Friday January 9, 1998 Part 3 7 Messages ======================================== Date: Fri, 09 Jan 1998 23:25:22 -0500 From: Brian and Jennifer Kleeman To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: felv testing Reply-To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Lynn wrote: > Whether they test positive or negative, I don't need to know. I would > never "kill" a kitty for that reason. The only reason that the test is > necessary, I think, is to help him when he becomes > sick......................Lynn(Stinker) WOW Lynn- I couldn't disagree with you more. Testing is _absolutely essential_ for cats of unknown status and to monitor those who have been exposed to another FeLV positive cat. Please consider my experience: First here is my past: I have lost two cats to FeLV that were unknown positives at the time they became symptomatic. At the point they became "sick" they each had hematocrits of about 10. And despite our most valient efforts, these cats were too far gone to be helped. Second here is my present: I have one postive FeLV cat (Yo-yo) and two (knocking on wood) negative and vaccinated FeLV cats (The Boys) that live with her now (and lived with her a year before we realized she was postive.) I _firmly_ believe in taking a proactive approach to this hideous disease. Knowing that Yo-yo is positive means that even though she is asymptomatic, we monitor her bloodwork every 3 months and have her on interferon because we were concerned about patterns we were seeing in her bloodwork. The interferon seems to be helping. HAD WE NOT TESTED HER, we would not be on this track at all. She would have no interferon because she _looks_ healthy. Cats are extremely resilient creatures. often hiding illness. Having the opportunity to help her before she reaches the often critical "sick" point is _EXTREMELY_ important to me. I may be preventing her from ever having to experience the "sick" point. Additionally, we test the boys every 3 months and monitor their weight at home monthly (as loss of weight is one of the earliest signs of FeLV infection). We have chosen (for reasons I will happily explain if anyone would like) to allow Yo-yo and the boys to continue to live together. Yo-yo is probably constantly shedding the virus. The vaccine is only estimated to be 65% - 85% effective. I must know if either of the boys becomes positive so that we could begin the same routine with them as we use on Yo-yo. I absolutely DO NOT consider Yo-yo's postive status a death sentence. I WOULD consider not knowing her status a death sentence considering I wouldn't be intervening until they were "sick" which statisitcally is more often than not the point of no return. Knowledge is power. Ignorance can be deadly. I have two dead cats to prove that point. Furthermore, it concerns me greatly that you have not tested those 16 other cats. One of those could be perfectly healthy in appearance and shedding the virus. The others are not immune just because they have been vaccinated. At the very least the standard protocol is to test prior to vaccination, and prior to introducing to other cats (I argue that based on my experience I would reccommend test twice at least two months apart to be more sure). I belive this internet list is a testament to the fact that most of us do not consider testing positive a death sentence. While there still seem to be some ignorant vets out there who follow the idea that we should kill positive cats, I cannot imagine that any of us here would even consider it. KNOWING that Yo-yo is positive may be allowing me to help her extend her healthy, happy life. WHY ALLOW HER TO SICK BEFORE I BEGIN TO HELP? I test to save my cats, not kill them. I look up now into her beautiful orange eyes as she lays purring on top of my monitor. Having lost two other cats to this disease, I absolutely, positively refuse to lose another without giving it one _hell_ of a fight. The only way I can arm myself is through information. Testing is necessary and extraordinarily useful, if only to protect other cats from exposure and to begin the fight before it is too late. If you hadn't noticed, I'm a bit emotional about this issue. I strongly urge you to have your other 16 cats tested if you never have. Please, don't wait until it is too late to help them! Jennifer Kleeman Minoux Chartreux ------------------------------------- From: macat@webtv.net (belinda sauro) Date: Fri, 9 Jan 1998 20:51:09 -0800 To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: Re: felv testing Reply-To: felvtalk@MailingList.net I agree testing is important, we test our kitties every year before they get vaccinated. And believe me if any of my kitties starts acting the least little bit out of character, I'm running to the vets. We lost 3 kitties to FeLV in two years, and I missed things I should have seen. I think some of it was my own denial, and I ask my kitties forgiveness every night for that. I keep a very close watch over them now. I just hope they're meant to live long heathly lives, I do know that they know they are very LOVED!!! Belinda Happiness is being owned by cats... www.angelfire.com/ma/macat5 http://members.tripod.com/~macat5/index5.html ---------------------------------- From: "Lynn Stickels" To: "felvtalk" Subject: Brian& Jennifer Date: Fri, 9 Jan 1998 21:15:22 -0800 Reply-To: felvtalk@MailingList.net First of all, I would like to say how much my kitties mean to me. I love them with all my heart. I thought I was doing what was best for them. I don't make much money, but all I get goes to my cats! If I am doing something wrong, I would really like to know. My cats mean the whole world to me and I just want you all to know. I would give them all of my income, my love, my life. What am I doing wrong? I would really like some