IOSH - 133^rd Edinburgh Branch Meeting
Donaldson’s College, Edinburgh – Thursday 14th March 2002
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SEDERUNT

L Young I Murray G Dick S Young S Boucher J Usher R Edward A Milne C McGlade M Bancroft D Cawkwell I Wilson A Evans A Gregory V Stewart S Macmorland J Farquharson J Robertson S Welsh B Stainton W Hutchison R Walker C Wilmott J Davis J Toland B Byrne M Johnstone G McGeorge B Pill C E White S Wilson M Gorman W Witherspoon H Gibson A Green L Houghton P Lightfoot G Thom M Scott-Smith J Waddell R McLean A Sharman J McCraith E Sneddon R Lovering N Doherty

D Sinclair I Smith B Bertram G McNab N Robertson K Lloyd D Brown

1.0 CHAIRMAN Brian Pill

Brian took the Chair and the meeting held within the Dining Hall with the explanation that the remedial work is still on going with the intention of returning to the Lecture Theatre in the not too distant future. New members ad Guests wee welcomed and the importance of the Sederunt and CPD points outlined. Members were again reminded of the importance of driving with extreme care within the school grounds.

2.0 MINUTES

The 132^nd Minute was accepted without amendment. It was Proposed by A Sharman and Seconded by L Young.

4.0 CORRESPONDENCE

It was stated that copies of all the correspondence are maintained by the Secretary for the Members attention and readily available at the front table during the tea break.

5.0 BRANCH EDUCATION DEVELOPMENT ADVISOR – Liz Young

The members were reminded that only those already registered could seek up-grade to Tech SP and portfolios must be with HQ by the end of the year.

7.0 DISTRICT REPORT – Brian Pill

The District Executive met recently to firm up the programme and budget for the forthcoming season but no details were presented apart from the date and topic for the next evening meeting.

1. The Chairman mentioned and supported the Safety Matters 2002 conference being run by the Scottish Chamber of Safety. This year the conference is to be held in Dunblane on 17 April.
2. The Branch has been invited by Head Quarters to be represented at the HSE European Week event being held at the Carlton Hotel, Edinburgh. The Chairman is to attend.
3. The Construction Site Safety Observation Project wash-up and de-brief will be taking place at the Scottish Construction Safety Meeting in Bathgate on Thursday 21 March 2002. All interested parties are invited to attend.

9.0 GUEST SPEAKER

Steve May was introduced to the group as a partner within the A. H. Allen Partners based out of their Hull office. Part of his background was as an HSE Inspector, but fears were expressed for his sanity when it was learned that he had volunteered to come and present a paper on Asbestos

Introduction

The speaker indicated that A.H Allen operated in three main areas. 1. Asbestos (where they would undertake surveys, analysis of samples and general advice. 2. Undertaking Public analysis for the local authorities in terms of food hygiene etc. 3. Steve’s specialty was concerned with Health & Safety in terms of general training, auditing and inspections, although still heavily linked into asbestos operations.

He then indicated that his intention was not to consider how to deal with working with asbestos, but he would be considering the management of asbestos in various premises as it may apply to landlord’s etc. His topic would therefore cover three areas: -

• An introduction to Managing Asbestos in buildings
• Details of the new regulations which are expected later this year on asbestos
• A case study to show how one local authority has already put it into operation.

It is currently estimated that 3000 people die each year from asbestos related illnesses, although there is currently some dispute as to the accuracy of this estimate, it is still accepted there are a large number of persons so affected. These people die from such conditions as – Asbestosis, Lung cancer and Mesothelioma – all of which are linked to inhaling fibers normally invisible to the eye. Original estimates indicated that this figure would rise over the next 20 years or so, but once again the level of increase is disputed in some circles although the trend so far do indicate an increase has been present over the last few years.

The majority of persons likely to be affected have in the past been those working within the manufacturing, installation or removal industries, but there is a strong concern that in the future exposure to asbestos and hence suffering from these conditions may well be more associated with the service industries. Such occupations as building workers, those in building maintenance and in demolition will still figure in the group at risk, but more so are likely to be the plumbers, electricians, fire alarm installers, telecomm engineers, cleaners, etc. as they could well be exposed to the asbestos issues without realizing the risk.

So far we have seen inroads being made by

• Amendment of the CAW (Control of Asbestos at Work) Regulations in 1998. – These broadened the cover of persons to include those "liable to be exposed" rather than just those known to be "working" asbestos and added a requirement for training and refresher training.
• The Licensing Regulations were amended in 1998 to include working with AIB (Asbestos Insulation Board) to be undertaken by those holding a license to do so.
• A total ban on Chrysotile asbestos was introduced by Regulation in 1999 despite the comments from some individuals that this was not a hazardous material.

All this however is not enough – workers are still being exposed to asbestos without knowing, because the risk is not being adequately controlled at source.

Images were then shown indicating how asbestos can be seen in various locations – Pipe lagging left on top of ceiling tiles. Various forms of pipe insulation including loose, wrapped blanket, sectional format and glass-fibre – which had asbestos content within the lining paper. Normal houses will have asbestos in the eves and soffit boards and in any firebreak wall or as lining for the heater/boiler enclosure. Even the decorative wall finish (Artex style) may have asbestos within it – albeit in small quantities, but it may have been added as a binding agent.

