Damaris RICE by Sandy Clunies 04 March 1990 ------------------------------------------------ From the "Supplement to the RICE Family" genealogy, and found her listed in the 4th Generation of immigrant Edmund RICE: Edmund RICE = Thomasine FROST ..Thomas RICE = Mary KING ...Thomas RICE = 1) Mary --- ,d. 13 May 1677, 2) Anna RICE [RICE book says they m. in 1717, Torrey's N.E. Marriages says it was 10 Jan 1681/2] ....Damaris RICE = James BRADISH "Damaris RICE b. abt 1688 Westboro; d. 25 Dec 1769 Westboro m. James BRADISH 16 Jun 1708; b. abt 1675; d. 13 Feb 1763 Westboro, s Joseph BRADISH and Mary FROST." Then it lists the 10 BRADISH children And this: "Letter from D.E. Bradish to Harry Rice, dated 1936, states he had examined two deeds in Worcester than proved Damaris RICE was the child of Thomas RICE. [of Gen 3]" Now this creates a problem. Note Thomas RICE of Gen 3 had 2 wives: first one, Mary died in 1677 and the RICE book states he did not marry again for 40 years until 1717 when he married his first cousin Anna RICE. At the time of a 1717 marriage, Thomas would have been 73 years old and his cousin-wife Anna RICE (b. 19 Nov 1661) 56 years old. But Torrey has the 2nd marriage date of 1681/2 - much more likely anyhow for a widower to remarry soon, and that would have made his first cousin-bride Anna RICE just 20 years old, and of childbirth age to be the mother of Damaris. * Origin: GreyEagle_Point/346 <* Derwood, MD *> (1:109/312.346) 364/704 17 Mar 90 19:03:00 From: Donna Przecha To: All Subj: Rice Family Attr: ------------------------------------------------ Looking for Truman Rice (b.c. 1785) md. Lois Hoten (Haughton, Horton?). He was supposed to be born in Clarendon, Rutland Co, VT. Found in 1810-1840 census of Essex Co. NY. Moved to Portage Co, Wisc. in 1856. Looking for information on his birth and parents names. --- QuickBBS 2.64/O Beta Basher at Large! * Origin: San Diego's Genealogy Central (619) 469-1354 (1:202/114) 129/34 212/853 24 Mar 90 15:11:16 From: Robert Gleason To: Sandy Clunies Subj: RICE Attr: ------------------------------------------------ Sandy -- Captured your message to Donna Przecha re:RICE. While you're looking can you see if you can find parentage/ancestry of Laura RICE--according to Timothy Hopkins book--b. at Mount Holly, Bennington County, Vermont, 10 May 1796. She m. Truman HOPKINS at Potsdam, New York, 19 March 1815. He was b. at Pitsford, Vermont, 27 February 1793. Hopkins says that "In the fall of 1835, Mrs. HOPKINS with her children removed to what was then Williams County, Ohio. -- ANY information concerning this lady will be much appreciated. Thanks, Bob. ====================================================================== = ROBERT GLEASON, 166 Brighton Ave., E. Orange, NJ 07017 / (201) 676-2068 ====================================================================== ------------------------------------------------ 354/601 06 Apr 90 18:06:25 From: Sandy Clunies To: Donna Przecha Subj: RICE SURNAME NY/VT ------------------------------------------------ Donna, checked in the big Edmund RICE supplements and found two men named Truman RICE, but neither seems to fit: Truman W. RICE, son of Ephraim RICE Jr.(c.1794-1884) & Betsey MAYNARD who lived in Wardsboro, VT. (Betsey b. Hubbardstown MA c.1797, d. 1881, dau. Oliver & Ann MAYNARD). This Truman RICE m. Lydia A. HOWE 30 Nov 1848. Truman RICE b. 9 Nov 1833, son of Asa RICE (son of Cyrus & Ruth RICE) and Relief RICE (dau Martin & Lucy RICE). I think Truman is a *very* unusual first name, and to have found it twice in the Desc. of Edmund RICE collection, I still think YOUR Truman is an Edmund RICE desc., Donna! ------------------------------------------------ 085/892 8 Jun 90 23:03:52 From: Marylou Barrett To: Larry Osheim Subj: Re: RICE ------------------------------------------------ Thanks for the information on your RICE family. I am looking for a Charles RICE though mine was born earlier and I can't find him after 1845. A brief summary of my RICE