positive info.............Please.................Lynn (Stinker) --------------------------------- From: "phaedrus" To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Date: Fri, 9 Jan 1998 23:14:28 +0000 Subject: re: leukemia testing AZHART Reply-To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Hi all, Before this gets out of hand, I think I'd better step in here. Lynn, I've gone back and read the only post to this list from Irene Hart concerning a response to your post about FeLV testing, and I can't find anything in it that warrants your reply. Did she send you a private message with tones that you found offensive? If so, please keep those e-mails private between yourselves- this public list is no place to air hurt feelings over private matters. In Irene's public message, she stated that her post was not intended as a "flame", and I don't think that it was. Issues of feline leukemia are extremely controversial, and there is no doubt in my mind that many disagreements will take place on this list. However, we must keep these discussions regarding our differences of opinions level and free from personal attacks. I am speaking to the whole list here, so don't think I'm singling you out- yours is just the first post to show signs of a personal attack on another poster here. As in any social situation, we can draw strength from our diversity of opinions and experiences. Please don't take the airing of these differences as attacks upon your character- they are not. You wouldn't be here if you didn't care deeply for your little furries (nobody doubts that). So, with that said, I hope that we can mend some fences and continue learning from one another about how to best treat and care for our feline friends. Thanks for your indulgence. James G. Wilson- list owner. In loving memory of Vyvyan: March 20, 1988 - August 15, 1997 James G. Wilson phaedrus@ctnet.net , phaedrus69@hotmail.com , phaedrus69@juno.com, felv@angelfire.com http://www.angelfire.com/il/felv/ http://www.fortunecity.com/skyscraper/sterling/20/tribute.html http://www.litchfieldil.com/members/phaedrus/ http://www.fortunecity.com//skyscraper/sterling/20/niu.html http://www.wapd.org/points/jgwilson.html ------------------------------------ From: "Lynn Stickels" To: "felvtalk" Subject: to all of you Date: Fri, 9 Jan 1998 21:33:36 -0800 Reply-To: felvtalk@MailingList.net From: Lynn and Stinker I guess I am wrong. My heart is broken by reading all of your letters. I thought I was doing what was best for my kittes. I do love them so very very much. But to you I am doing the WRONG thing and It does hurt alot. I love my kitties so very very much. What am I doing wrong? What am I to do? I don't have much money but I have so much love. Please don't put me down. I really do try the best I can. I Love My Cats.......Lynn(Stinker:)) ------------------------------------- From: "phaedrus" To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Date: Fri, 9 Jan 1998 23:32:26 +0000 Subject: Re: felv testing Reply-To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Hi Jennifer, Thanks for your wonderfully thoughtful and organized description of your experiences with your FeLV+ kitties. I'm sorry to hear that you also lost loved ones to this dreadful disease. The information you provided in your post is almost exactly what I was getting ready to say myself- ie: your points about 1) having all cats tested (especially prior to having them vaccinated), 2) the effectiveness of these vaccines (65 - 85%), and 3) the fact that knowing which cats are FeLV+ helps get them started on a proper treatment to boost their compromised immune systems. Although your post was somewhat emotionally motivated, your facts are there for us all to see and learn from. I know some people may disagree with some of the content of your post, but I hope they'll do it using facts- not emotion. I take it from your post that you have not separated your FeLV+ cat(s) from the negative ones- is that right? I know at least three other people on this list who do not separate theirs, either. I can see both sides of the coin here regarding the argument for separation, and I haven't formed a clear opinion on it myself (though, I'm leaning towards not separating them). Perhaps maybe the list should discuss (in a reasonable manner) both sides of this coin. Just a thought. Take care, and best wishes for all of the FeLV+ kitties on the list. In loving memory of Vyvyan: March 20, 1988 - August 15, 1997 James G. Wilson phaedrus@ctnet.net , phaedrus69@hotmail.com , phaedrus69@juno.com, felv@angelfire.com http://www.angelfire.com/il/felv/ http://www.fortunecity.com/skyscraper/sterling/20/tribute.html http://www.litchfieldil.com/members/phaedrus/ http://www.fortunecity.com//skyscraper/sterling/20/niu.html http://www.wapd.org/points/jgwilson.html ------------------------------------- From: macat@webtv.net (belinda sauro) Date: Fri, 9 Jan 1998 21:51:59 -0800 To: felvtalk@MailingList.net Subject: To separate or not Reply-To: felvtalk@MailingList.net I'm one of those who doesn't separate my kitties, for two reasons: (1) We had discovered that Joey had been squeezing under the door to play with Bailey, so he had already exposed himself and his brothers and sisters. (2) I truly believe that It was God who led Bailey to me. We vaccinate our babies and LOVE, LOVE, LOVE, them and I just can't believe he would do this just to put us through so much pain again.( We lost 3 kitties to this horrible disease in two years.) Whatever time our babies have with us, they know they are loved and I will do everything I can to keep them healthy and happy, so far they are!!! Belinda Happiness is being owned by cats... www.angelfire.com/ma/macat5 http://members.tripod.com/~macat5/index5.html ---------------------------------------- END