Just in case you've missed the saturation coverage, meet me, Eli Lisa, Sally, Anna and anyone else passing in Hyde Park. 12:30 Sunday. Be there, or be someplace else. More details: see the sig.
Antepenultimate thought on Bill Clintern. Remember back in January, when Hillary appeared on breakfast television? She said that if it was proven that Bill had lied, that would be A Different Matter Entirely. But now we find that he had lied; so, now is it serious?
Angela and Andi interact
summer bad!
Summer good
And summer best left on the shelf, cutting straight from spring
to autumn.
[picky="on"]
~Laura quotes
"Don't let the sun go down on me." ~Elton John~
Psst. Elton writes the tunes. Bernie Taupin writes the words.
[picky="off"]
Betsy quotes
Liquor before beer, you're in the clear. Beer before liquor...
never sicker.
Ooh! Didn't expect to see that one again in a long time. In the
UK, it's generally "wine before beer", but there's never any
agreement on whether that's the good or bad combination. Further
details are on the "Notes and Queries" pages of the Grauniad
~~Britt
Season: autumn and early winter
Favorite Radio Station(s): 92.7, 104.3
Oh, wow! I thought I was the only fan of those two. Radio Four,
home of the Archers, and Radio Cymru. Very impressed that you
can understand the latter one...
Can't argue with that, can we.
Krys
When did we change the spelling of my name?
Dammit, Lixz, she noticed.
Angela
Dream Car: The Jetsons car
Do u smoke: Only during sex. Oh, you didn't mean that...
Someone's been listening to too much Bill Clintern gossip. And,
yes, that's the penultimate reference.
Goodness! Someone else who remembers the Jetsons! George! Jane!
Judy! Elroy! Astro! And wasn't Judy a bit of a babe... well, I
thought so...
Sara
I've gotten fines for certain things..does that mean I'm
convicted of it?
and what if they told me that one of my fines would go away if
I stayed out of trouble for a year?
me and Ross are gong to have thanksgiving here!!! cause they
don't celebrate it
I don't listen to the radio here in England though...well,
except for the american station once in a while ;-)
they play such weird songs on their radios....I don't like most
of them.
b*witched just came on..I really like them
people have no fashion sense over here!
Look! It's the This Is True moment!
Probably.
That would just show that the Wisconsin legal system fails to
live up to its name. Of being systematic. It's full of more
loopholes than my mother's knitting.
This annoys me immensely. A public holiday in mid October would
be very pleasant indeed. (Psst: Can I join you guys, so long as
you use the Canadian date...)
Ooh, which American station would this be? I'm interested now.
Well, you see, radio design seems to have got stuck in the Black
Plastic Is Good era. They look - well - black. What, you mean
you don't like the songs?
Evidently not. Hey! Hey! Hey!
The whole "The doctors say X, but I know a friend of a friend who lived for 3X" thing. This is exactly the sort of innumeracy I obliquely mentioned last time. Of course you'll remember people who lived well past their sell-by date. If they move along before, you forget the optimistic prognosis. It's measured psychology.
Just to cite two examples - which prove diddly squatt. One of my grandparents was given "days" but lasted six months. Another was given five years one October, but didn't see the next new year.
And for an example of someone with a stated life expectancy of 83 but who fell nearly 60% short, watch any television station anywhere in the world this weekend.
Sara neatly sums up the fallacy.
You hear about people living for longer than they should have
all the time.
Just because, say, for altzheimers, the statistics say that
most people live from 4-8 years (or whatever) after getting it,
that doesn't mean that one person won't live for 10 years...or
20 years. However long...you can't jsut base it on statistics.
Examine the distribution. After the first year, it effectively
becomes a Normal distribution, with mean at 5 years, and
standard deviation of just over 2.5 years. So, 50% of sufferers
(actually, a little higher, owing to late diagnoses) are dead
after 5 years. 80% don't see 8 years. Only 5% see 10 years.
Less than 1% get past 13 years. One in a million might make 20.
This is simple statistics; that fewer people know it is an
indictment of the Western educational system.
An even stranger indictment is the tidal wave in the Atlantic I joked about two weeks ago. I presented it as a factual report of a prediction - given in good faith - of an event that clearly wasn't going to happen. Yet I now find that people left PEI, and cancelled vacations to Halif*x, based on that clearly inaccurate soothsayer. In spite of the fact that they were far more likely to be killed by a plane crash, food poisoning or an anvil falling out of the sky.
Brooks
Favorite town to chill in: london...eating an ice cream in the
park.
12:30, by the bandstand, Hyde. Hope you'll be there...
Emily, welcome back, old chap. Anna, greetings again. In your absences, we've conclusively established that green is the new red, blue is the colour, and the Florida Marlins aren't going to retain the world series.
Liz Variable Name
I would never change my name even if it weren't infinitely
cool, but, hey, it also is
Well, it's true that Lixz's name is amazingly cool. It also
seems to be infinitely long, if she's not changing it, just
bringing different names to the fore and letting us forget about
others...
Mark
Circumcision is sometimes a medically necessary operation
Also, it causes no harm to the patient.
I'd like to see them legislate against it and then try to
enforce it!
Irretrievable breakdown (as it is known in the British legal
system) is grounds for divorce.
That's the proposal that's been under discussion for about 5
years now. Under the current law, though, breakdown needs to be
demonstrated under one of the criteria I mentioned last time.
So is amputating an arm. I don't see that practiced on a regular
basis, though.
Well, doesn't it? There's a growing body of evidence to suggest
that it impairs the sexual performance of both parties.
I have a suspicion that New Labour New Nanny will try to do it.
Staying topical, Sara
To me, when boys are born, they get circumcised. To Ross, they
don't. I'd like our baby (if its a boy) to get circumcised for
heatlh reasons - I've read different facts and figures about
the number of infections you can get if you don't get it done -
not that you will get them, but that its more likely to get
infected in that area.
Talk with your doctor about this. Seriously. With proper care,
the risk of infection is kept to a very low level. The risk of
serious infection is already minuscule. Like I say, have words
with the professionals. Make them earn their keep!
Scratch my beard, it's the Wixzard of Salliwoo
Favorite Girls Name: Alisha
Favorite song of the moment: I forget the exact name...but
"what can I do you make you love me" or something like that. By
the Corrs I think! Ack,I'm useless!
Oh, you mean the Coors, performing "What Can I Do?". Who's
useless here? (No, that's not The Last Reference.)
It's those little things that rule the world (:
Kris is
Putting on her Raiders jersey and waiting for Sunday
The words "six" and "ten" spring to mind, for some reason.
Mrs Kenny the Ball quotes her friend in Hythe
"Ooh darlin! Ah've got just the thing for you! Lovely little
miracle 'eadache relievin' tablets they are! I'm sure they'll
work on your 'orrid old endo! I'll wrap some up and ship 'em to
you"!
I never knew they spoke Mockney in Hythe. I always thought it
was a more precise, BBC English, voice.
Anna
Favorite cartoon: Southpark and Scooby Doo
On this subject, Scooby Doo, where are you?
Sara again
Who is the DSS, and why do they assume that?
("That" being that cohabiting couples are married).
The DSS is the Department of Social Security, the government
ministry responsible for paying out money to the old, ill, out
of work and/or poor. They assume it in order not to be seen
penalising couples who *do* marry, after there was a small
outrage in the early 60s of people getting benefits precisely
because they weren't married. Oh, it also cuts down on their
bill, but that can't be the reason.
byron again
Those ads are correct. Lolita should have beat out Titanic for
best picture.
Ah, but it wasn't eligable for the "Titanic" awards. It will
be eligable for next year's awards, and I suspect it'll pick
up a few nominations.
Um, can I get on my soapbox a moment? All these lists of things beginning with a given letter... do they have to come to this list? There's enough postings as it is. Thanks.
But speaking of which, the returning shim packs
where's waldo books
wally
Not even adding "where's wally" books? Welcome back, anyway.
Amal
Divorce, by contrast, is a consentual termination of the
contract.
Even under the "five years separation regardless of consent"
rule? I think not.
Eric
The vows one offers at a wedding may be morally binding, but I
don't think they are legally binding.
In which case how would it be possible to prosecute on the
grounds of bigamy?
Sara
Or..maybe have it up to the spouse to decide what to do?
I'd go down this route. The adulterererererer (that's enough ER
- Bored Of Hospital Dramas Ed) is really not in a position to
dictate the pace. If the other partner wants to throw the book
at them, that's their choice. But if they think that the
relationship will survive better by forgiving and forgetting,
that's their call as well.
Lixz
the "man and wife" bit? Certainly seems sexist to me. (you're
now a man--a person--but this one's identify is now as a wife.)
Ah, the poetry of the Book of Common Prayer bumps up against
Modern Day Realities. And one of them has to give.
Brooks of the run-on phrases
in the case of *criminals* (not necessicaryly adulterereers)
they have broken the scocial contract which I feel is implict
by continuing to live in any scociety to act according to
certian limits
So, let me get this straight. Criminals break a social contract,
that much is clear. From that, either you're implying adulterers
are criminals for breaking their contract with society in
general, and a member in particular. Or you're saying adultery
doesn't break that social contract. There's no middle ground.
Lixz
I throw up from **brushing my teeth**
I almost do sometimes, too. Mouth too full of toothpaste, going
for that hard-to-reach spot at the top right outside. Not nice.
Betsy
These boys are good. OUr frist game is on Saturday. Wish us
luck!
I live like, not even 3 minutes away from my school if I drive.
How far is it to walk? And why aren't you walking: it'll probly
be quicker.
Good luck. Hope you do better than Metz!
Iain * keeper of Brian's calendar * icq 14441391
He didn't inhale, and he didn't impale * 12:30 Sunday...
Right, listen hard and listen closely. You could get your poetry published on an international stage, and win great kudos. Or something.
Since Slate's first issue, which included a poem by Seamus Heaney, we have published only poems solicited by our poetry editor, Robert Pinsky. That policy has helped to establish Slate as a place to read and publish poetry. The policy was also a necessity, since we didn't have a way to screen submissions. Now, with a screening system in place, we are pleased to announce that we are accepting submissions of unsolicited poetry.
Now listen closely. Poetry submitted for publication must be sent by snail mail (i.e., stamped paper mail) and accompanied by a self- addressed, stamped envelope. (No e-mail submissions, please.) Manuscripts should have the author's name and address on each page and should be sent to Slate Poetry, 236 Bay State Road, Boston, MA 02215. And don't forget the envelope!
Slate publishes one poem every week. You can read it and also listen to it in the voice of the author (or, if the author is dead, in the voice of Robert Pinsky).
Brum: rain & 17 * no snowflake falls in the wrong place * icq14441391
Anyone else coming to London to meet Eli? Mail me and bag the details.
Clearing up last week's matters. Officer Dibble and Benny the Ball are characters in the Hanna-Barbera animation "Top Cat". Retitled "Boss Cat" in the UK, owing to a commercial product bearing the "Top Cat" moniker.