family: Elijah RICE b ca 1770 VT, CT, NY? ; d 1828 Mentz, Cayuga Co, NY m ca 1793 Bahama BAKER b ca 1770 d ca 1848 Cayuga Co, NY parents and place of origin unknown Their 12 children all probably b Cayuga Co, NY Sally RICE b ca 1797; d Apr 1833 m ca 1823 Levi STEVENS; resided Little Valley, Catt Co, NY Elias RICE b ca 1798; m Eliza;resided 1860 Macomb Co, MI; he had dau Bahama RICE plus others Elijah RICE Jr. b 1799; d 1868 Homer, Will Co, IL (likely twin to Elisha) m1 Anna; m2 Maria PADDOCK Elisha RICE, b 1799; absconded to Michigan (1843?) (likely twin) m Lavina CURTIS Lydia RICE, b 1801; m ca 1820 Levi SHOALS; resided Lapeer Co, MI 1850 Celistina RICE, b ca 1803; prob d 1849; resided Cayuga Co, NY m 1822 John W SMITH Bahama RICE, b 1805; d 1891; m 1833 William TANNER; r Genesee and Shiawasee Co, MI Benjamin B. Rice, b 1806; d 1874 Elkhart, IN m1 Rhoda HAMBLIN, m2 Hariett Malvina BRIDGES Charles RICE, b ca 1810 Dorcus RICE, b 1812; d 1898; m Hugh SLATER; r Cayuga Co, NY;no descendants Allen RICE, b 1817; d 1903 Van Buren Co, MI m 1844 Laura Adelia BARNES Mary RICE, b 1820; d 1845; m 1841 Stephen B. HARLOW; r Cayuga Co. NY no descendants I have information on the families of most of the children. Those who left NY appeared to stay in southern Michigan, or northern Indiana or Illinois though we did find one child of Benjamin living in Dallas, Texas in 1900. I am descendant of Allen and I have contacts with descendants of Benjamin RICE and Bahama RICE TANNER. The TANNER's move to Washington State in early 1900's ------------------------------------------------ 513/829 27 Aug 90 22:55:24 From: Marylou Barrett To: Don Badger Subj: Re: William STEVENS ------------------------------------------------ I've been chasing descendants of Elijah RICE b ca 1770 and Bahama BAKER They resided in Cayuga Co, NY in 1800 and had 12 children: Sally RICE, b ca 1798, m Levi STEVENS d ca 1833, Catt Co, NY Elias, b 1798, m Eliza, r Shelby, Macomb Co, MI Elijah, b 1799, m1 Anna, m2 Maria PADDOCK, d 1868 Homer, Will Co, IL Elisha, b 1799, m Lavina CURTIS, (absconded to MI ??) Lydia, b 1801 m Levi SHOALS, r Lapeer Co, MI Celistina b 1803, m John W. SMITH, r Cayuga Co, NY (prob d 1850) Bahama, b 1805, m William TANNER, d 1891 Genesee Co, MI Benjamin B., b 1806, m1 Rhoda HAMBLIN, m2 Harriett Malvina BRIDGES, d Elkhart, IN Charles b ca 1810 Dorcas, b 1812, m Hugh SLATER, d 1898, Auburn, Cayuga Co, NY John Allen, b 1817, m Laura Adelia BARNES, d 1903, Van Buren Co, MI Mary, b 1820, m Stephen B. HARLOW, d 1845, Cayuga Co, NY Dorcus and Mary did not have any living descendants. I'm descendant of #11 John Allen RICE. I'm also corresponding with descendants of Benjamin RICE #8, and Bahama TANNER #7. You make the 4th!! I'll send you what I have on the STEVENS family. Are you interested in the early RICE family as well? I'd like information on any of the descendants of Levi and Sally (RICE) STEVENS and will pay for copies. -- Mary Lou ------------------------------- Date: Thu Nov 15 1990 01:12:40 From: Kendal Ramstad To: Judie Delaine Subj: WHEELER, BATES, RICE, FROST ------------------------------- Hi I saw you are researching the Rice and Wheeler families, I have quite a History on my wifes side She is related to Deacon Edmund Rice Born 1594 Died 5/3/1663 I think there are some Wheelers in the branches of this family Also I am related to Millicent Wheeler she married Josiah Stone apparently in Rhode Island about 1790 Josiah was born in Wales in 1759 and served in the Continental Army for Rhode Island. Latter they moved to Chautauqua Co, New Yok, Are any of these people in your family, can you tell me a little more about Millicent Wheeler. Maybe I can help some with your Rice research. Kendal Ramstad 1920 Brockman Ave. Marion, Iowa, 52302 Date: Sun Nov 25 1990 08:01:05 From: Kendal Ramstad To: Judie Delaine Subj: WHEELER, RICE, AND MORE Attr: genealogy ------------------------------- Thanks Judie, I don't know how much I can tell you about Deacon Edmund Rice, Apearently