Regulation 4 in the proposed Regulations will focus the duty on how to manage the asbestos risk within premises. The accompanying ACoP (Approved Code of Practice) will provide the necessary guidance to back up the regulations.

The Duty Holder will be required to: -

• Take reasonable steps to identify ACMs (Asbestos Containing Materials) within the building. – This may need to be done either by various depths of survey, past records or by presumption, which would be to identify likely ACMs and then sample just those to prove it to be asbestos or otherwise.
• Assess the condition, location etc. of the ACMs and formulate a risk assessment. If ACMs were to be contained in a ceiling area and it is exceptionally good order and is unlikely to be disturbed, it would probably be left and a record of its position be noted. If however it was a board of dubious condition in a position where it could be subject to heavy wear (such as in a corridor in a school) it may be considered necessary to remove it entirely.
• Take the action considered necessary from the Risk Assessment.
• Prepare a Management Plan, which is effectively a Policy and operational procedures to put the policy into place.
• Provide information to those persons likely to disturb any ACM. This may mean keeping a register of all ACMs and their respective locations.
• Monitor the condition of ACMs. The frequency of the monitoring would itself be part of the risk assessment identification – was it in an area where it may suffer heavy surface wear, or is in an area unlikely to be disturbed from one year to the next.
• Review and revise the management plan.

The Regulations have been the subject of initial consultation undertaken in 2000, when feedback indicated the need to consider two issues in particular – WHO exactly would be the Duty Holder and WHICH premises the proposed regulations would cover. The consultative document (CD 176) indicated a need for further refining and it is envisaged that the Regulations will be on the Statute books in the autumn of 2002, with an 18 months lead-in time for full operation. This lead-time is unlikely to be sufficient for total compliance when you consider the size of the issue.

The "Duty" is considered to be upon the "employer in occupation at non-domestic premises in which people will work". This could still give rise to some complexity, for instance who is the "employer" in a school where a lot of the power and operational decisions have been delegated and assumed by the head teacher and the Board of Governors?

There will also be a duty upon the owner or manager of the premises (if different) to enable the employer to comply. Here the issue was considered to be dependant upon the details of the contract or tenancy, but it could become "muddied" when you consider the complexities likely to be encountered within sub-contracts within of leased Industrial Premises

It will cover ALL workplaces

And Common areas in rented housing

HSE/C are considering broadening the requirement to include rented housing etc in the future.

This is possibly an adequate indication of why it has been estimated that this set of regulations could well cost in the order of £6 billion to implement.

The original campaign started in October/November 2001 with a series of Road shows.

Guidance publications have already been made available

Asbestos Workshops are being by "partners" with the HSE

Regulations, ACoP and detailed guidance will be available within the year

Visits, advice and as necessary enforcement will follow.

The speaker then provided images of a number of aids for gaining information or getting the message across to other including: -

• HSE video = "How are you today" – a very powerful film of one man’s struggle against asbestos related illness based around the risks of asbestos in buildings
• HSE Leaflet – Managing Asbestos in Premises – INDG 223 (rev2)
• MDHS 100 – Asbestos and MMMFs in buildings – a technique of surveying buildings including a scoring system for undertaking a risk assessment of asbestos in buildings.
• HSE Leaflet – Working with asbestos – INDG 289
• HSE Leaflets – Asbestos Essentials – methods of working with asbestos HSG 210 & 213

A large Borough Council, with a number of schools where they had devolved governance to the schools considered what they needed to do. In particular they considered the consequences of getting it wrong – the adverse publicity, expense, disruption, time consuming issues, personal injury and so on. So they developed a strategy for managing asbestos

• They developed and issued a Corporate Policy to apply across the board
• That contained details of devolution of responsibilities from the Surveyors department to the School staff and Governors.
• They initiated surveys – mainly type 2, which is identifying by walkabout the locations of likely asbestos bearing materials and then just sampling those. It did not involve stripping walls down to see what was beneath it etc.
• They then completed a risk assessment and developed an action plan where high level risk items were to be removed or sealed a minimum, whilst the low level risks were considered for suitability to leave in place with suitable labeling.
• They appointed a "champion" from within the group – someone who could drive it from the sharp end to make sure things got done. And they created an Asbestos Group to assimilate information gained.

• Openness – they felt it was imperative to keep everyone informed on what was going on
• Training – they provided detailed training for those likely to be involved in the recognition and control of asbestos
• An asbestos Register was to be created and then held on site by each school
• Details to be provide on the location of all ACMs to be provided to all staff and contractors
• Adequate control of contractors was seen as necessary – The HSE Booklet "Managing Contractors – A guide for employers of small to medium chemical businesses" was suggested as a very useful source of information and guidance on this subject.
• A monitoring condition plan for ACMs was created and the register was kept up to dates. This involved further training of staff on site to recognise what would be the suitable condition of materials to accept or not.
• Procedures were developed for control of emergencies – Where asbestos was suddenly discovered where its location had not been known previously, or when its condition was found to have deteriorated so much as to be an unacceptable hazard.
• Communication – keeping everyone informed at every stage was seen as paramount to the plan’s success.

The speaker than showed a number of useful web links =