Shana. Hugs. Big, huggy, tight ones.
Lisa
If we're talking *me*, which I'll have to assume we are, seeing
that the world clearly revolves around me
I got my A-level grades and I'm going to York (unless I change
my mind, which is highly probable.)
I got 2 and a half As and a B - cool!
What a weird life I lead. Pity me.
we got a nice review from The Scotsman.
"Och aye, it were goooood. From yon Sassenachs. But not worth the
entrance fee of twenty pence." (;
The answers are yes and yes, though maybe not in that order.
For those following the Paxman Ranking of Independent Centres of
Knowledge (PRICK) outlined last week, York is an Old, Established
university, and ranks below Cambridge but above the redbricks.
Tres impressive.
Tres impressive squared. I'm just about out-brainboxed here.
I have half a mind to. But 74% of a mind to be envious.
Sara
Where did the nice sunny days go?? :(
But if there is one that is genuine, and down-to-earth, than
great!!! I wish we had someone like that...
Okay, I was just about to go lay down and rest for the first
time in a long time..and *gasp* read a book instead of being on
the computer *grin* But Iain sucked me in
Right. I'll say this right now. If you were about to do something
more interesting, like read a book, whittle some wood, or
deconstruct the acting in the entirity of "Neighbours", go right
now and do it. Don't let me stand in the way of your self-
improvement.
They come in small doses, and have spent most of the rest of the
summer in St John's.
Hey, paws off, Sir Fatrick's ours. Go find one yourself.
On adultery
LOL...me and Ross were watching Jerry Springer yesterday, and
these people...gosh, they were so pathetic.
why is that so interesting?
you couldn't use that excuse to divorce someone - and get more
money
If someone cheats on you, then you have the right to divorce
them right away, since they broke their end of the contract.
I don't think it has anything to do with Jesus, or god, or
their teachings...I think it just has to do with what we all
know to be right and wrong. Or well...most of us know
Ah, but how do you know it? How are your morals created? From a
purely genetic standpoint, monogamy is not necessarily the best
option, so where does the moral standpoint that it is right
come from? I suspect it's primarily from cultural influences, and
they derive straight from the Judaeo-Christian teachings.
Can you be more specific? You've covered just about every episode
there...
Use your skill, judgement, and a bit of guesswork. And then
figure why I'm not badmouthing every target directly.
Don't remind me of that, thank you very much.
"But!" shouts a passing lawyer looking to poke her oar in. You
have the opportunity to divorce them on grounds of breach of
contract. You do not have any obligation to do that. And if
you choose not to, then there's precious little that can be done
about it.
Sidebar to deal with Sean
Blissfully, irreconcilable differences covers most all.
Not grounds for divorce in England. It's adultery, unreasonable
behaviour (a fair standard of proof needed), or two years apart
with consent (five without). Plus mandatory one-year cooling off
period, and a settlement reached before the divorce is granted.
Back to Sara. Points for marriage
I think thats kinda dumb...it takes out the choice of people.
What if i wanted to live with Ross, but not marry him..and yet
we had kids together, and bought a house together, etc.? well
that takes out our free choice to not be married, because we
would be 'technically' thought of as being married anyway.
Well, yes, but so is the DSS's assumption here that a womin and
man living under the same roof must be financially entwined,
and treated as though married.
So, you buy a house, run a joint account, have kids, and still
refuse to go through a legal / religious service? In the modern
society, it appears that marriage isn't so much the certificate
as the state of mind. If I come across some couple living in the
situation you've outlined, I assume they're married. Full stop.
Whatever the legal situation may be. The proposal I outlined last
time is an outline attempt at codifing that reality.
Look at Lixs' parents
My parents aren't married, but they've lived together for over
20 years. They usually have to show their joint ownership of our
apartment in order to prove, for official purposes, that they
are a "couple" (despite, well, me).
They own a property, they have offspring (quality doesn't count
for bonus points), and 20 years together. Yet the lack of a scrap
of paper causes some hassle in their lives. Utterly insane.
Sara on Reagan
Althoguh, I thought he had gotten Altzheimer's while in office,
but oh well
it seems this kind of thing happens with a lot of people - the
doctors tell them they will live for only a short while, or
they'll die right away, and they go on and on for ages.
Are there statistics to back up your argument, or is this just an
innumerate gut feeling?
As I said last time, that is a very improbable situation.
Michael
I wonder what would happened if someone tried to forbid it
(circumsision)?
There are groups active in the UK trying to do exactly that to
the male operation. So far, they're getting an airing in the
liberal press, but are marred by their chief spokesman's
obsession with the concept of "going willy-nilly".
Brooks enquires
people can be coerced to live with a lot of crap.
First, I wonder what it is taht if it comes to britain that you
will leave.
The Euro, the Single European Currency. The triumph of political
meddling over quarter-baked economics. The attempt to yoke
twelve disparate economies into one. It's bound to fail, and I
don't want to be around when it does.
Two words. Tonyblair Billclinton. (OK, that's four...)
On the Taliban
But I don't know that we can say that it is doomed and will fail
(failure being that it is supplanted by a new, more efficent (I
am not saying equitable or fair or just or right or nice or
crunchy) system.
In which case, by every standard, that regime is in a winning
position, as they haven't succeeded yet. In fact, they're so
far away that it will take a decade to restore Afghan society to
the level it was at when the Taliban insurgency picked up speed.
Mark ponders
the lack of leaf-tea availability in Canada and the US.
Catch flight AC 861 some day, and try to make sure you don't get
carried as far as Halif*x. In the Avalon Mall not 30 minutes from
the airport is the largest selection of loose teas (and coffees)
I've yet seen.
Oh, sorry, you mentioned Canada and the US (:
Brooks presages the Oxford Professor's visits
Just goes to show that Ronnie Reagan was always a bumbling
f***ing idiot.
(Yes, I edited it. So shoot me. That's shoot.)
Kristine
Kris~footballdutchess
Me don't even know where Albania is
I would suggest going to the video store and renting a copy of
"Wag the Dog", in which a US President under fire for his sex
life invades that far-off country, but events have been overtaken
by reality.
Predictions for the new season, please. SF or GB for the NFC
title? PIT or JAX for the AFC Central? Can anyone stop KC from
their charge?
Shobi contributes a long, scholarly, well-thought out analysis.
Thank you for taking the time to reply. I only have a few points
Presumably (I�m sure he�ll correct me if I�m wrong) he would
also then support laws criminalizing sodomy, prostitution,
incest, & fornication.
such laws are also used to get around Double Jeopardy by
punishing people twice for what is essentially the same act.
It appears that they're used to punish people multiply for what
is the same act. That is Multiple Jeopardy. Charge them with
the lot, make the alternatives available to the jury as
appropriate, but only punish on the largest offence. Anything
else is stinkingly poor jurisprudence.
As something that society wishes to actively discourage, then I
see no problem in such laws remaining on the statute book. If
a significant minority of society wishes those laws to change,
then change the statutes should.
Incidentally, prostitution itself is not illegal in England. But everything else - soliciting, running a brothel, kerb-crawling - is. Go fig.
My bottom line is that if a law is enforced, and a sizable minority sees that enforcement as unjust, they will complain, and ultimately get it changed. The English law on adultery is never enforced, AFAIK. The law on sodomy is only enforced for acts in a public place, which falls outside the private arena Brooks concentrates on. Fornication is also disused. Incest is used, but very rarely. There still seems to be a societal taboo on knowingly commiting incest; the English law needs at least one side to know (or have reasonable suspicion) they're committing incest to prosecute.
Paddock
QED
Read up on f***ing genetics and DNA.
Something that an Oxford don like yourself would know like the
back of your hand.
Erm, what is demonstrated, exactly?
Chelle, an interesting biological exposition, which goes to show the dubious ground behind the incest laws. Personally, I don't think it's the biggest battle in the area to fight (16 for gays is more pressing, IMO), but it may come in the future.
If anyone wants to tag me in the ongoing tale, please cc me in personally, else I'll most probably miss it. Thanks.
And finally. Meet me an' Eli in London very soon. Did I mention there would be chocolate involved?
Brum: showers & 19 * icq 14441391 * keeper Brian's calendar
Well, greetings from here. Later, the Back to School Date Debate, what a man thinks, and a half-decent politician. But first, those big human rights issues.
Michael
Some tribes have _very_ painful initiation rituals, when
children are being tortured. Will you forbid them?
And how about circumcision? Isn't it a way of mutilation?
Every human being has it's brain to decide, what's good/bad for
his/her body/soul.
as long as a victim agrees to be a slave, tortured, or even
killed, there's no problem. Nobody and nothing can say "it's not
important what you think, I know better what's good for you".
Laws should protect people, who _don't agree_ to be treated that
way.
Indeed they should. The extension of the legal process into the
activities of consenting adults is not the most wonderful of
concepts. In fact, it's not something I expect the nation state
to do without a very good reason.
It's a hard call, but are they consenting adults? If so, we
have no duty interfering into their affairs. If they're not
adults, or consenting, then we may wish to express concern.
Circumcision of eight day old children? Neither consenting nor
adults. The female equivalent? Dittoes.
It is for the individual to decide. Not the state.
~~Britt
I just found out that school (college) starts on September 1st,
which totally and completely SUCKS!!!
Goodness, starting while New Orleans are still in the Super Bowl
hunt. That is early. For international comparison, English
schools will be going back on or around September 8; Scottish
schools went back last week, both after a six week holiday.
Colleges return a week later, and university terms kick off circa
Sept 20. So expect Huey back then, and maybe a new address for
Lisa.
Kris
I have to call about 100 people who were flaked on back in June
to see if they are still interested in getting a home loan, then
I have to pre qual them, then I have to input and call the
interested people back and tell them what they qualify for
Sounds great. [/sarcasm] Something broadly similar at work for
me. All the folk in my company are entitled to a laptop to do
company business, and as technology advances, they get replaced
on a rolling basis. So, one of the guys comes in, expecting a
high-powered machine. For whatever reason, he's only been
allocated a slightly lower-spec machine, but still miles better
than the one he has. But, instead of swallowing some pride and
not being so greedy and envious, he flounces off with his old
machine in tow. Such avarice. Such a glutton for punishment. Such
lust for petty trinkets. And how do I work sloth into that tale?
Sara
Maybe they just live in a country where things happen that they
don't like...but they don't want to leave their country. Why
should they have to, just to be treated decently?
others are ignorant and don't know that not all culturues/
societies are like that. I can't really say anything, because
I've never really lived anywhere like what I'm describing
there are some people that don't know any better, and don't know
that they could have a better life, or that they could be
happier with a different life.
If they choose to stay in that society/culture after they know
what the rest of the world is like (our countries at least)
Somebody's politics can't be great if they are lying to the
public. LOL..tahts why we have no good politicians!!!
Objection from the floor. I put forward the case of Sir Patrick
Cormack (Conservative, Staffordshire South). A more genuine,
down-to-earth and downright honest politician I know not of.