He was born in Sudbury England, in Buckinghamshire, this is on the Eastern side and North of London, and I can Imagine there is quite a little ancestry from the Normans of France, who settled heavily here. Anyway I have he was born there in 1594, or else posibly somewhere in Ireland? He was the son of William Rice II, born in 1522, and knighted in 1555, the Rice name itself comes from a Sir Rhys Ap Thomas, who was knighted when he rushed to help, install King Henry the VII, and end the War of the Roses. I thought I saw his name Mentioned, maybe in Shakspears Richard the III, in that conection, but couldn't spot it for you the other day when I looked. Edmund Rice, married Tamazine Frost Hosmer, in Sudbury, I'd guess about 1616 or 17, and I have quite a list of their Children I'll send, He then left England and apaerently an older Brother Thomas, and Came to America in 1638, as his son Edmound, His 9'th child was born on the way. There they settled in Sudbury Mass. Edmund later Married a Mercie Bent, and I was thinking a third wife, who was the daughter of the wealthiest farmer in the comunity at the time. I'll try and work up what I have and mail you a Line. Thanks for all your help. Kendal Ramstad 1920 Brockman Ave Marion Iowa, 52302 --- TMail v1.17 * Origin: Cedar Valley DataNet - Cedar Rapids, Ia. (319-393-4588) (1:283/135) Date: Tue Nov 27 1990 06:46:29 From: Sandy Clunies To: Kendal Ramstad Subj: Edmund RICE Attr: genealogy ------------------------------- Please, Kendal! You have been handed some myths about Edmund RICE which have long been disproven by New England Historic Genealogical Society (NEHGS) - there is a lot of fanciful fiction on the bookshelves about him. I have discussed this with genealogists at NEHGS, and had their guidance to search, and have sifted through dozens of sources and have for myself a fairly clear picture of him - though - like you - I fell for a lot of nonsense about knights-in-armor when I first began, and hadn't learned yet to search EVERY reference available! Anyone can publish a book, but the genealogical journals have much higher standards for their articles, and I needed to learn to judge the QUALITY of evidence before accepting it. Now there IS a long and well-documented history of his wife Thomasine FROST (no HOSMER in her name) (they did *not* marry in Sudbury ENG - NEHGR XV:227 published from Registers of St. Mary's, Bury, Suffolk their marriage there 15 Oct 1618, and first child's baptism at Stanstead, Suffolk 23 Aug 1619 - which also proves he was *not* given any royal treatment in N.E.), back through the FROST/BELGRAVE/STRUT families to the 1400's. - (BTW, 2nd wife was Mercy HURD, widow of Thomas BRIGHAM , who m. 3rd William HUNT). I refer you to: M.L. Holman's "Stevens-Miller" (1948); TAG XI:14 which disproved the royalty myth in 1935; the excellent "Puritan Village" by Sumner Chilton Powell and all the books published by the Deacon Edmund Rice Assocation Inc. as "the" resources for Edmund RICE data. If you're interested in updated info, let me know and I'll send you some. I know it's fun to think we've captured a knight in the net ... but in the case of Edmund RICE, it's simply not true. Just someone's poor scholarship a hundred years ago, and another wealthy person's crazy book publishing the imaginary information ! ---Sandy --- msged 1.99S ZTC * Origin: GreyEagle_Point/346 <* Derwood, MD *> (1:109/312.346) Date: Thu May 02 1991 20:08:23 From: Marylou Barrett To: William Geissinger Subj: Re: Tiny Tafel Attr: genealogy ------------------------------- WG> R200 1728 1728 Rice Where are your RICE located? I'm searching Elijah RICE b 1770 r Cayuga Co, NY 1800, d 1828. m Bahama BAKER. Believe Elijah may have been born in CT or possibly VT. - Mary Lou Barrett, 13017 SE 171 PL, Renton, WA 98058 --- via Silver Xpress V2.28 [NR] * Origin: Seattle Software Exchange *HST\V32\V42* (206) 637-2398 (1:343/8) Date: Sat May 04 1991 11:45:08 From: Bob Gleason To: Marylou Barrett Subj: RICE Attr: genealogy ------------------------------- > WG> R200 1728 1728 Rice > > Where are your RICE located? I'm searching Elijah RICE b 1770 > r Cayuga Co, NY 1800, d 1828. m Bahama BAKER. Believe Elijah may > have > been born in CT or possibly VT. > - Mary Lou Barrett, 13017 SE 171 PL, Renton, WA 98058 Marylou. I'm still trying to find parentage/ancestry of my Laura RICE m. Truman HOPKINS [my ggggf]. Interestingly, they had a son, Oney Rice HOPKINS. Checking the 1840 Williams Co., OH census [for SAWYERs--Artemesia SAWYER m. Oney Rice HOPKINS] I discovered that in Farmer, OH there were Oney RICE, Sr., Oney RICE, Jr. as well as Oney Rice HOPKINS. Williams Co., marriage records show that Oney RICE Sr. was the J.P. who performed the marriage of Oney Rice HOPKINS and Artemesia SAWYER. Since family bible indicated that Laura RICE was born in Mount Holly, Rutland Co., VT, I checked the IGI for VT and found Oney RICE, b. 6 Oct 1773, Clarendon Twp., Rutland Co., VT, s/o Nathan RICE/Molley [making him a prime candidate to be Laura's father]. I just checked my IGI for CT and VT. The closest to 1770 is Elijah Rice, b. 5 Apr 1771, Glastonbury, Hartford Co., CT s/o Samuel RICE/Susanna. There's also an Elijah RICE, b. 13 Oct 1779, Simsbury, Hartford Co., CT, s/o Joseph RICE/Abigail CASE. Another Elijah RICE, b. 14 Oct 1764, Dummerston, Windham Co., VT, s/o Ephraim RICE/Joanna. Somewhere, Marylou, we MAY connect our RICEs. ;-) I'll keep your data on file and if I find anything close to what you need I'll let you know. Please keep me in mind when researching your RICEs. ========================================================== Bob Gleason, 166 Brighton Ave., East Orange, NJ 07017-1801 ========================================================== --- * Origin: Kin Ships - East Orange, NJ - (201) 676-7066 - (1:269/123) Date: Thu Jul 25 1991 19:55:17 From: Bob Harshbarger To: Sandy Clunies Subj: Rice Attr: genealogy ------------------------------- My wife was at the Champaign, Illinois, LDS library today and came across a wedding date for Edward Frost and Thomasine Belgrave on 21 Sep 1584 in Glemsford, England. My wife was a Rice and has most of Edmund's line down to her. She doesn't have much back from Edmund - only that his father was Henry. Anything you or anyone may have back from Edmund Rice (b.1594-d.1663). would be appreciated. --- Maximus-CBCS v1.02 * Origin: the Relative Connection : Genealogy and more (1:233/16) Date: Mon Dec 30 1991 00:32:00 From: Steve Kyner To: George Ferguson Subj: Re: GATES Attr: GENEALOGY ------------------------------- George, Your citation on Persis GATES provides exactly the lead I needed. Thanks very much. "A Genealogical History of the Rice Family: Descendants of Deacon Edmund Rice" (1858) provides all 8 of the children of Persis and Adonijah RICE: Persis: you have Adonijah: b. 12 Sep 1742, had a family in Ballston Spa, NY Abel: b. 29 Mar 1746, m. Anna NICHOLS Mary: b. 10 Feb 1750, m. Joseph GOODWIN Seth: had a family and died in Guilford, VT Susan: you have Abigail: m. _?_ GOODNOW, lived in Guilford, VT Jonas: m. Elizabeth CARVER. My wife descends from the last, Lt. Jonas, b. 26 Jun 1755 in Worcester, MA, d. 17 Feb 1839 in Orwell, VT. I will look for the Stephen Gates book at NEHGS, but in the meantime if you can post an outline of dates, places and wives for # 33 Jonathan, # 6 Simon and # 1 Stephen, I would be very grateful. I see Stephen and his son Simon in J. Savage, but Savage makes no mention of Jonathan. Thanks again. -- Steve --- QuickBBS 2.75 * Origin: Roots and Branches - Billerica, Ma (508) 670-9053 (1:324/281) Date: Sat Jun 27 1992 16:33:00 From: Jim Rice To: Robin Janda Subj: REISS/REIS and RICE Attr: GENEALOGY ------------------------------- Saw your reply to my last REISS/REIS/RICE message but have not downloaded and read it carefully yet. I believe you said you have a friend near the library in Indiana that holds the REISS/RICE family history book and may be able to check on it for us. However, that may not be necessary. I