------------------------------------- From: AskforArt@aol.com Date sent: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 15:42:53 EST To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: Sick Cat Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Hi-- Last year when my cas were first diagnosed with Felv one of them became so ill that he wouldn't eat or drink, and could barely hold up his head. My vet at the time told me to euthanize all of them, but I couldn't. I bought every book I could find on natural healing. One of the suggestions for nutritional support stated that goats milk and honey were nutrient-dense foods, and that a human could survive for months on those alone. I mixed up goats milk (from the refridgerated health food section of the grocery store), mixed in some honey, and added 1/10 of a human dose of digestive enzymes. The book stated that the patureization process destroys the digestive enzyes in the milk, which is why I added them to the milk and honey. (A calf will die within six months if it is fed pastuerized milk instead of raw milk.) Also, you can often find canned goat's milk in the same section of the store as canned milk. My cat was almost comatose, so I just lifted up the side of his lip and, using a child's medicine dropper, let the fluid drip into his mouth. He had enough reflex left to be able to swallow. I fed him every hour or two for the forst two days. The vet thought I was crazy, but he told me how much liquid to give my cat every 24 hours per pound of body weight (I don't remember how much, but maybe Dr. Myers could help with that). The first two days I gave him 11/2 times as much as the vet recomended, because he was so dehydrated. At the end of the third day he was starting to eat some solid food, and showing definite signs of improvement. The milk and honey bought me and my cat enough time to find a Homeopathic D.V.M., and today Joss is asymptomatic. Hope this helps. Good luck. Linda P in Sacramento -------------------------------------- From: DLMLLM@aol.com Date sent: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 17:39:00 EST To: Felvtalk@mailinglist.net Subject: Re: My cat Russian Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Linda in Sacramento Russian is still going and I have all you good people on the net to thank. She did not seem to us that the disease was at fault. Her gums were not white and her luster was still in her coat. We found a 24 hour vet near us and took her in this afternoon. I needed a second opinion now. Dr. Myers helped on that. Unfortunately she is running a 106 temp. and is slightly dehyrated. This new vet checked her over and is keeping her to administer IV's and run some tests. He said she looks pretty bad but does not think the disease is at fault. He is not sure as yet if maybe she could have some lymp node involvement due to the disease. But I had to let everyone know WE were not giving up on her. She was purring so loud the doctor could not hear her chest. I've never had her overnight anywhere before but I will rest better tonight. I'll keep everyone up on her and when I can get my scanner to run right will let you see her. This is a great support group to be part of. Thanks again. Linda in Ohio -------------------------------------- Date sent: Sun, 01 Feb 1998 17:31:20 -0600 From: Cheryl and Michael To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: Variation of Immunoregulin treatment Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net Tookie Myers wrote: > Our understanding of all of the immune systems in the cat (and any other > animals including humans) is very sketchy at this time. Immunoregulin is > but one item in our arsenal to combat a variety of immune related > problems. Doseage regimens are empirical and adjusted to the animal's > response. > > If your cat is doing well on this regimen my advice is "don't fix it if > it ain't broke" translating to if it works don't change it. > > M. W. Myers, D.V.M. Dr. Myers, Thanks for the response. I completely agree in the "if it ain't broke don't fix it" approach, unlike many bosses I've had in my day (sorry that is for another forum :) ). I was really just curious what some other guidelines are that people use to determine how often this drug should be used. In spite of improvement in Copley it is our opinion that the results are not what we were hoping for and his behavior exhibits the overall low blood count. Copley's vet has been heavily involved with research in Immunoregulin and the effects on positive cats, you know those projects that are always canceled 3/4 of the way through, due to a lack of funding, so I have confidence in his ability to treat him. Even though we are all dealing with the same problem it is also true that each of us are dealing with several different symptoms, reactions and behaviors. It is great to have an opportunity to share so when our situation changes we have some ideas in our back pocket. I have just been trying to figure out a few correlations in my mind that may add up to nothing. When people drop the ImmunoRegulin treatment to once a month is this after the results of a blood test or is it more just another theory on how to use the medicine? I thought if I saw any improvement in Copley shortly after starting ImmunoRegulin the results would be more dramatic in the beginning. Has anyone seen improvement over a long period or do the benefits show pretty quickly? Again, I can't stress enough how I understand how unpredictable all of this is. Copley had one blood test about two months after treatment began. It is my understanding that we most likely saw how good things are going to get and the remaining treatment is to keep him at that level. In other words, I probably shouldn't expect too much more over time? Thanks. -------------------------------------- Date sent: Sun, 01 Feb 1998 17:32:00 -0600 From: Cheryl and Michael To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re:herbs(was Immunoregulin treatment) Send reply to: felvtalk@MailingList.net albobo wrote: > Cheryl and Michael wrote: > > I'm sure others can help you with the treatments but I am curious about > the "herbs that are specific to Copley's symptoms". Would you > elaborate? > > > > Thanks. Give Copley a hug from me! > > -- > I wish I could elaborate on the herbs, but I am not sure exactly what they are except for very larger, not so nice smelling pills. The vet got a full record of Copley's history, spoke to my regular vet and based on the symptoms he exhibits, lack of activity and skin problems, gave me two different types of pills. I am supposed to chip small bits off and feed them to Copley. No where does the label indicate exactly what he is taking. My regular vet has a cats only clinic and devotes all of his time to learning all the medical things he can about cats. Because this takes all of his time he is unable to completely investigate the holistic approach to treatment. He strongly encouraged me to seek a vet in my area that devotes her time to this approach. My vet has seen this work successfully in some cases where the situation appeared to be quite bad. Of course, we cannot attribute the success solely to these treatments, but as we all know alternative treatments may help. Sorry I could not give you more info. As I learn more I will share it with the group. By the way, Copley enjoyed the extra hug....thanks. -------------------------------------- END OF PART 1: SEE PART 2 AT: http://www.geocities.com/HotSprings/Spa/9802012.txt