The man just cannot tell it like it isn't, even if that crosses
party lines.
Oh dear, I'm really showing my age by pointing to Paulo's sigs.
Countries are just names and lines on maps. It's people that
make the difference.
Can we quote you on that (=:
I will leave the comment here to the reader's imagination.
Sara, a little cultural imperialist? Shome mishtake shurely!
Angela, Oceanraine: hugs and thoughts with you...
Salliwoo: more thoughts, hugs and of you.
On the adultery is (or not) illegal topic, Sara
adultery is against the law just by itself, since you are
signing into a contract that states that you will be faithful.
they *can* come into effect..but not because of the bible.
Basically because those things are morally wrong.
Ah-ah, I won't let you have it both ways. Why are these things
morally wrong? In what way are they morally wrong? Because the
bible, and 4000 years of Judaeo-Christian teaching, say so!
Interesting ... very interesting [eyebrow lowering again]
Lixz on marriage contracts
BTW, what specifically goes into a marriage contract? Is there
necessarily a "clause" (written or un-) that prevents adultery?
Obligatory Declaration of English Custom and Practice goes here.
If the marriage is solomized in a religious context (which, I
believe, is restricted to Christian, Jewish, Islamic, Hindu and
Sikh faiths), the legal "contract" is deemed to be that contained
in the religious ceremony - all of the above prohibit adultery.
If it's done in a registry office, there is a stated requirement
to not marry anyone else. However, there is still a law from
the Interregnum criminalizing adultery; it's never enforced, but
it is there.
Of course, there is no tradition of drawing up pre marriage
contracts specifying what happens on divorce; such contracts have
been rejected by courts until very recently as they might cause
one side to petition for divorce before they would without the
agreement.
I much prefer to let people make whatever agreements they like
and as far as marriage goes, stay out of it. Don't recognize
marriages (beyond recognizing long-term/"serious" relationships
in terms of benefits like health care), don't make adultery
illegal.
An idea floated a year or two ago: establish marriage by points.
Living together for some time would establish x points, buying a
house or car together gives y points, having children z points, a
church service w points. If the points total went beyond a fairly
low level (s, say), then the social services might deem the two
were cohabiting; if the total went up to s', the pair would be
subject to the Messy Divorce Settlement Laws.
And such a system would have the side-effect of being adaptable
to couples other than womin-man...
I don't think that [adultery] should be an issue of the law.
Well, maybe it should, maybe it shouldn't. Personally, I see no
reason to remove the offence from the statute book, as it
signifies society's disapproval of adultery.
On Hillary
It *would* be in her self-interest to divorce him though.
I don't think it would. She would be known as The Ex Mrs
Cluntern, and not Hillary Roddham Greatlawyer.
Nichole forwards a piece alleging
Before him, it was Reagan, who left the office with the same
Alzheimer's he came in with.
government is doing more for less.
The budget is balanced for the first time since JFK did
And the stockmarket is higher than a D-student on a full gram of
dummy dust,
Medical fact: The survival time from first onset of symptoms to
death of Altzheimer's patients averages to 5 years, and is
rarely above 8. It's now (checks clock) 1998. Reagan left office
in (checks history book) 1989. Nine and a half years ago. It
seems inconsistent that he had that illness during his time in
office, still less that his judgement was significantly impaired
by it. But, if the liberals want to re-write the medical books...
[/obrush]
Yes, paying for a few people's legal expenses and diddly-squatt
for everyone else.
But what are you going to do with the surplus, Bill? Finance your
looming pensions deficit? Spend some of it? Oh, you're not going
to pay off some of the national debt. That's rotten economics.
(Search SLATE for further details)
and about to come down just as hard and fast. Oops, did I mention
hard in connection with Bill Cluntern? SMS!
Deca pretends to be a bloke
Me want sex. Me want woman. Me want food. Me want beer. Me want
football. Me not talk to woman.
Ah, that's a clever example. The dim ones go: Sex! Food! Sex!
Food! Sex!
Oh, stuff it. Sex! Food! Sex! Food! Oh, hi Mr Starr.
...and if you're really lucky you'll find some not
representative examples of the male human species whose thoughts
are more sophisticated.
We're still here...
Which leads Alan to quote Jeff Stillson
A woman is looking for one man to fulfill all her wants and
needs. A man is looking for all women to fulfill his one want
and need.
[working light] Ah-ha! It all makes a lot of sense. According to
the forgoing, all I'm looking for is intellectual conversation,
company, and rank stupidity from 52% of the world.
And more.
bronwyn (who's partner has just fallen fast asleep after sex.
isn't that always the way??)
Trust me... no... it's not.
Kris objects to being described as being in a catsuit. I suppose we could fight over this, but I'd sooner settle it with a Weaver Hug. Just, like, beware of my ribs cracking.
Angela
"Okay, suppose you have two cars crash into each other, what
happens?"
The Chippendales are a form of cheerleading squad. Whenever I've
seen them on television they certainly seem to inspire intense
(albeit inebriated) team spirit in the women attending...
Yes, but aren't most of the 'dales gay, and the rest are so vain
it's easy to confuse them. Ah well.
They wind up in the same place, and one of the drivers is usually
Alex Zanardi. (Why is there no crash magnet in F1 any more?)
On Mark's Scared-Of-Frogs mother, Angela suggests
Play "Froggy Went A Wooing" on the piano to entertain her.
Or, that old Singing Corner classic, "Frog went a-courting, he
did ride, ahum, ahum". Just remember to stop before getting to "I
Love my Shirt".
You don't even mind if it starts to get some holes in.
Codsall: showers & 17 * where's me jumper? * icq 14441391
keeper of Brian's next month calendar * rockette!
Later, the Great Baseball Match between the All-Starrs and the Clinternites. But first...
Lixz Update
I've decided to chop off like 4 inches of hair and dye the rest
dark brown.
Which means that the Official Wrigley Field Wallpaper becomes one
more hair style behind actuality. One day, maybe, there will be a
fully up-to-the-minute snapshot of The Variably Named One to
download. But I'm not holding my breath...
We Want Wrigley Field Wallpaper! if you don't know what I'm wittering about...
Kori
I got to watch Dawson's Creek! :) See, we don't have it here
cause the cable company is dumb
The cable company is a cable company. They're paid to be dumb.
Just like I pay the BBC, ITV, C4 and (5) not to show Buffy. I do?
Last time I buy anything advertised on tv...
Angela's brief "Previously, on List Alive"
Kris has gone berserk in a skintight cat suit
For those of us who have been around the block a little, this is
nothing to write home about. Distracting for you newcomers, I
suppose...
Shana is looking beautiful as is Liz
This is always true...
Eric is charming
...and this...
Iain is as witty and urbane as ever
...ah well, the facts had to end sometime.
Nichole ponders
can someone PLEASE explain the male mind to me?
And can they fill me in on how it works. Coz I'm supposed to be
driving one here, and making a complete hash of Being A Bloke.
Lauren's hair. Short, straight, funky. Who needs pictures when we have imaginations?
Betsy wonders whether to cheer or coach. Ducking under the thrown pom-poms, it takes more nous to coach than cheer. The team can't improve by itself. People can cheer without assistance, as they do at all British soccer grounds. And you'll get to be around the "hot guys" in a far more natural, less forced environment. For all the claims of non-sexism, when were there ever male cheerleaders? Players are male, pom-pom wavers aren't. It's a structured environment, and whoever breaks out of it will have a massive advantage.
Lixz again
To some extent we all must live with the laws of our society
because it's impractical to find something better or anything, but
I think there is a limit on what people can be forced to live with
For me, it's the Euro. If it comes to Britain, I leave. And you can
stick that up your Ikier designer furniture and sit on it, Mr
Blah.
Sorry, I'll get off my hobby horse now.
To some extent the Declaration denies cultures the freedom to set
themselves up in any way they like; but at the same time they
give freedom to the people within those cultures that I think is
MORE fundamental and MORE important.
Huey, Laura K, or Brem, or know when Shim's gonna be back or if
she is already?
The argument you're putting forward boils down to the rights of the
individual against the betterment of the whole. The example of
Taliban Afghanistan is valid, but it's clear that by disbarring 53%
of their population from doing anything, the society is not making
best use of its resources, and will fail. Is there an example of a
society that actually advances further by limiting the rights of
its citizens? War-time Britain springs to mind, for some reason.
Brem has departed these shores, and was most recently spotted
posting to the Kenickie list. Huey is taking a summer vacation; I
anticipate his return in a month or so. Krantz was last sighted on
a now-defunct list, and Maaaaaark's informed us where shim is.
Site 3 in the World Web Tour takes us around Manitoba. It has the obligatory news links, though yesterday their Flytrap coverage was primarily reader reaction, not wire reports. Arts, sports and "community" coverage, and a chance to win Cowboy Junkies tickets and goodies.
Sara
I don't think she should need to join the list to send something.
I really don't see how anything the church does or says has to do
with laws for a nation.
I DO think that they should have our western liberal values.
the bible should not be used to make laws. Not at all...
I don't like ketchup in general...or lettuce, tomatoes, onions...
Please remember than man cannot live by Reese's alone. Though
Sara's bally well going to have a shot. (:
Ah-ha! This looks like our point of difference.
In the way modern England is structured, 26 bishops have a vote in
the House of Lords. Yes, it's an unelected chamber. Yes, it doesn't
conform to the Liberal Democratic (read: American) ideal. But when
there's a government as arrogant and self-obsessed as the Blah
administration, they help play a valuable role in revising ill
thought out measures.
A point Brem was rather fond of: just because a certain way of
thinking is dominant at the moment doesn't mean it's there forever,
or that it's right.
In which case stealing is allowed. As is coveting your neighbour's
ass. And adultery is fine. So's murder. Each of those are
specifically prohibited in one book of the bible (you may have
heard of it...) but if the bible's not to be used to make laws,
then these prohibitions can't come into effect.
Stealing - coveting asses - adultery - murder. It's the Bill Cluntern Base Balls Section!
Sara is the lead-off hitter for the All Starrs
I can't believe that 65 percent of people thought his explanation
was reasonable.
he cheated on his wife - and so many times!!
If he can't even stay faithful to his wife, then why kind of
president could he possibly be?
I can't understand how people can still believe in and like
Clinton, when he has cheated on his wife and family.
Not that Hillary is any better...oh, I'm going to divorce my
husband, but not until after hes not president anymore...
it has nothing to do with other countries - basically they don't
even come into it.
he *is* an ordinary man in the street.
my opinion of people that cheat on their wives/husbands is the
lowest of the low.
If he can't even keep his vows to his marriage, then what *can* he
keep?
we all already knew he's slept with Monica Lewinsky
I think there's a "d" after the "w".
Well, he may have spoken accurately at that time. But given his
previous record, how can we possibly tell?
Gennifer Flowers. Paula Jones. Kathleen Willey. Monica L. And what
was with all the jogging sessions in the height of summer?
