Re: [pf] Why all the gloom, about Economic Growth grinding to a halt?

At 08:20 AM 8/17/01 +1200, David MacClement wrote:·

Regarding David's posting (below):

I agree totally.  The idea that "growth is good" is a meme that has been very widely accepted in the Western or so-called "Developed Nations".  Robert Theobald and many others have argued for years for a "steady state economy".  IMO it is up to all of us to stay aware of the GPI (Genuine Progress Indicator) and spread the world about the totally negativity of the GDP or GNP that is quoted ad nauseam as measures of a "good economy"!   I think we all know what these measure -- an accounting system that has only plusses! 
        
IMO it is very important to be accept David's statement that:
"Is it just an unexamined belief in Progress? (If general Progress exists at all, it's only _very_ slow, on a century-time-scale, and is only very slightly related to money and the economy.)"

[I've Bcc'd this to many who might find it interesting)            Arnie

FORWARD:

I've just now sent this to GV-NZ. It applies everywhere.   D.

> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> · At the bottom are three BBC reports about US, German, and
> Europe-wide
> evidence that their much-vaunted economic growth is at least slowing;
> today:
> "German economy grinds to a halt".
>
>
> · Why is this seen as worrying?
>   Why is Economic Growth accepted by virtually everybody as a good
> thing?
>
>
> · Is it just an unexamined belief in Progress? (If general Progress
> exists
> at all, it's only _very_ slow, on a century-time-scale, and is only
> very
> slightly related to money and the economy.)
>
> · Is it assumed, in spite of the evidence, that more money "in
> circulation"
> will "trickle down" to the average family? The evidence is that
> the top 10%
> richest people-and-corporates have appropriated most of the money
> increase.
> And the lowest-income 20% are getting none of the increase, in fact
> they're
> having some of what they used to get, removed from their reach.
>   That's "just the way the game is played", is it? OK with
> Greens?
>
> · Do ordinary people not realise that the US mainly, with other
> developed
> nations (the possible exception being NZ), produce this Growth in
> Money
> Supply by converting resources (mostly non-renewable) into money, by
> means
> of the production-consumption economic system? So there's a clear limit
> to
> this sort of Growth, with obvious evidence that the future
> detriment-per-dollar- produced is increasing, and becoming an obstacle
> even
> in economic terms.
>
>
> · The Greens are at least in favour of Sustainable Living, which I see
> as
> including a Sustainable Economic System which would obviously (to me)
> be
> dependent on using and trading _renewable_ resources (with
> appropriate
> limits to allow them to _be_ renewed), plus an emphasis on a
> non-exploitative Service sector.
>
> · I regard the current (generally-world) economic slowdown as an
> unplanned
> approach to a Sustainable economic system; though only the beginnings,
> a
> long way to go yet.
>   So the nearly flat NZ economy (we boast when it gets up to 3%
> p.a.!), and
> similar 0 to 2% rates elsewhere, are IMO opportunities for moving toward
> a
> no-growth economy, at least in regard to non-renewable resources 
> and
> efficient use of energy.
>
> · an Economic Slowdown is to be _celebrated_, as I see it!
>
> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> -
>
> http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/business/newsid_1492000/1492737.stm
>  . . . . . Title: Mixed signals on US economy; 15/08/01 17:14 GMT
>    Box: 
> more on global crisis 
> Signs of a slowdown
> US 'in recession'
> Banks stop lending
> Retail sales weak
> Homeowners' worries 
> Why slump started 
>
>
> http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/business/newsid_1482000/1482307.stm
>  . . . . . Title: ECB sees 'sizeable' risks to growth; 9/08/01 15:14
> GMT
>
>
> http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/business/newsid_1494000/1494186.stm
>  . . . . . Title: German economy grinds to a halt; 16/08/01 11:12
> GMT 
>
> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> sent to Positive Futures list by David.
> David MacClement [davd @ ihug.co.nz] (remove spaces)
> http://davd.tripod.com/GrRR-010810_titles.html#top
> http://www.geocities.com/davd.geo/index.html#top
> ***********************************************




In times of rapid change it will be the learners who will be in a
position to lead.  
The learned will find themselves equipped only to deal with things that
are past.
(?)
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