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Credendovidis / Tempus-Omnia-Revelat Toms777's non-proof for "God's existence" Toms keeps lying about having provided objective proof for the existence of "God". Of course that is a lie. A total lie, as such proof simply does not existsl, and never will exist. Even more tolerant Christians admit that proof for the existence of "God" is impossible to provide. Note also that T777 has many times been asked to supply "objective evidence for the existence of "God". However he always refers to what he posted previously on the AW Christianity board, without bothering to provide dates or URL's for that. Now let's see what T777 posted as his "objective proof" for the existence of God in response to my requests : Clarification/Follow-up by Toms777 on 05/23/07 11:48 am: "God created all that there is, or that it came about naturally. I have asked a number of questions. If there is no possible means by which these events occurred naturally, then there is only one answer : God created and thus God exists. *Note01* For each of these questions for which there is no natural answer, you have a proof of God. *Note02* As a reminder, the issues were : EYE : How about the eye. Can anyone give a plausible explanation as to how the eye came to be? *Note03* DNA : In each and every living or previously living cell, we find an operating system (O/S) program written which is more complex than any MAC or PC. In addition to the program, we find that each and every cell has the built in capability to read and interpret this programming language. Does anyone have a plausible explanation for how this advanced programming language, along with reader/interpreter came to be? *Note04* SIMPLE SINGLE CELL : How did the simple cells come to be created? *Note05* POND SCUM : Pericles claimed that the answer to the question above was that the single cells came from pond scum, which is in and itself a form of life - how did it come to be? *Note06* AUSTRALIAN BRUSH TURKEY : An interesting animal. It does not sit the eggs to incubate them, but rather creates a compost pile to provide the heat, which must be maintained at around 33 degrees. The eggs are layed down at the precise depth and in a circle where that exact heat will be maintained. The turkey does not lay the eggs right away, but waits until the compost pile has reached the necessary temperature. This requires that the brush turkey understand heat and decomposition, as well as how the heat radiates and be able to calculate the precise depth and pattern at which the necessary heat occurs. And it has to understand that this is all required to hatch chicks. To have gained this knowledge by chance would be impossible because there are too many variables to all the brush turkey to figure out the linkage between heat and hatching eggs and then precisely what heat is required and how to obtain it. The existence of God and his creation of this animal explains this. *Note07* MACAWS : Macaws are birds that feed on poisonous seeds, and in order to live, after they eat,they must eat a certain type of mud which neutralizes the poison. How did this evolve? What is the natural explanation for this? The existence of God explains it. *Note08* --- If you cannot provide a plausible answer, or if you respond with abuse, then that is as good as an admission that you know that God exists, but can not bring yourself to admit the truth. *Note09* I look forward to your response. Tom --- *Note01* T777's suggests here that if there is lack of (full) proof for one thesis that is automatically proof for the validity for another thesis. That is of course NOT TRUE!. For each thesis the validity to be proven on it's own logical arguments and objective proof. Example : that the Bible does not mention telephones, electricity, petrol, cars, planes, rockets, or astronauts in space, etc. does nor mean that these do not exist, nor that the Bible is wrong. So T777's suggestion is therefore illogical and incorrect. ( From here on abbreviated to I & I ). *Note02* Similar to note 01 : I & I. *Note03* There is not one type of eye. The construction of the eye is everything but perfect. Some eyes (insects) are multifaced. Other eyes monogramatic. Or hardly functional at night. It's evolution that provided each animal species including humans with the eye that suited them in their natural niche most. So : I & I. *Note04* DNA is not a (and/or has no) "advanced programming language". It's actually nothing more than a copying system. A very bad copier which makes many mistakes. It's product is a copy of a code that instructs a cell what to do. From very basic life forms to human beings. Neither is the basic data more complex than that of any MAC or PC. the DNA of a virus contains about the same data as one page of MSWord. The higher the animal (the more advanced) the higher the quantity of code : a perfect support for evolution! So here again : I & I. *Note05* Simple cells. There are no simple cells. Single cells are not simple cells. The first cell will have been very primitive, most probable much simpler than that of a virus of today. Science can not precisely tell how the first cell came into being, but the thesis based on "clay copying" seems to be very promissing. At this moment we do not yet know xactly. But it is surely more promissing than proving God's existence. So once more : I & I. *Note06* Unlike suggested : the first single cell came most probably from pond scum, as there the conditions seem to have been optimal for the cell development. If it did is not known. Pond scrum certainly was not on itself a form of life -just a basin full of nutrients and water (a "soup"). As in note04 was stated "we do not yet know how the first living cell developed. But that is on itself no proof for the existence of God : I & I. *Note07* The turkey : a "chicken or the egg" argument. This is another example of evolution. Animals adapting to changing habitats : million of species will have died (out), but others found the right way to breed (often by luck or learning). More I & I. *Note08* Macaws : Another example of evolution. Animals adapting to changing habitats : million of species will have died (out), but others found the right way to breed (often by luck or learning). More I & I. *Note09* If you cannot provide a "plausible answer" for a specific question that is not objective proof for the existence of God. Just I & I. Conclusion : In none of T777's 9 arguments I have found one single iota of objective proof for the suggested existence of God. Of course : One can BELIEVE that god exists. No problem. But there is no objectibve proof for that suggestion anwhere! John --- You may reply by sending an email to "[email protected]" Or use my free "form" emailbox : Type your reply in the white box and click the "transmit" button please!
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