One that (er) cheats on his wife [/obobvious]
Liar, cheat, sneak, adulterer. How many of the ten commandments -
his god's ten commandments - is that he's snapped?
I think you may be doing Rodders a bit of a dis-service there.
She's a very astute person, and it wouldn't be in her self-interest
to divorce him. Though if he asks for one...
The benefits of hindsight [sigh]...
No he's not. Ordinary Man In The Street doesn't get to take off the
piss-poor summer programming by making a public statement OMITS
doesn't have a detachment of crack soldiers around him, ready to
rush straight to him if it needs to happen. Shame, really.
Interesting... [/raised eyebrow]
Good question.
Nichole plays at shortstop
Kings and Queens wouldn't be going thru all this I guess
Two words. Prince Charles.
Deca bunts
It all would've been just a little anecdote if he had simply
admitted it in the first place and so it wouldn't have turned into
a question about whether he forced other people to lie for him or
not.
If he hops into bed with other women then that's his problem/
pleasure and that of his wife respectively.
Insofar as that's all he's done, that would be true. However, there
are allegations that Clintern had incited people to lie, fib and
otherwise mislead in the Whitewater and Jones cases, then in
Travelgate, Filegate, the Democrat spending round, the cover-up,
the cover-up of the cover-up, and the alleged cover-up of the
cover-up of the cover-up of the alleged cover-up.
[re-reads above]
Yeah, that. So, basically, this just fits into a pattern of lying,
fibbing and generally misleading people.
Ah, but then it would only have reduced Starr's job to
investigating the cover-up of (oh, work it out for yourself!)
Trying to break Roger Maris' record in one series, Lixz
Personal decisions Clinton makes should only be evaluated
politically in terms of what actions they are LIKELY to make him
take politically, and that's not enough to kick someone out of
office.
But if those actions would bring the office of president into
disrepute - as may be the case here already - should he stay and
irreperably damage those who follow him? Cite Nixon for the "go!"
camp.
Sara hits into an infield fly for the All Starrs
I would like someone that actually honors the vows that they take
I'm on the right track..especially if we link this case directly
to Bill clinton, and not use it on people in general.
But you just can't do that! If you use it for president X, then
president X+5 (roughly) will be the next slightly sleazy character
to hold the office, and the precedent will be entrenched. Similarly
if the standard applies for the President today, it'll be Congress
members next year, state Senators the year after that, dog catchers
later, and it'll trickle down to everyone.
Would those be marriage vows or vows of office?
Under the bleachers runs a Brooks. Hey, this is Three Rivers...
rather than this lets try to do something useful like reduce
poverty or provide good, affordable health care.
Hey, why bring politics in now, just when we're enjoying it?
Seriously, though, wasn't Cluntern elected in '92 on a platform
rather like this (and stop the ban on gays in the military...)
Sara comes to bat again
as for the presidents that I know about, ALL of them had cheated
on their wives.
There is no better argument for making sure all presidents are
womyn. Most of them wouldn't cheat on their wives.
No doubt this battle will continue, but we're right out of time for this epic match here on (5). Now to our regularly scheduled programming, and a repeat of yesterday's Cheapo Quiz Show.
Brum: cloudy & 20 * Next stop for the battlebus: Torquay
keeper of Brian's calendar for next month * icq 14441391 * rockette
Well, I seem to have started a bit of a firestorm with my comments (yesterday) on Flytrap, the scandal engulfing President Clintern. David Plotz, the wonderfully named political editor of SLATE magazine, gives us 21 points to ponder...
President Clinton has left for vacation and the American people may or may not be "moving on," but Flytrap surely remains. The Speech may have guaranteed Clinton's survival, but it won't prevent more testimony by Monica and Linda, a possible presidential subpoena, a tough report by Starr, and congressional impeachment hearings. So, before Slate heads off on a short vacation of its own, I propose a Flytrap midterm: 20 questions to help keep you busy during the August scandal doldrums. Plenty of mysteries about Flytrap remain. Here's your chance to guess their solutions. In this test, as in the SAT, you won't know the results for months. Plotz's suggested answers are the ones indicated in bold.
Brum: cloudy & 20 * keeper of Brian's differently accurate calendar
England set SL 257 to win * Rockette!
From the Cold (as in flu) Capital of Britain, this is a sneezy, coughy writing.
Well, two years of Bronwyn. How did we ever manage without her? Gee, it's so long ago I've forgotten, and don't really want to remember. Yes, rising stars of the firmament.
And two years of shim. Two words. Glitter.
Angela
As we're so close to Windsor, Canada (about 45 minutes actually)
we do get The Bill but not whatever you were referring to.
Anyone else care to enlighten Angela about the origin of Benny
the Ball and Officer Dibble? I'll do it myself if no-one else
does. It's not something produced in Britain, no sir.
Life's ambitions. Hmm. To get out of Britain; regular listies know the rest. To be happy and/or rich. To be a passable radio presenter.
Now, in order to turn a 13K post down to a 7K one, I've snipped out my commentary on the human rights charter. It will be posted to my website over the weekend.
Sara
it is the *people* being treated different *because of* the acts
they choose to perform
The moral judgement might fall outside of the article, but what
they do because of the moral judgement doesn't.
Sex between two boys, sex between two girls, sex between a guy and
a girl, is all fundamentally the same. It's all sex.
Whether some people think it is 'morally' wrong to have sex with
someone of the same sex, the laws should not go on that moral
judgement. They should go on human rights, and the right that
people have to do what they want with regards to sex.
I did not write it, so therefore I am not responsible for it.
Rubbish. You forwarded it to the list. If you don't want to take
responsibility for it, don't forward it. There's no reason for the
original poster not to join the list and post it herself. As Sara
is forwarding the posts to the list, Sara's name appears at the top
of the post, and I'm accurate in quoting from a Sara post.
My point exactly. People do things, and are treated differently
because of that.
Nay, nay and thrice nay. The original article states that all
human beings are born free and equal in dignity and rights. There's
no mention of moral judgements in there.
There are obvious physical differences; no-one can deny that.
Whether this constitutes not making them fundamentally the same is
a moral call, one that a rights charter is really not in a position
to touch.
Erm, why should laws not go on moral judgements? Why should a
strict reading (or misreading: you go fig) of the Bible not be used
to base laws in a clearly Christian society such as England? Don't
bring up the separation of Church and State; that's an American
phenomenon, not an English one.
Not that I'm defending it in any way, mind. And, yes, I am very jealous of Canada's enlightened attitude. However, it's my view that the stick in the mud attitude is not an intrinsic breach of this article.
And on to Lixz
Furhtermore, I think it certainly is an issue of equality because
it's against the most very basic nature of equality to impose
arbitrary rules that affect certain groups in the population more
than others.
I don't understand your point that as the declaration is universal
it cannot deal with moral issues--that's precisely what it does,
in an attempt to establish limits on what is ever morally
acceptable.
But how can such a declaration possibly do that in a morally
and culturally neutral manner? From where I'm sitting, it feels
like an attempt to force Western liberal values onto the whole
world. Ultimately, this is a matter for each individual culture to
set its own boundaries.
My point is that this is not a good example of a breach of Article
1. Nothing more, nothing less. That article can logically pertain
only to the rights contained in the Declaration; so far, I've not
seen anything to assert or otherwise the equality of gays.
When one opens a can of worms, they go everywhere.
Deca enquires
And maybe she could clear up the confusion about how to adress her
properly? Mrs Bing? Mrs Forrest-Bing? Or him as Mr Forrest? Or how
about Forring? Or Brest?
Where *is* Mrs Bing??
Good question. I think she'll be posting later in the week, to
report her A-level grades. Hope she beat mine. In the one way she
can.
I'll stick with The Lovely Lisa.
Mark ponders the Great Fascist Quiz Show Hosts Of Our Time
Paxman's demoralising attitude/behaviour towards the toffee-nosed
kids that frequent University challenge is far more in line to
Parsons' own condescension to good 'ole British housewives in the
1980s.
Will that do, Iain?
Yee-ee-ee-ee-eees. Though Mark's analysis neglects to mention that
Paxman often appears to favour competing sides in this pecking
order:
~ Question or Nominate? ~
New on the UK Album Charts this week at #17: "Saturday Night Fever" by the Original London Cast. Someone will have something to say on that...
Angela brings up winning stuff on the web. I've won a Pepsi Pack,
from the sponsors of the Network Chart; and a Billboard hits CD
for knowing a lot about the EuroSong contest.
Am I the only person who would be totally stunned if Big Bill
actually confessed to ANYTHING today?
Well, he did, you know. After the leaks that have been coming out
over the previous days, the world had been softened up for some
sort of revalation like this maybe a culpa.
"This matter is between me... my wife and our daughter and our God" appeals to the Good Churchgoing Folk of America. Heck, if you're going to confess trouser-dropping, why not embrace religion as well as other things.
His gropings were "not appropriate". Not dirty, not disgraceful, surely not sinful, wrong or criminal. Just not appropriate.
And he answered questions "no American citizen would ever want to
answer". With the combined slurs that a) non-Americans would be
happy to answer these questions, and b) he's an ordinary man in the
street. Surrounded by secret service agents, with the nuclear
football that could wipe out the entire planet before the top of
the hour to hand.
Am I the only one who thinks they'll have to drag him bodily out
of office kicking and screaming and hanging onto the furniture?
We know he's a liar and a cheat. The questions are now:
1) Did he commit perjury in the Paula Jones case - under the
definition of "sexual relations" there, that boils down to did he
and Monica umm?
2) Did he cause other people to commit perjury?
If not, he stays. If he did, then He Has To Go. At this point in
time, I think it's only fair to give Bill the benefit of the doubt,
and say he's innocent unless we hear otherwise. There is, of
course, one further point:
3) Does all this make him unfit to hold the President's office?
The next American Presidential election will take place on November 7, 2000. Mid-term elections are held this November 3.
Codsall: sunny & 23 * radio show held till I'm better
keeper of brian's wonky calendar * Cantona beats Cantona
Good news for the St John's Connexion, as the lost city of Atlantis stays resolutely beneath the waves, and volcanoes in the Atlantic stubbornly refuse to erupt. Nadine McNamara claims a 99% success rate. Is that 99% correct..?
Now, Angela asked Sara
how on earth did you land in England?
And Sara told her story. Now, I'm briefly going to pretend to be Mr
Lisa Forrest, and give the smart-Chandler answer. She landed at
Heathrow airport on a flight from the USA.
Still being Chandler Forrest on Any Questions, Deca asks
how do you correctly quote dialogue from a film?
Write down exactly what you hear, and do say which flick it's from.
Now, a day or two ago Mark remarked that he's grotesquely self- critical of just about everything he does. I must be the 93rd person on the list to concur with that. Even though on my next weaver.radio broadcast (available on a real audio player near you tomorrow) you'll be able to hear me doing my best Fluff Freeman / Mark Goodiebags impression. I think my voice sounds weak and whiney, and my presentation is crap. Someone, tell me I'm wrong.