checked this afternoon at the local LDS/FHC, and Salt Lake City does have this book, including a microfilm version which we can borrow through any local FHC (I think the rental is $3.00). Their listing also gives a summary of the contents and it was as follows: "Zachary RICE (REYS, REISS) (1713-1819) immigrated from Germany to Chester County, Pennsylvania about 1750, married Abigail HARTMAN in 1757, and moved to Juniata County, Pennsylvania in 1790. Descendants live in Pennsylvania and elsewhere." Regarding the possible Jewishness of REISS and REIS, the situation gets more confusing, the more I look into it. A RICE 1st cousin of mine in Birmingham, AL (my hometown) recently talked to me about a REISS or REIS that had called him on the phone and discussed name similarities with RICE. Last week, I called a REISS and a REIS in Birmingham to see what I could stir up. Both of them were Jewish and pronounced their name reese, although they both knew that the correct German or Austrian pronunciation would be more like RICE. As is the case with you, I know of no Jewish ancestry, and I assume my parents, aunts and uncles didn't either. However, I do have the recorded comments of the son-in-law of a RICE great uncle, where he said that, "both the RICE's and HEADRICK's were black dutch". He was referring to my paternal, paternal great grandparents, James Monroe RICE (JMR) and Sarah (Sally) HEADRICK (SH). JMR was born 1803 in TN (presumably east TN) and was the son of James RICE and Rebecca BORDEN. SH was born abt 1809 in TN (probably Greene County) and was the daughter of John HEADRICK (PA "Dutch" who came to TN with his father, William HEADRICK ca. 1783) and Elizabeth MYERS (also German but not sure if from PA). You have probably seen the various BBS messages discussing the term "black dutch" and know that there is no consensus on what it means. However, one of the interpretations is that the "black dutch" were dark haired and dark complected Germans who were descended from Jewish ancestry out of Spain. I have no idea how all this comes together or if it is even half way accurate. Do you? I have a neighborhood friend who is German (in fact, she is in Germany now visiting her mother), and, as a child there, she knew a fair number of REISS's and REIS's, none of whom were Jewish. She thought there probably had been more REIS's than REISS's, and she tried to coach me a bit on the subtle difference in pronunciation. Aside from the glottal "R", REISS sounds very much like a sharp, crisp (shall we say a yankee-like) RICE. The REIS drags out a bit at the end and sounds more like rize (as in size). Keep me posted on your findings. Of course, you have some REISS record, and I do not. I'm only pursuing this on a hunch, based largely on the fact that my two earliest known RICE men married women of either known or likely German origin. Actually, I'd kind of like to find that my earliest James RICE was the son of the Thomas RICE of VA that died at sea on the way back to England to claim an inheritance. I think those folks have a lot on that line. I recently saw a message (believe it was from Billy McCAGE) stating that Thomas did have a son, James. An older son, David, was apparently born ca. 1733. It's possible that the younger son, James, might have been born late enough to have been the right age to marry the Rebecca BORDEN, born ca. 1753 in VA. I guess I need to put up a general query on that. * SLMR 2.1a * Researching: TYLER, NEAL, COLE, BORDEN, RICE, MYERS --- WM v2.01/92-0181 * Origin: Options Unlimited BBS (404)543-5468 Athens, GA (1:370/70) Date: Sat Oct 17 1992 14:15:26 From: Marion Leska To: All Subj: EDMUND RICE ca 1600, Mass. to Present. Attr: GENEALOGY ------------------------------- Compiling large database on Edmund Rice and all his descend{ants with BK5. Would appreciate your "Rice" lineage to add to the pile. Marion Leska 265 Albatross Street Fort Myers Beach Florida 33931 Thanks, Marion. --- Maximus 2.00 * Origin: CSPI-TWO (1:371/1302)