And on to Sara's web design
On the top is my banner, on the left side are links to my other
pages, and in the middle is just well...stuff.
Hmm. You want more room? Put the banner at the bottom: even if its
the same size, it'll feel the main frame has more space. And perhaps
use a map based around one large graphic rather than individual
links. Yeah, image maps are tricky, but it's a one-time thing.
Sara may not have written it, but she forwarded it to the list and
so takes responsibility for it. We're going to hear 30 quotes from a
political campaigning organisation wishing to forward their aims. Do
please allow me to play Devil's Advocate a little, putting forward
counter-arguments - sometimes with the intention that you'll accept
them, but more often that they'll help you think about the issues.
"All human beings are born free and equal in dignity and rights"
The age of consent for gay men is 2 years higher than it is for
consenting heteros.
A black man coming home from the pub, drunk but peaceful, will
encounter police harrassment, whereas a white middle class girl can
lie screaming in the road and they won't bother her.
You have the same rights as everyone else in the world, because you
are a human being. These rights are inalienable - they cannot be
taken away from you. Every individual, no matter who they are or
where they live, should be treated with dignity.
So what is the concurrent responsibility to go with that right?
Because every right is dependent on a responsibility, otherwise that
right is meaningless. As I see it, the responsibility is to act in a
manner that gives these basic human rights and respects to all other
people. And no matter what, they're entitled to be not shot at,
enslaved, mutilated or otherwise abused.
Ah, this is true but it's such of a red herring. It is not the
people that are being treated differently, but the acts they
choose to perform. At a biological level, the acts are fundamentally
different. As the items in this declaration are meant to be universal,
they must not impinge on moral judgements, as this would break their
universality. So, the moral judgement falls slap outside the scope
of this article.
Based, I note, on a random sample of one and stereotypical behaviour.
Neither of which are firm grounds on which to hold people liable.
Angela
The air in Detroit tonight smells like someone is freebasing damp
radioactive squirrels.
The air in Codsall tonight smells of moist soil and settling dew.
Jenn
Don't get me wrong, I'm looking forward to all this starting a new
life stuff, but its all so hard. I worked so hard for this life,
and though I know I'm not giving it up, I am changing irrevocably...
One door closes, another one opens. Be brave, be clever, and above
all be yourself. Thinking of you in your new home (psst... where is
said new home?)
Angela starts
a "My Favorite How Many" joke list?
Well, this isn't so much a joke per se as something amusing.
How many copies of Windows 98 do you have to fire up to be sure of
getting the correct date tomorrow?
Surprisingly, the answer is five. About 20% of the UK versions of
Bill Gates' new O$ come with a bug that doesn't allow them to move
from one day to the next. Instead, time travels backwards for them.
It's probably the result of a bit of code put in by someone who
really doesn't like "Torn", and thinks the quickest way to stop
hearing it is to go back in time to before it was ever recorded. And
they're probably right...
Sara requests
(Please vote after Noon Eastern Time each day..thanks!!)
Which is 13:30 NFT, 16h UTC, (oh, you know the drill). But can those
of us in the Far East always vote before 5 o'clock (or whatever)?
So, with all this talk of Reese's (thanks, Jill), I popped into Woolies yesterday (cheers, Sara) to find some of these delicacies and evaluate them for myself. Only, the assistants in there were somewhat less help than a passing chocolate teapot, and didn't have a clue about what I was talking about. This is nothing unusual, I might add, but didn't really help me out much.
Jennifer wonders
Is it REALLY better to have loved and lost than to have never loved
at all??
One the one hand, yes; on the other, no. It's your own call.
Personally, I'm leaning towards the latter camp right now, but ask me
in a day or two and my answer will probably be different.
Mark
I can only remember four of the characters... Bod, Farmer Barleymow,
Aunt Flo and the conductor of the Frog Orchestra... my memory fails
me... I am not worthy
Hmm, Mark wonders whether to have a chocolate or
straaaawberry milkshake.... brb I need to consult with the Frog
Orchestra!
And the result was..? Strawberry, if I have anything to do with it.
One of the advantages of having crap shops in Wolverhampton is that
they sometimes sell off things they shouldn't. I got my copy of Dario
G's album two weeks before the release date, just by waltzing into a
store and picking it up off the display. And I got a Bod video, which
reminds me that you forgot Frank the Postman and PC Copper.
So, to a well-known movie emporium to see "Lost in Space". Well, I figure that if it's a choice between spending all afternoon talking with the aunt and uncle, or taking their offspring to the flicks, there's no choice. And given the small range of good movies that a 9-year-old is allowed to see, the Joey an' Claudia flick won the day. And a rather good flick it is, although utterly predictable in a "you know Lacey's going to get, like, zip screen time, and there's no plot, but it's better than the world's most boring relatives" way. No, that's unfair. I'd watch it when it comes to tv. And it's more interesting than dull relatives.
William G Stewart is the funniest impression of a fascist dictator on British tv screens at present. Discuss. (This is your cue, Mark, shim, Lisa, Sara..?)
And after the break, the three remaining viewpoints will fight it out over the last 40 questions.
Codsall: cloudy & 19 * icq 14441391 * ... and we're asked to bat
keeper of half-empty crimson glow bottle
Bad news for the entire St John's Connexion, if Nadine McNamara is to be trusted. She's a psychic in Pictou, Nova Scotia, and she's predicted that volcanoes will erupt in the Atlantic and in the Bermuda Triangle, causing colliding tsunami (tsunamis? Is there a seismologist who can put me right..?) which won't be helped by the rising of the lost continent of Atlantis. Oh, and all this is due to happen this coming Saturday, the 15th.
A seismologist writes: Don't be daft, McNamara. There are few plate stresses in the North Atlantic. They're mainly concentrated in California, and on the Med. Oh, and it's tsunami.
The Proof Is In The Pudding! It's another outbreak of Olde Englysh; in this case "proof" means "test". The lord's chef would "prove" the pudding (which could easily be a pie) by eating it, in order to show that it wasn't poisoned and was well cooked.
Angela speaks of
Officer Ball
Hang on a moment, I thought it was Officer Dibble and Benny
the Ball. Or, in this case, I suppose Kenny the Ball.
And, apparently,
There's NO wrong way to eat a Reeses
Call me Johnny Foreigner, but I have no idea what one of these
Reeses is, still less where to put the apostrophe. Would someone
care to enlighten?
Bronwyn remembers...
i hate it that other people bully, chastise or pressure each
other in regards to this.
MSCL Is SO Crappy Today BECAUSE:
i personally don't believe that you have to wait til marriage or
even love if you don't want to. but what matters is what *you*
want.
I'm only going to disagree with half of the above, and it's the
first half. So far as I'm concerned, love is vital; some form of
public committment is also required. Don't expect to get me into
bed and keep it quiet. I don't work that way, coz it doesn't make
me happy.
Indeed, this is a significantly Bad Thing.
The show's not on.
Angela on veggie burgers. British veggies - heck, all Brits - may wish to try McDougal's veggie burgers, assuming they don't have something against the store. They're not spicy, and do have a very agreeable dressing.
Andi
send me $79.98 per episode, i'll send you a tape with the
episodes you want
Andi, you cheapskate! Shurely you mean $79.98 per quarter
episode, plus surtax, generalsalestax, valueaddedtax, incometax,
tintax and capitalgainstax.
Anna mentioned
Aunt Flo
And there I was, thinking that this was going to turn into a
discussion of that classic kids' tv show, "Bod". Sadly not. Not
even a mention of the yellow-dressed one. Nor even Farmer
Barleymow. ):
Kris's brief commentary on the world of kick boxing:
dong quai kicks ass
This week's Place To Visit: Pacific Harbor. The place to go for people interested in the North West USA, especially the Washington sea-board. You know, the place where there are masses and masses of punctuation forests. Little yellow quotation marks hanging off their vines. Colons and commas, and their odd offspring, the semicolon. Dashes - they actually grow vertically, you know, and it's a whole industry just getting them to lie flat. The common full stop. And, of course, the Berg family's massive plantation of exclamation marks. No wonder Skeie!!!! uses so many. She gets them free!
Chelle
i'm on central daylight savings time
90 minutes ahead of South Park, 150 behind Newfoundland. See my
archives for the rest of the equivalances.
Britt points out that FIENDS is doomed, as Buffy would come along and slay everyone. No, that's not quite true. Priestess Cory would come along and slay everyone with her bouncing orange ball.
Lauren recalls the time
when everyone (the girls) used to have those huge button pictures
of them (mostly Joe) on their desks in Mr. Hanson's class.
Nowadays, I suppose all the girls would have these huge buttons of
Taylor on their desks in Mr Newkidontheblock's class. Plus ca
change...
Lixz
At CTY I went to the BEST activity! It was billed as NKOTB
Apprciation...but it turned out to be NKOTB **and** Vanilla Ice!
We listened to music and colored in pictures of the singers while
sitting on NKOTB sheets (after we'd admired one RA's Vanialla Ice
swimsuit, of course) and then we all did the Right Stuff dance...
so much fun!!
Well, yes, but this is meant to be the Centre for Talented Youth.
Rather than the Centre for Appreciation of Semi-Talented Youths Of
Ten Years Ago.
Gee, you know you're getting old when people start reminiscing about the bands you didn't care much for. Which means, I guess, I'm fine till people get nostalgic for Oasis.
Angela asks
England! Please wave hi to my darling friend who lives in Hythe!
Hello, Angela's friend in Hythe. For Sara's benefit, Hythe is one
of the small ports on the Kent coast, right opposite France. It's
a real old town, one of the Cinque Ports, and rather nice.
Talk of the devil... Sara
I LOVE the word petrol
I really don't like the word LOO
Me neither. "Toilet" sounds far nicer. Or "Little Scientist's
Room" (or whatever's appropriate). But loo, yuck. There are Public
Loos, and there are Conveniences. Public loos smell.
Yes, it does have a nicer ring than "gas". Of course, petroleum is
too much of a mouthful for anyone to say... Bet you don't love the
prices, though. It's about 65p per litre here: over in Fredricton
NB, it's 60 cents (25p).
Lauren again
Do I care what anyone else thinks? Not really.
Bully for you! Sounds like you've got a bit of a keeper there...
And I'll darken your mailboxes again Sunday.
Brum: showers & 20 * keeper of a half-empty bottle of crimson glow
icq 14441391 * and of brian's next month calendar * rockette!
And welcome to you. Especially if you have a large flask of iced tea to send over.
Candy, welcome aboard. I referred just last week to Mae being the only sensible poster from South East Asia. Glad to find there's another one out there.
Christina: discussing the rights and wrongs of an individual situation isn't going to help in the long run. On a more general level, I'm certain that there will be something that makes your parents treat you as an independent adult. It may not be the best move to force that moment, as that would be counterproductive. And do remember that we think a lot of you.
Though this passage deserves comment
She said last night "well if you are going to get physical i
want you on the pill"
we left and went to the mall and i bought some hair mascara
my faith and morals go beyond my hormones.
[huge applause] [hysterical cheers] [massive clapping]
Well said, ma'am.
The pill is a good contraceptive. The word "No" is a far more
effective one.
Purple glitter is the cure to all known ills (A. Cutler,
12/28/97). Especially pointing out to other guys that the
wearer Is Taken.
Deca
This mail was written in a state of complete soberness.
A grammarian writes: Deca, do you not remember Tanita Tikaram's
brief brush with fame 10 years ago? Just about the only hit she
ever had? Good old "Twist in my Sobriety". That is an example
of an excellent English word to describe not being drunk. I
wrote this mail in a state of total sobriety.
Hic.
Absholutely.
Also happening: Channel 5's fab "Pitch, Hit & Run" continues
its tour, this week visiting "Sunny Birmingham" - presenter
Eddie... Yes, Sara, this has been the British summer. It's all
over soon (not soon enough, if you ask me); with the bizarre
weather we've been having these last few years, the next summer
will be 5-10 January next year. Book your suncream for then...
And the "Bob and Carol and Ted and Alice" answer from two weeks
ago:
Bob: to move in small up and down movements.
Carol: a celebratory song.
Ted: to spread, especially of manure. (Common in 15th cent.
English)
Alice: to hit weakly. (Golfing slang)
Ashley on "Ever After"
it didn't beat out R+J on my list
I don't know, I seem to be going through a bit of an R+J kick
at the moment. "Front Row" tonight was discussing the new
Avengers movie, and pointing out that just about every movie of
the past few years started big and then fell quickly. The only
exceptions I could think of were "Four Weddings", "The Full
Monty" and "Romeo + Juliet".
And I was a bit bored last week, and ran "Claire Danes" through SLATE's compost. She's been mentioned four times; briefly in connection with Les Mis and the Rainmaker, as one of Leo's exs, and with R+J - with a link to an AVI of the first meeting from the film.
Now, I recognised a lot of names in an offlist mail from Kristi. I'm sure she won't mind my pointing out that it was a hoax purporting to be an offer from Bill the Bubble Guy Gates to give every recipient of the mail $1000 and a copy of Windoze 98. What I find more interesting is the places this mail has been. In reverse chronological order, I spot Peterborough, Ontario. New York. Boston, Mass. Aloha, Oregon. Then, rather bizarrely, an early report from San Fransisco, and the ultimate trace back to the head offices of The Globe And Mail, that well known national Canadian paper. The self-same one that's trying to fight off competition from Conrad Black's forthcoming national. If this is their tactic, I'm pushing my loonie behind the Blackster.
And look who's back!
Elizabeth Angellla-Brem Skeie-Leih Sparkle-Crayola Innes
Wrigley-Field
Little Miss Name's Too Long To Fit Onto One Line! Yay!!
Catchalater...
Brum: hot, sun & 26 * England In Test Series Win Shock!
icq: 14441391 * Rockette! * Dipsy of #1 place
Even by my standards, this is a mad post. Don't say you weren't warned. Later: costly ISPs, Sarah McLachlan, Private Eye and bad translations. But first, a quick word from the news desk.
In Washington, leaders are debating the future of the clear world. In Birmingham, NATO ministers are gathering to talk about protecting Western Europe from revolutionary flying beetles. But wait! They've stopped debating that, and are talking on other matters
Angela's joke.
A joke: What's cold, white, and cowardly?
A: Chicken salad
The combined brains of Oxford, Cambridge and London Universities
are hard at work, decoding that joke for the groups in Washington
and Sunny Birmingham.
While they're working out that, I'll discuss other matters.
Nichole points out
some people do not live in the US [gasp][shock]
This is true. Some of us acknowledge that there are Other Nations
than the US. A few of us freaks actually prefer these foreign
countries.
and they have to pay ALL calls to their ISP and/or for indivudual
emails (or by size of things they d/l in general) no matter what
server they use.
Indeed. The standard in the UK is: either a flat fee of around 20
pounds per month or 5 pounds for 10 hours plus 1 pound for each
extra hour. (1 pound is roughly $1.60.) Plus telecoms charges
of 1p per minute at weekends, up to 2p per min during the day.
Now, 10 5K mails at a 28800 modem will take around 20 seconds to download. That would cost around 2p.
This same argument is the reason why I really dislike spam mails. They are a direct cost-shift to the consumer. Me.
Now, back at the Birmingham NATO conference, the Spanish delegate
is addressing the conference. Translations from the resident
translator, K Stone.
i own very much ranches with many acres. I have the best water, I
would like your permission to marry your daughter Mr. Severino My
teeth are real, I have a nice car, but I do wear contacts.
More from them later.
Linette begs the question
The address we write to is owned by the admis. The list is not.
So, who does own the list?
In Salzburg, the EU summit debates what "the truth" is. According to the official communique, just being passed to me, The Truth is one of about 30 small calcium deposits found in the mouth.
Priestess Cory, the Laa-Laa of the Desert, sparks yet another
round of international heads of state meeting
Food or Bondage?
Depends who with. Oh, you mean what food's to be used. Hmm, well,
there are uses for ice cubes, and grapes, and tight dresses...
Deca gives me credit for
Shome mishtake shurely (obIain)
In fairness, this is one of my most blatant steals from the
fortnightly satire magazine "Private Eye". British readers are
cordially invited to part with 1 Pound for a copy. Foreign readers
are cordially invited to journey to Birmingham and purchase a copy
of their very own. And if they don't tell me they're coming, they
won't have to meet me. An excellent result for everyone.
Quickly back to the conferences. In Birmingham, a response from the Turkish delegate:
"Never in the course of human history has so much been owed by so many to so few. Will someone please vote for us at next Eurosong!"Back at the EU HOG, they're debating whose faces should appear on the Euro coins. A flushing toilet is the favourite motif, for some odd reason. And in Washington, events have been side-tracked by a suggestion that they're dealing with a sweet transvestite from Arkansas.
Sara
police do crap for anyone...I don't know about the police around
here
Then do you mind not passing such a slamming judgement on them?
Thanks.
Angela
You may not believe in God, but He believes in you!
ELI, can we have a definitive ruling on this please? Oh, this
reminds me; new Kenickie single out on Monday. Promise, folks.
And the album on or around the 24th.
Now, Americans are probably aware of the annoying habit of releasing songs to radio years before they're out as a single. Indeed, such classics as "Torn" and "Iris" are only available on albums or as imports. Something similar is happening in the UK. Sarah McLachlan's "Adia" will be the lead-off single for her "Surfacing" album - set for an October 12 release. The single will come out September 21, but is already on the BRMB and Crapital playlists. Of course, this comes some time after it started getting played on Radio 2, but that's life...
Touching on the design of my web page, Nichole muses about
geocities in general
Those popup console ad things just annoy me to death, and lately
when I go there I soemtimes get 2 or 3 of those things!
Interesting. They bug me too, but I've never had more than one
window spawn on me. And you won't get them on (many of) my pages,
as the built-in commercial at the very foot obviates them.
and then now that new umm "watermark" thing that bounces down the
page as you scroll... just YUCK, I just want to shoot that thing
or something
So do I, mate. It's rotten design, using java, a language that
just isn't up to the job they want it to do. It's also a graphic,
and that bugs little old graphics-off me.
Back in Birmingham, this coming from German sources.
"Ich bin ein Hoistfeller".These reports are as yet unconfirmed, but it appears the delegation is, indeed, OK, and will be visiting the Pallisaides next Wednesday before taking scones with butter for tea.
Jennifer Jacobs, yes, you, wonders
You talkin to ME?
Yes indeed. I quite deliberately misintepreted your request for 10
copies of the same URL to be posted again, and started a set of
10 different URLs. Number two in this series comes late next
week.
The EU meeting in Salzburg has just broken up; everyone is blaming the Swedes, apparently. In fact, further details are being handed to me even as I type and the meeting has ended early after all the leaders went down with food poisoning, contracted from a rotting swede (the vegetable) at last night's banquet.
Over in Washington, the meeting has also ended, and this is the result. "The average home Internet user wastes just over nine minutes per day, or 55 hours per year, waiting for web pages to load," says the official statement. Reaction has been swift; "It's depressing" says Ira Secret-Magazine-Reeder. "It's criminal," claims Joe Netscrape. "Still a darn sight quicker than waiting for Windoze 98 to install," claims Bill Gates. Of course, this is yet another persuasive argument for not reading list mail on the web but joining the list - it saves you the bother of loading the pages.
And in Birmingham, they've got the joke. Chicken salad.
More madness next time.
Codsall: sunny & 29 ): * jodiesque rockette * ATL 845 SF 0
On weaver.page: girl groups, july's hits, radio and di laine goss
So, yes, well. Later: customs stamps, what half a gigabyte is, and a brief incursion from Factville. But first..
Given that no-one's said they'll be in London tomorrow, neither will I. Anyone travelling: don't bother, stay home instead.
Ivy (welcome, welcome...)
i am soooo not like sounding to be evil, rude, or whatever
That's an excellent start.
like why cant you, when you send e-mails, put something like [mscl]
Good question. Let me give my reply. Because it's not something that
we people should need to do. It should be done on the list computer.
If it can be bothered, which I don't think it can.
Also, some e-mail programs only allow a relatively short (like, 50
character) subject line. To waste 14% of that with something of
minimal use doesn't strike me as a good idea.
i dont know like what e-mails to open like is it from so-called
mailing list or just some junk mail
May I make a suggestion? That you use filters to sort your mail when
it arrives. Mail sent to "[email protected]" can go into one
folder, mail sent to you directly into another. Would some kind AOL
member care to give more exact instructions?
So HI im new and really annoying aint i?
No, not at all. Welcome aboard. We don't bite (first).
Angela
Another one- it's almost impossible to keep up with who is referring
to who or what.
Careful use of selective, meaningful quotes and accurate attribution
is always useful, folks. Well, I do my best...
I'm not happy with digest 469. Twelve messages from our friend using a free mail account in 44-9'er territory [that's San Fransisco, for those just joining us; renamed following their football side's loss to the KC Chiefs last Dec 1, by the stonking score of (er) 44-9.] And two from me. One from Sara rather lifted the quality, thankfully.
Dealing only with the facts. MDeason
I have ony used this email, to post to this list.
This is patently false. It has also been used to post to lists held
at dreamworld.org. It also, rather interestingly, crops up in a
search at a mountain biking page held at Stanford Uni.
But now I am getting spammed. Why?? I'll tell you why. It's because
some web sniffer has found the page on mountain biking and taken the
address from there.
Sara
I do think that going over every little thing, and trying to reduce
is down is. I mean...I *want* the bubble envelope, I want the best
of everything, so that nothing breaks on the way.
You seem to forget about Customs Stamps. Vicious little things, they
are. Just when you think you've packed something totally securely,
along comes an annoying bloke With A Big Hammer and whacks it down
on your package. Result: one cracked CD case. Bummer! And, yes, I
have the cracked case to prove it.
Brooks wonders
I don't know what makes a list an offical My So-Called Life list. Is
it something handed down from on high? Like some sort of divine
right of lists?
For my reading, an "official" list would have to be sanctioned, if
not organised, by the show's makers, Bedford Falls. I'm not aware of
any such blessing on any list, so there is no official list.
ALI comes along and throws her two pennies into the fire of the CD-
ROM thing. At least she owns up to writing, this time...
Its personal. Thats all there is to it.
Erm, no it's not. It's me objecting to someone trying to make money
off the back of my posts, just hours after I finally get someone
else to stop doing that same thing.
Iain and I used to be engaged.
In the same way Bill Clinton used to be President of the USA...
don't think that he has the best feelings towards derrick.
Well, if he tries to profit from my work, that is not going to
endear him to me. The other matters she mentioned are red herrings. I
don't intend to comment on them further, in order a) not to bore the
pants off the whole of the list and b) not to prejudice any court
proceedings that may yet arise out of this case.
he uses out-of-date info, from the evening telegram
That was to establish that Derrick was making a profit from these
CDs. As this is something he's confirmed to the list, the source of
my cost breakdown becomes another total red herring.
If you're listening to all the fuss, please realize that theres
personal feelings thrown in there
This is a gross misrepresentation of the situation.
the only people who are seriously fighting this are people who
personally don't like derrick.
This isn't personal. This is business. Whether the erstwhile listies
care to admit it or not.
So, I guess that if you like all things MSCL, you won't let this bloke line his pockets from your hard work.
And that's all I have to say about that.
From the ridiculous back to the sublime. Kris
Oh, shameless as I am, Im going to get excited about being mentioned
in Iians post!
Well, if I knew who that poster was, I might suggest you calm down.
Thankfully, it's not one of mine. Here's proof...
HA! I forgot to tell you Iian, I went to your web page and some
pictures of you....Hubba Hubba & Cutie Patootie come to mind!! :)
See? Can't be me. Not in the slightest. Me, handsome? [quiet
titter] [stifled chortle] [bursts out laughing loud]
Which reminds me. In honour of a goof on Radio Netherlands some years back, I've refered to the frequencies of Gigahertz - and latterly Gigabytes - as Giggle-hertz or -bytes. It's taken me that long to work out what half a Gigglebyte would be.
A Sniggerbyte.
Linette
I live in America. This should be a democracy.
Yes, it should. Yet America is not a democracy. Not when less than
50% of the people can be bothered to elect their own national leader.
Kris remembers musing
"You need a licence to drive and a licences to fish, but they are
letting me walk out of this hospital without a licence to be a
parent and I am absolutly CLUELESS as to what to do with this child"
Thank Heaven that it seems to come naturally. I had the changing of
the diaper, the making of the bottle, and cooing thing down real
well but as for the whole being a parent thing....nadda clue.
And then The People wonder how come there are so many maladjusted
kids around. Kris had doubts, but (AFAIK) has proven a perfectly good
parent. Reading between the lines, Angela was also a bag of nerves,
but proved perfectly competent at the job. Listeners to the BBC's
daily documentary "The Archers" will know that hippie wild-child Kate
Aldrige has recently had Baby, and won the affections of most of the
village with her sensible handling of her child. (Anyone who wants to
discuss Roy's rights and wrongs can mail me off list.)
Personally, I have absolutely no confidence in my ability to parent to the exacting standards I expect of others, and do not intend to drop sprogs of my own. Neither can I express much confidence in those prospective parents who claim that they know what's facing them, and they'll be able to handle it themselves. They won't, and their children will be the ones that will annoy the hell out of people like me. No, I'm better off out of all this reproductive malarkey.
Oh, and there's this little matter, neatly nutshelled by Sara. Though
she really may not like the imagery in this section.
Being pregnant, for me, is not a lot of fun.
The Victorian doctors were right. Being pregnant is a ten month long
illness. The body is infected by a fast-growing tumour, and acts as
though it's first trying to fight it, and latterly to live with it,
at the expense of short-term memory and frequent trips to the loo.
Again, why anyone would volunteer for this is totally beyond me.
Now, Jennifer looks for 10 good URLs. I'll open the bidding with westmidlands.com, for news and information that's local to me. Read the Depress and Snore, Wolverhampton's local paper. Watch the web site of 107.7 The Wolf, the only local station in town, and the one that's tripled its audience in the last quarter. And, er, do other stuff as well.
Hmm. My favourite beverage. On a hot day like today, iced tea would be nice. Otherwise, nice, strong, flavoured coffee.
Catch you on Sunday, I guess.
Brum: sunny & 26 (TWENTY-SIX) * Hope Springs Eternal!
Well, it now transpires that Eli won't be in London for Saturday. If anyone wants to meet me there, please let me know. Otherwise I'll just stay home and watch the cricket in the garden. Like I did six months ago.
Later, my finale on the archives stuff, plus dating young girls, evening meals, Hallowe'en and cool radio shows. But first,
Shana enquires
what do you all expect/want from the list?
Remember, this response is Not For Discussion. I will not take
kindly to discussion or debate arising from it.
I've been around these parts for 34 months now. From half way through the first UK run of MSCL. From the times when I'd be transported across the Atlantic, into Three Rivers with Angela, Brian, Jordan, Rayanne, and the rest. This list understood what this journey was about, in a way (almost) no-one else around me did. It's been company through some really tough times, and celebrated some of my great ones.
There are Real Friends here. People I care about, even if I've not met them. Especially if I've not met them.
It's been a place I can trust my deepest thoughts, worst fears, and most sunny moments to. And it's a place where I can vent such feelings freely, without anyone daring to snigger to my face.
It's a place that I can trust, with people I can trust.
Events over the past six months or so have made me retreat a long way back into my shell. I somehow don't feel safe posting those intimate confessions any more. The protracted spats with the resident of 44-9'er territory have left their mark. People don't trust each other any more.
For me, that trust is paramount. I'm not going to stand by and watch others abuse it. Coz if I don't stand up for my prime motivation, who is? Little matters - like the archives - become symptomatic of the wider problem. There are elements here I don't trust. And when there's an obvious use of a false identity by someone I've trusted more than (probably) any other single listie, that hurts a lot.
Observant people may have noticed that I've hardly talked about my non-resident fiancee in the past few months. Really observant people will remember my asking for people to write me off-list back in May - and thanks to ~Laura, Jenn, Bron, Kris and Nichole for lending an ear back then. But I shouldn't have to do that. I'd like to be able to spill my innermost thoughts to you, without worrying that they'll be held against me.
That's what I want from the list. You can comment on the rest.
I just can't resist going back to WP88. Even though she's unsubbed.
Here Blank Cd's are 4$.
Shop around. You can get them for $1.50 - well, you could over
Christmas. [Evening Telegram, 12/27/97, page B4]
Postage to the rest of to the country is around 3$ and to other
countries is about 5$ or so.
Is there a Canyuck to back this up?
I'm not interested in the archives - who'd wanna read what people I
don't know are saying?
Well, you could always read what you posted yourself. But you know
how that would all turn out. And you read most of these posts first
time around.
but there could be cool stuff on there.
And you should know!
Another correspondent writes
Derrick - who is just trying to the list a favour..
Start by not posting the same article four times, and not having
the grace to apologise for doing so.
Scott makes a reasonable economic argument, but shoots himself in
the foot
This is assuming he lives in the US.
Nope. Derrick lives in Canada. Please re-work your argument. But CDs
at $1 a throw?! They're GBP 1.50 each here, even at trade prices.
Kori
still can't believe that my mom left the car, but not the KEY!!!!
She better not have done that on purpose!!
How the blazes can anyone be quite so dim to do that? I mean, it's
just as bad as taking the keys, but forgetting to bring the car
along.
Roman is worried about the age gap between one of his friends and her lover. She's 13, he's 26. That is, like, beyond reasonable. Hey, I got worried about being accused of baby snatching for dating someone 3 and a half years my junior, when that was about 15% of my age. Personally, at 25 in a few months, I really couldn't date someone younger than 18. Even if I were in the market, which I'm not. But, to return to the original point, it's beyond acceptable.
Lauren
Next up is Arnold Swartzeneggar & Kate Winslet as an on-screen
couple. He requested she lose 10 pounds for the role. How rude!
And we request that he also makes some small bodily sacrifices for
this role. Just a brief cut, here, here, and slice through to here.
Sara, on Paterson-the-archive-proprietor
Twelve dollars (or whatever..that is the price, isn't it)
doing something on your own doesn't necessarily mean that its bad.
Oh, totally agreed. However, it's my understanding that the two
contacts needed to register a .com domain should (not must, but
should) be different people. If nothing else, it vastly increases
the chance of someone picking up a message within a day.
Just because there may be a sight saying about this person
This is Paterson's own site. Like, his own words.
so if I wanted to have an archive of my posts, and wanted to put
them up on my page..including this message, would that be a
problem for you?
Not in the slightest. You see, what you're doing is taking and using
my posts in the way I intend them to be used. To debate, to think
about, to chew over. I don't send them for people to make money from.
Try 15 US dollars, not 12 loonies.
I also hope that some of the people on this list stop being so
petty about all this.
If objecting to someone breaking the basic tenets of my contract
with the list is being petty, then I'm being petty. I don't think it
is at all petty. Heck, I'm only making this much noise about it
because it is important to me.
And let me set one thing straight.
Iain, you offered to copy the cd for the people over here
On a point of fact, I have made no such offer. I do not have the CD
to which Ms Hoeck refers. I do not have access to CD duplication
equipment. Any requests for CDs to be copied will be rejected for
the reasons outlined above. I call on Sara to correct her statement.
Derrick has unsubbed from the list, for anyone that cares. I wonder
why
I would comment on this, but Sara added a qualifier that makes any
comment from me pointless.
Kori
Unfortunately, we here in Hilo don't have an alternative station.
Why not take one of mine? Point thy browser at OZ FM, and
listen to their Real Audio. Now, that's professional radio. Not
like the sort that people just throw together in their front rooms
and shovel onto the internet regardless of quality.
There's a link to one such pile of sh*te.
Mae quotes me
>figured that there's very little sense written from South East
Asia.
I was just wondering what you meant by this...
That SE Asia in general, and Hong Kong, Malaysia and Singapore seem
to turn out spam, and spam only. Thankfully, Mae is an exception.
Sadly, she's the only one I know of.
Angie quotes some Des'ree. It's very interesting that the piece she quoted fits exactly into "Life". Or "You Gotta Be". Or any of her other hits. Spooky!
Laura
since Halloween is on a Saturday, I'm having an all day (and night)
bash!
Don't forget the most important part: wish me happy birthday on the
stroke of midnight. Always added an extra zip to Hallowe'en parties.
Angela enquires
is Michael's Jackson's nose *really* made out of Silly Putty
what everyone *else* was dining on tonight
should Barbie be the new Spice Girl,
No. I'd sooner have Warrior Princess Spice. But Four Spice is
preferable.
No. You're thinking of his cheekbones. His nose is made of
plasticine.
Monday night was a grilled cauliflower, cheese and other
unidentified vegetables in a breadcrumb coating, and rice an' peas.
For two. When it was just me eating them. Oh, and a peach yoghurt.
Shana (Sun)
If Rickie had be 'straight', do you think he and Delia would have
started dating after that school dance?
No. He'd never have had the bottle to do it.
Ryan D asks
the question MUST BE ANSWERED!
Ryan, We Know Where You Live. Well, at least down to the nearest
planet. And probably the continent. It's a long door-to-door search
after that. And you'd probably be out when we called. Let me put
that a little more accurately:
Ryan, We Have No Clue Where You Live And Wouldn't Waste Our Time Trying To Trace You, Even If We Wanted To Come Round In The Middle Of The Night And Stuff A Bat Up Your Night Shirt (And We're Not Talking Baseball Either). Oh, and welcome to the list. Just don't ask that question again.
See you all, soon.
Brum: sunny & 21 * Jodie of another lawn * Just, like, be careful
Howdy, pardners. These things need to be said. Given that the admin(s) have taken down the archives, there is no need for me to fire up another list. I will not be sending out subscription details for it, as it no longer exists.
Elaine
I hate Kate Winslet (see Lisa Bing's sister's interview of her in
Christmas Vogue for some of the reasons why. I.e., she's a tit)
Lisa's sister speaks highly of you, as well. Oh, sorry, you're
calling Kinked Eyebrows a tit...
Well, it appears that over on another list, they're trying to play Desert Island Discs, and making a bit of a mess of it. My entries, and not a word from you, Ms Lawley, are:
Shana Sun, [hugs] and some more.
Nichole
For people in the US... you're more likely to be in those web
databases. They get the names from the phone books.. unless you
have an unlisted number, it's in there.
Isn't that, like, breach of copyright. Even though some Americans
seem to take a very liberal attitude to copyrighted matters. But,
no, the phone company probably sells them on.
unless you get an unlisted number that year (which costs money and
can be annoying to those trying to call you ;-)
Sssh! Don't let British Telecom catch you saying that. Otherwise
they might start charging for taking numbers out of the phone
book. And that would never do.
Now, spam mails. Check out the Campaign for the Abolition of Unsolicited Commercial Email for moral and practical support. My experience on the front line has been mixed: I've helped close six abused hotmail accounts, had a very nice apology from a misguided cellphone company in Bolton, and figured that there's very little sense written from South East Asia. It's often hard work for nothing more than the satisfaction of a job properly done, and I don't recommend it to anyone who has to pay per minute for their connection.
In general, I don't recommend replying directly to the spammer, as that proves your address is real. Try [email protected], or [email protected] - one or t'other should be staffed. If anyone wants to know more on the topic, mail me (once, please!) off list.
Rachel wrote a post that just had to grab my attention. Heck, with
the subject
baseball and weird people
how could I miss it?
Jennifer
Perhaps we should form a society that will only let in members
that either refuse to see Titanic, or HAVE seen Titanic and wish
they hadn't. So far, it looks as though Eric, Elaine, Iain, Shobi,
and myself are proud members. Yep, I've already signed you guys
up.
Thanks, thanks. I'll accept membership, and not rag on the movie at
all.
I mean it.
Now, D-anon definately wrote
I tink it wuz I wot sent-in dat dere ting.
Whoops, so it was. My mistake. We apologise for the inconvenience
caused. One of the wonderful things about keeping one's own archive
is that I can fix these little errors, just as they do in Hansard.
Though while I just clear up this misattrubition, Toy Bair uses the
official record of Parliamentary business to rewrite his whole
policy.
Derrick (welcome back ... I think) is selling a CD-ROM. It features
Pictures, Video Clips, Sound Files, Info
MSCL list digests from the begining to August 1997.
Which includes some of my copyrighted work. Here's the deal.
Either you cut me in on the profits from your little scam, or you
send me one of these for free. Like, nought cents. Oh, or you take
my posts out of your archive, but it's probably too late for that.
My posts are not, and never will be available for commercial
exploitation without my permission by anyone.
And, some Bad Economics.
It'll be selling them postage paid for $12.
Twelve Canadian Dollars. Which, at Thursday's midmarket London
closing rates, is (blinkin' Ada!) GBP 4.86
If you live in the US it will be in US funds.
Twelve US Dollars. That's GBP 7.33
If you live outside of North America the cd will cost $15 in
US funds (due to extra postage costs)
Fifteen US Dollars. That's GBP 9.16
Now, two years ago, it cost the massive total of C$2.10 to ship a CD across the Atlantic. That's 85 new pence. Which means, dear fellow Brits, that our salesman is making a profit of almost 3.50 (or $8.50, take your pick) on the postage.
What's more, the raw CD is on sale in St John's for just $1.50. Add $2 postage, and a luxurious 50c allowance for electricity, and your CD is made for $4. Even making a decent allowance for research fees, he's still making $6 profit on each and every CD.
Quite frankly, this is an absolute rip-off. Two questions. 1) Why are you allowing him to get away with this? And 2) Why is he ripping off the very people who gave him the material he's flogging back to you?
Shana (Sun)
Time: 6pm (California)
Right, let's get these time zones sorted out once and for all,
please. 18:00 Thu in California is (18+8-1-24)=01:00 UTC which
equates to:
2pm Tahiti
4pm Hawaii
5pm Alaska
7:30 South Park
9pm Kansas
10pm New York
11pm on PEI
11:30 Newfoundland
2am Friday UK
3am CET
5:30 Iran
7:30 India
9am Perth
10:30 Darwin
11am Hobart
12 New Zealand
These times correct for Northern Hemisphere Daylight Saving Time,
and Southern Hemisphere Standard Time.
Nichole
Anyone could keep their own archvies on their own 'puter, and make
a CD thing of it if they wanted. the admins have no control over
that.
This is indubitably true, but I would expect the admins to quietly
have a word in the person's ear. Not jump up and down with the
wonderfullness of it all.
So, who is behind this escribe.com? The one reply I got back from them was signed "Scott". From the link Bronwyn provided, I find that the owner and administrative contact for escribe.com is a Scott Paterson. Now, I find it somewhat alarming for a professional, commercial domain to have just one contact.
Bronwyn's sources cite Paterson as techno-savvy enough to set up (and, I believe, abuse) spam filters, and that he has about 10 years of experience in the high-tech world.
Rather ironicly, his home page has the following as a footer "The content on this site may not be republished without permission."
Paterson lives in Menlo Park, California, and works at Be Inc, on an operating system that claims to be radically different from any other. Without translating the company's mission statement from Geek to English, I'm not entirely sure how it does this.
He runs the Saab network, plays forward for a team called "Grasshoppers" in a California state ice hockey league, talks about counting cards in blackjack and details his good and bad experiences as a consumer. Including a banner linking to spam.abuse.net.
My personal view is to give the man the benefit of the doubt, and disagree with speculation that he's trying to create his own spam list. Indeed, if anything, he seems over-protective of his own operations. However, I do believe that he is trying to sell space in the form of banner adverts, which equates to selling our posts.
I'm not going to draw any further inferences about Paterson's character or actions. You're all quite capable of doing that for yourself.
Now, someone calling herself "xenawp88" (bet it's not her real
name) writes
and all of this silly archive stuff would be over. because yeah.
it is kinda silly.
and well, i didn't read the raging egomaniac post, but i assume
its from iain. and well, that's kinda silly too,
as you see, why would anyone want to sell his posts? they're just
words, put together in a semi coherent way
i do have some issues with his adoption of newfoundland as my
great auntie is from there and thanks confederation for many
things that he can't understand as i've noticed hes not from there
he reminds me of that alfredo guy
do you know me?
since its still going on, with people obviously using it to
further their own personal vendettas against others
well, anyway.. you guys seemed pretty cool, until that rochelle/
shemmlle/whatever person decided to stir
That's shimelle, warrior princess of the plains. If you'd be so
kind. And there's a certain irony in all this...
i guess hiding from someone is not a big worry for her.
I think the honourable correspondent is pretending to Jump Straight
To Conclusions without knowing one iota of the story behind
everything.
That is your opinion. Other people may dissent from it.
Gee, thanks, that's the most constructive thing anyone's said about
me this year.
that hes worried that people would sell his posts. i found his
page, and they're all up on the internet anyway
Yes, my posts are all on my page. I elect to put them there. Daft
as it may sound, I really object to other people copying them for
their profit. If anyone's going to make money from my work, I want
it to be me.
with quotes from everyone elses posts - so hes posting other
peoples words without their permission
No, I am using their words in a way that they have implicitly
consented to by posting them to this list. If you post, you're
giving other members reasonable room to review and comment on your
posts. You will further note that I quote nothing more than I need
to illustrate my point.
if someone buys his posts, then hes doing what he says that the
maillist is doing to him.
The substantive difference is that I choose to make that archive
available. I choose not to have it duplicated, in a vastly inferior
format, on some fly-by-night server run by someone whose motives
are not the same as mine, and may well be dubious.
Again, you flatter dreadfully. Something you seem to have a real
talent for.
and instead of doing a post per thing he just puts them all in
one.
Something to do with saving the bandwidth; roll 25 messages into
one, thus reducing the header space used by 96% and the total
bandwidth by around 50%.
To address what appears to be the actual point, I have no problem
with NF being part of Canada. Indeed, it's a great move for both
sides, so long as they respect each other, which (IMO) isn't
happening.
Is there a lawyer on the list? Isn't that actionable? Dr Demeter?
Are these addressed to me? Yes. I know you. You know that I know
you.
do you know anyone on the list well enough to trust them?
Yes. If you treat people like kids, don't expect them not to act
like kids.
i don't trust anyone
That is your choice.
Erm, what vendetta am I meant to have in this? Being totally pissed
off with what I see as weak administrating? I plead guilty. Having
something personal against the admin(s)? Not on your nelly. Being
rather annoyed that a long-standing resident of this list stoops
to posing as a newbie to get their point across? That's not
personal, that's business.
And besides, I think the whole battle has now ended. So far as I'm concerned, it's now over.
Our Scott asks
2. What do you sleep in?
A bed.
5. If one MSCL character could make a cameo on Party of Five, who
would you chose and why?
Oh, let's have Brian comparing notes with Julia. Showing everyone -
especially Griffin - that she does have a life.
7. Do you believe in past lives?
8. Do you believe in reincarnation?
Yes, yes. Don't these two go together, somehow?
14. Do you believe in magic?
Yes.
15. Better to put off today what you can do tomorrow or vice
versa?
Sometimes, but not always. If it's out of the way, it's done and
dusted and there's more time for fun things.
Mae's wisdom teeth. You have my sympathies. My top pair came out when I was 19, but the bottoms are impacted and that would take time in hospital. Though they don't hurt at all, and so long as that's the case, I'm happy with them.
And with that, I'm gone. More in a day or two.
Codsall: wet & 19 * Why do we hate Billie? Because we want to!
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